Pack93z
  • Pack93z
  • Select Member Topic Starter
11 years ago
It isn't a horrible idea, but there are a couple concerns I would have with it.

1. It would favor passing oriented teams verses run oriented team a bit.

2. What would happen on a defensive penalty that was less than 15 yards but generated a first down. Defensive holding would come to mind. Would it result in a first down and retain possession? It would be just another play that we get to watch the offensive players beg for a flag. Any Flag.


What I do like about it is:

1. It eliminates probably the most ridiculous play in football.. the onside kick.

2. It will reduce the risk to the players overall with probably the most dangerous play in the game with the most high impact collisions.

Sean Gregory of TIME writes that one of the options being considered for replacing kickoffs entails giving the ball to the team that would have been kicking off at its own 30, automatically facing a fourth down and 15 yards to go. The team can then choose to punt or go for it, via fake punt or otherwise.

"PFTalk" wrote:


"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Porforis
11 years ago
Not a fan at all.

1. Why change? What reason is so important to justify making such a huge change to the way the game has been played since the beginning?
2. Nobody's going to go for it, and on the rare occasion that they will, you're replacing one trick "ridiculous play" with another.

You should be glad that NSD isn't here anymore to pull his statistics out of him bum saying that kickoffs are not particularly dangerous as compared to other plays. I guess my fear is that we can make all the changes in the world to make the game safer and safer, but at some point you need at accept that this is a rough game where people get hurt. Should we prevent people from turning themselves into missiles and launching their head into someone else's? Sure. Should we prevent people from using others' facemasks as a tackle-handle? Of course. But this isn't a minor rule change, this is a fundamental change to special teams in general. As such, there's a much higher burden to prove that this change is NEEDED, and not that it will just prevent one or two injuries a year.
Pack93z
  • Pack93z
  • Select Member Topic Starter
11 years ago
From experience.. I can tell you.. it is the heaviest hits you will take on average game in and out.

But stats to support it.


While I don’t have access to the NFL’s data , I did find this study on high school athletes, entitled “Effects of Time in Competition, Phase of Play, and Field Location on Injury Severity in High School Football” by Ellen E. Yard. Some of the lowlights as it relates to injuries for high school football players:

32.7% of injuries on kickoffs and punts were “severe” (defined as 21 or more missed days), compared to 19.3% on other plays.
20.3% of injuries on kickoffs and punts were concussions, compared to 10.9% on other plays.




Look.. they don't get any more traditional in the aspects of the game than I. Ask ZombieSlayer. lol.

But the risk vs reward of the kickoff isn't there with 10 guys running full speed smashing into other guys going in the opposite direction at varying speed. Law of physics will tell you there are more high speed hits in that single play (even in touchbacks) than the remainder of the plays on the field. Full speed contact that is.

This option, you still have the return element involved.. just you will not have as much full speed contact involved.

I remember all the worry about the kickoff placement change.. it will ruin the game. Really.. has anyone really noticed? Removing this play from the game, an ever evolving game, really isn't that big of a deal other than to maybe 2 to 3 players on the roster that make their living on this aspect of the game. And most of those will be retained for the punt returns.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Pack93z
  • Pack93z
  • Select Member Topic Starter
11 years ago
One more note on this.. I present this argument with the aspect that the game is under fire from lawsuits and safety concerns.

The game has changed and will continue to change with concussion being the primary focus. I would rather lose a play like this than them continuing to march down the road of fines and taking more and more contact out of the game.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
yooperfan
11 years ago
Well, we could have just flag football with no helmets or pads.
I,m quite sure the incidence of injury would diminish markedly.

Seems like we are headed that way anyway.
Pack93z
  • Pack93z
  • Select Member Topic Starter
11 years ago



Seems like we are headed that way anyway.

Originally Posted by: yooperfan 



That is kind of the attitude I accepted late in the 2010 season, besides being still pissed about the CBA.. I also accepted that the game I fell in love with as a child will be changing over the course of this decade due to liability lawsuits.

The NFL, regardless of how they present it, is trying to show that they are changing and that player safety is the priority. We all know money is the priority.. and player safety is directly tied to that cash cow.

Hence the over reactions to hits and blocks.. they are in a time crunch to show change.

