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User is suspended until 4/29/2043 11:56:55 PM(UTC) texaspackerbacker  
#1 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 1:58:11 PM(UTC)
6 or 7 years ago or whatever it was, I was posting in a couple of other forums, and there was this big controversy. Should we use the highest first round pick we had in a long time before or since to take A.J. Hawk or Vernon Davis? As I recall, it was about 70/30 in favor of taking Hawk. I was in the minority, favoring Davis.

I'd like to know - as honestly as possible hahahaha - 1 where people in here stood in that debate back then, and 2 where they stand now in terms of taking Hawk over Davis.
Dulak  
#2 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 2:24:24 PM(UTC)
texaspackerbacker said: Go to Quoted Post
6 or 7 years ago or whatever it was, I was posting in a couple of other forums, and there was this big controversy. Should we use the highest first round pick we had in a long time before or since to take A.J. Hawk or Vernon Davis? As I recall, it was about 70/30 in favor of taking Hawk. I was in the minority, favoring Davis.

I'd like to know - as honestly as possible hahahaha - 1 where people in here stood in that debate back then, and 2 where they stand now in terms of taking Hawk over Davis.


IMO davis is the best WR out there and has been for awhile ... dude is a stud.

finley looks like he might make a comeback this year - wouldnt be surprised if he has some nice numbers also - I didnt follow the pack as closely back then so ...
Zero2Cool  
#3 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 2:28:38 PM(UTC)
I took my dog out of the fight because I was Al Davis'd with the freaky numbers VERNON Davis put up. I wasn't thrilled with A.J. Hawk, but he basically is what every said he was going to be. Everyone (sports brilliant folk that is) said that Hawk peaked already and was low risk. You knew what you'd get. Davis could be a star TE or a star athlete in underwear only.
buckeyepackfan  
#4 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 2:37:14 PM(UTC)
Just another Ted Thompson F--k up!!!!
[duh] [duh] [duh] [duh] [duh] [duh]
another in a long length OF GM miscues, starting as far back as 1989..when.............................................................................................................................................................................................................
DAMNIT WE COULD HAVE HAD BARRY SANDERS!!!!!!!!!
DoddPower  
#5 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 4:02:21 PM(UTC)
In hindsight, I would prefer V. Davis. Hawk is a solid player, but it's nice to get a rare athletic specimen when picking that high, imo. Decent to good linebackers can be found elsewhere. The truly elite athletes that are also good NFL players are rare and very tough to come by.
nyrpack  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 4:15:50 PM(UTC)
coming out of school at ohio state, i was thrilled to land hawk, hes a good player that unfortunately didnt live up to the hype, but it could have been alot worse !!
porky88  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 5:10:57 PM(UTC)
I would take Haloti Ngata over both.
PackFanWithTwins  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 8:00:07 PM(UTC)
I've never taken sides on we should take this player or that. I would have been pleased with either.

Hawk has been exactly what he was seen as. The safest pick of the draft. Not the highest upside, but very little risk of being a failure. He was never expected to be Ray Lewis. He has been dependable, and he has been reasonably priced. He is not flashy, but the coaches say he is always where he is suppose to be. He is unselfish, he is like the FB of the defense. He takes on the lead blockers so others can make the play.

I am not sure how Davis would have fit into the offense. He definately had the talent, but that was a time when the offense was building the fab 5 WR group. TE was not a big part of the offense at that time, we were using them mostly for blocking with occasional routes.
DoddPower  
#9 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 8:04:21 PM(UTC)
PackFanWithTwins said: Go to Quoted Post
I've never taken sides on we should take this player or that. I would have been pleased with either.

Hawk has been exactly what he was seen as. The safest pick of the draft. Not the highest upside, but very little risk of being a failure. He was never expected to be Ray Lewis. He has been dependable, and he has been reasonably priced. He is not flashy, but the coaches say he is always where he is suppose to be. He is unselfish, he is like the FB of the defense. He takes on the lead blockers so others can make the play.

I am not sure how Davis would have fit into the offense. He definately had the talent, but that was a time when the offense was building the fab 5 WR group. TE was not a big part of the offense at that time, we were using them mostly for blocking with occasional routes.


A good coach would make someone as talented as Davis fit into their system. Also, drafting him would have probably changed some other moves as well, so it's hard to predict.
PackFanWithTwins  
#10 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 8:12:32 PM(UTC)
DoddPower said: Go to Quoted Post
A good coach would make someone as talented as Davis fit into their system. Also, drafting him would have probably changed some other moves as well, so it's hard to predict.


True, but there is no telling what the team would look like today? If they took an offensive receiving threat, would they still have taken Jennings in the 2nd. Would they still have followed with Jones and Nelson the following years. The team would more than likely be completely different, and that could be better or worse. Nobody will ever know.
DakotaT  
#11 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 8:46:20 PM(UTC)
I recall wanting to trade up for Mario Williams or Bush. But I wanted Hawk over the workout warrior Vernon Davis. It took Mike Singletary kicking Davis' ass for three years to get the player we see now to come out. As far as I'm concerned, that's Singletary's team in San Francisco, and I wish we would bring him in to coach our defense.

So for the record Texas, I did not want VD.
DakotaT  
#12 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2013 8:48:14 PM(UTC)
buckeyepackfan said: Go to Quoted Post
Just another Ted Thompson F--k up!!!!
[duh] [duh] [duh] [duh] [duh] [duh]
another in a long length OF GM miscues, starting as far back as 1989..when.............................................................................................................................................................................................................
DAMNIT WE COULD HAVE HAD BARRY SANDERS!!!!!!!!!


Get over yourself and your Hawk fetish, already. This is actually a good thread.
Dulak  
#13 Posted : Wednesday, September 11, 2013 1:51:07 AM(UTC)
I might not remember hawk vs davis but I do remember mandrich vs sanders - that was a good one huh - we should get a poster or mandrich for zero :)
musccy  
#14 Posted : Wednesday, September 11, 2013 4:55:42 AM(UTC)
Dulak said: Go to Quoted Post
but I do remember mandrich vs sanders - that was a good one huh


The Pack should get complimentary draft picks for the next 100 years for that one.

As for the thread, I liked the Hawk pick at the time, likely using 20/20 hindsight I'd side with Vernon.

play2win  
#15 Posted : Wednesday, September 11, 2013 5:04:33 AM(UTC)
porky88 said: Go to Quoted Post
I would take Haloti Ngata over both.


Indeed. I wanted Ngata.

Imagine how different THAT team would have been. We had to wait till 2009 to get some beef in the middle with Raji.

We would have had a fierce DL, with Barnett and Bishop in their primes in the middle. Might have been better off that way.

Davis seemed too much like a Barbie.

Hawk was the safe pick that 95% of prognosticators mocked correctly to GB.
User is suspended until 4/29/2043 11:56:55 PM(UTC) texaspackerbacker  
#16 Posted : Wednesday, September 11, 2013 6:58:12 AM(UTC)
DakotaT said: Go to Quoted Post

So for the record Texas, I did not want VD.


This isn't the place to discuss your health issues, Dakota [laughing]

Seriously, that high in the draft, I would have expected (not necessarily based on reports of Hawk in college, just the draft position) a top quality sideline to sideline tackling machine - not a Butkis or Nitschke, not even maybe a Singletary, but several shades better than Hawk has been.

As for Davis, he was maybe a slightly less safe pick, but that high up in the draft, I think you have to gamble on getting a superstar instead of a safe technician.

And if we got Davis, we probably would have avoided all the angst over good and bad and ugly performances by Jermichael Finley.

As was said, at least Hawk wasn't another Mandarich. It seems like there were other good alternatives besides Deion Sanders then too.

buckeyepackfan  
#17 Posted : Wednesday, September 11, 2013 8:03:44 AM(UTC)
play2win said: Go to Quoted Post
Indeed. I wanted Ngata.

Imagine how different THAT team would have been. We had to wait till 2009 to get some beef in the middle with Raji.