My point here is this.. if they are going to change the game, I would rather this aspect change than further watering down the aggressive nature of the game.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
PackFanWithTwins
11 years ago
This is really getting old. They are trying to take the hits out of the game, because players file lawsuits, yet the players are the ones who don't want to remove the hits from the game in the first place. I say, ask the players. Do you want the hitting removed for your own safety, or do you want to risk it. this isn't 50 years ago where they can play dumb and say we didn't know.


The world needs ditch diggers too Danny!!!
Pack93z
  • Pack93z
  • Select Member Topic Starter
11 years ago

This is really getting old. They are trying to take the hits out of the game, because players file lawsuits, yet the players are the ones who don't want to remove the hits from the game in the first place. I say, ask the players. Do you want the hitting removed for your own safety, or do you want to risk it. this isn't 50 years ago where they can play dumb and say we didn't know.

Originally Posted by: PackFanWithTwins 



Agreed.. Lawyers will be the death of all things good on the face of this earth.


"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Porforis
11 years ago
I guess I'm just less quick to accept that this is the way it has to be. It probably is, but it doesn't mean that I need to settle for the lesser of two evils - I still have some hope that the Players Union and past players stop pretending that they never knew that playing football could cause long-term damage, sign a waiver saying that any injuries sustained during a game are not the responsibility of the NFL and rattle off all known immediate and delayed physical issues associated with football, give the players and union a few goodies and call it a day.

Regardless of what the end results might turn out to be, this isn't about player safety and it isn't about what's good for the game. This is about political games, and both sides (NFL and players/union) need to grow up and find a more acceptable solution than turning the game upside down and inside out.
Pack93z
  • Pack93z
  • Select Member Topic Starter
11 years ago

I guess I'm just less quick to accept that this is the way it has to be.

Originally Posted by: Porforis 



I had the same hope prior to the lockout.. that failed. I continually watch players hold out in the second year of contracts for more pay. We see owners and the league office screw fans out of seats sold.

Time after time we see money put before the game.

This time.. it is a cash grab by players of the past.. looking for a cut of the pie the NFL has become. Just like the owners and to a degree the league itself.. they give two shits about the game itself as the priority. It is and will be going forward about the money.

It is all relative to society.

Much like the cost of living raise the Wisconsin Representatives want to give themselves as the rest of the working population hasn't seen that in a couple years. Money is truly the root of the problem.