We would have had a fierce DL, with Barnett and Bishop in their primes in the middle. Might have been better off that way.

Davis seemed too much like a Barbie.

Hawk was the safe pick that 95% of prognosticators mocked correctly to GB.


Do you see the flaw in your statement?

Barnett went down in 2010 then again in 2011.(or was it 2009 and 2010?) the year that matters is 2010.

How many winning SuperBowl teams has Davis played on?

I would have been happy with either Davis or Ngata, but "IN HINDSIGHT" sure am glad Hawk was there in 2010 when LBr's were dropping like flies and he stepped up and became the QB of defense.

Ifs and Buts people ifs and buts.
play2win  
#18 Posted : Wednesday, September 11, 2013 8:50:31 AM(UTC)
buckeyepackfan said: Go to Quoted Post
Do you see the flaw in your statement?

Barnett went down in 2010 then again in 2011.(or was it 2009 and 2010?) the year that matters is 2010.

How many winning SuperBowl teams has Davis played on?

I would have been happy with either Davis or Ngata, but "IN HINDSIGHT" sure am glad Hawk was there in 2010 when LBr's were dropping like flies and he stepped up and became the QB of defense.

Ifs and Buts people ifs and buts.


What the hell does THAT mean? I wanted Ngata. I never was a Nick Barnett fan, but was a huge Desmond Bishop fan. Big deal.

The question was "Hawk or Davis," and I wanted neither, but felt Hawk was a very safe pick.

The years that mattered were 2006-2009, where we could have used Ngata instead of Colin Cole. We went 8-8 in 2006 and 13-3 in 2007. I would say Ngata thrown into that line that had a 15 sack Kampman and a 6 sack Kabeer, a 7 sack Corey Williams and a 7 sack Cullen Jenkins could have made the difference. Pickett was there just chewing up blockers.

We might have won the SB with Favre at QB in 2007 had we chosen differently, and who knows how many others...
buckeyepackfan  
#19 Posted : Wednesday, September 11, 2013 9:02:58 AM(UTC)
play2win said: Go to Quoted Post
What the hell does THAT mean? I wanted Ngata. I never was a Nick Barnett fan, but was a huge Desmond Bishop fan. Big deal.

The question was "Hawk or Davis," and I wanted neither, but felt Hawk was a very safe pick.

The years that mattered were 2006-2009, where we could have used Ngata instead of Colin Cole. We went 8-8 in 2006 and 13-3 in 2007. I would say Ngata thrown into that line that had a 15 sack Kampman and a 6 sack Kabeer, a 7 sack Corey Williams and a 7 sack Cullen Jenkins could have made the difference. Pickett was there just chewing up blockers.

We might have won the SB with Favre at QB in 2007 had we chosen differently, and who knows how many others...


Damn, you specifically mentioned Barnett and Bishop in the post I quoted..
Sorry for the confusion.

Favre was going to throw that game in 2007 no matter who played on defense...Just ask Nerdman!!!!

[laughing] [laughing] [laughing]

Just a joke, I guess you can look back and say "what if"' but it doesn't really change things.
play2win  
#20 Posted : Wednesday, September 11, 2013 9:29:22 AM(UTC)
buckeyepackfan said: Go to Quoted Post
Damn, you specifically mentioned Barnett and Bishop in the post I quoted..
Sorry for the confusion.

Favre was going to throw that game in 2007 no matter who played on defense...Just ask Nerdman!!!!

[laughing] [laughing] [laughing]

Just a joke, I guess you can look back and say "what if"' but it doesn't really change things.


Uh, that's SO TRUE!!! Man, I think back to what could have been with this Packers team over the decades... many, many wasted opportunities. Kind of goes to show how vital it is to make hay while the sun shines. You get most of the pieces in place, my line of thinking is, finish it off and enjoy the ride. This testing youth thing as a constant, as a maxim, drives me bat shit crazy.

For instance, add the veteran S this offseason to what we have and maybe we win last Sunday...
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