Quick to change.. not really.. this has been increasing year in and out. Just don't see it changing.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Fan Shout
Zero2Cool (4h) : Chase Young to sign $13M contract with Saints
Zero2Cool (4h) : Yosh to Panthers what noooo. Wait he didn't do crap
wpr (18-Mar) : I say that he is technically HER BIL as he married her sister. I checked it out, he's considered my BIL as well. Sad.
Mucky Tundra (18-Mar) : wpr, I assume its your BIL via marriage to your wife? If so, I can figure out where the smarts in the family went ;)
wpr (18-Mar) : Mucky my B-I-L is Bare Stupid. I could write a book.
Mucky Tundra (18-Mar) : As a teenager in Rockford IL I would get heckled by adults in public for wearing GB gear
Mucky Tundra (18-Mar) : if you think the online ones are bad, try *living amongst* them
Mucky Tundra (18-Mar) : Never doubt wprs loyalty. Poor guy is surrounded by Bears fans in Northern IL
wpr (17-Mar) : pass Martha. Thanks for the invite though.
Martha Careful (17-Mar) : blog * as the same ugly Illinois colors were adopted by the Baer
Martha Careful (17-Mar) : WPR, perhaps you should be joining the Bears fans blog has the same ugly Illinois colors were adopted by the Bears
Mucky Tundra (17-Mar) : Ah a fellow U of Illinois hater. I can respect that though I imagine it's for different reasons
Zero2Cool (17-Mar) : BTW. I didn't catch the game. I just hate Illinois.
Mucky Tundra (17-Mar) : They're your Big Ten Chumps and you will like it!
Zero2Cool (17-Mar) : No, not for the record. Referee's handled that BS. Orange team was trash ass
Mucky Tundra (17-Mar) : *Your* Big Ten Chumps for the record
Zero2Cool (17-Mar) : No, not Big Ten Champs. IL is big ten CHUMPS
wpr (17-Mar) : Big Ten Champs
wpr (17-Mar) : !!!
wpr (17-Mar) : INI
wpr (17-Mar) : ILL
Martha Careful (17-Mar) : Wisconsin with an outstanding on in the men’s Big Ten basketball tournament. Let’s hope it continues in the NCAAs
Zero2Cool (17-Mar) : Almost like taking QB in 2020 even if you don't need one is good move.
Mucky Tundra (16-Mar) : 2021 QB Draft class looking like a real clunker
Mucky Tundra (16-Mar) : A conditional 6th rounder? I remember Bears fans arguing they'd get a day 2 pick at worst lol
dfosterf (16-Mar) : So I got the no extension part right and the have to wait on the CW physical wrong
Zero2Cool (16-Mar) : Bears are trading Justin Fields for a 2025 6th-round pick that goes to a 4th-round pick based on playtime, per sources.
Zero2Cool (16-Mar) : Former Packer Jarrett Bush opens Wisconsin’s first blow dry bar in Green Bay
dfosterf (16-Mar) : If the Bears are not doing a deal with Washington, they also cannot trade Fields until Williams physical with them. All hail Caleb Williams!
dfosterf (16-Mar) : The talent is undeniable, but the (advertised) haul is obscene.
dfosterf (16-Mar) : If the Bears are cutting a deal with the Commanders, in either scenario, cannot happen until williams passes a Commanders physical
dfosterf (16-Mar) : My guess is no to the Fields extension, but yes to the trade back with the Commanders.
dhazer (15-Mar) : I think the Bears do a Love extension and they will trade out of the 1st pick and take the haul
Martha Careful (15-Mar) : that might make sense
Zero2Cool (15-Mar) : Justin Fields to Steelers?
Zero2Cool (15-Mar) : Kenny Pickett. Eagles. Done.
Zero2Cool (15-Mar) : They can claim best two WR tandem.
Mucky Tundra (15-Mar) : Aaron Donald retiring
dhazer (15-Mar) : Campbell signing with 49ers
dhazer (15-Mar) : I love how the Bear Fans are now claiming they have the best skill players in the NFC North lol
Zero2Cool (15-Mar) : Vikings made a move to get a 2nd first round pick
Mucky Tundra (15-Mar) : That's a not a bad deal for the Bears
Zero2Cool (15-Mar) : Bears have traded for WR Keenan Allen sending Chargers a fourth rounder.
Martha Careful (15-Mar) : *signs
Martha Careful (14-Mar) : MLB Devon White science with the Eagles
Mucky Tundra (14-Mar) : But that was before FA started
Mucky Tundra (14-Mar) : Dhaze, I thought Kurls would be their #1 target when I read that he was an Amos comp (jack of all trades guy)
dhazer (14-Mar) : I would like to see the Packers target 2 more FA still available Kamren Curl Safety and Chase Young edge
Martha Careful (14-Mar) : wow...didn't see that coming
Zero2Cool (14-Mar) : AJ Dillon re-signing with Packers.
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2023 Packers Schedule
Sunday, Sep 10 @ 3:25 PM
Bears
Sunday, Sep 17 @ 12:00 PM
Falcons
Sunday, Sep 24 @ 12:00 PM
SAINTS
Thursday, Sep 28 @ 7:15 PM
LIONS
Monday, Oct 9 @ 7:15 PM
Raiders
Sunday, Oct 22 @ 3:25 PM
Broncos
Sunday, Oct 29 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Sunday, Nov 5 @ 12:00 PM
RAMS
Sunday, Nov 12 @ 12:00 PM
Steelers
Sunday, Nov 19 @ 12:00 PM
CHARGERS
Thursday, Nov 23 @ 11:30 AM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 3 @ 7:20 PM
CHIEFS
Monday, Dec 11 @ 7:15 PM
Giants
Sunday, Dec 17 @ 12:00 PM
BUCCANEERS
Sunday, Dec 24 @ 12:00 PM
Panthers
Sunday, Dec 31 @ 7:20 PM
Vikings
Sunday, Jan 7 @ 3:25 PM
BEARS
Sunday, Jan 14 @ 3:30 PM
Cowboys
Saturday, Jan 20 @ 7:15 PM
49ers
Recent Topics
1h / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

9h / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

10h / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

18-Mar / Around The NFL / Mucky Tundra

16-Mar / Random Babble / Martha Careful

16-Mar / Green Bay Packers Talk / TheKanataThrilla

15-Mar / Green Bay Packers Talk / dhazer

15-Mar / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

14-Mar / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

14-Mar / Random Babble / Zero2Cool

14-Mar / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

13-Mar / Random Babble / Zero2Cool

13-Mar / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

13-Mar / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

13-Mar / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2024 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.