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Offline Mucky Tundra  
#1 Posted : Wednesday, February 12, 2014 12:04:03 PM(UTC)
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KFFL wrote:
Bill Baldini, agent for free-agent C Greg Van Roten (Packers), said the Green Bay Packers ...


Hmm

JC Tretter 6'4" 307
EDS 6'2" 308
TJ Lang 6'4" 318

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Online mi_keys  
#2 Posted : Wednesday, February 12, 2014 12:06:43 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Mucky Tundra Go to Quoted Post


Hopefully meaner too.
Born and bred a cheesehead
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nerdmann on 2/12/2014(UTC), wpr on 2/13/2014(UTC)
Online DoddPower  
#3 Posted : Wednesday, February 12, 2014 2:31:29 PM(UTC)
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Alex Mack is pretty good.
Offline DakotaT  
#4 Posted : Wednesday, February 12, 2014 5:07:55 PM(UTC)
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I think Tretter is going to be given every opportunity to win that job. But, I wouldn't mind seeing Lang at center, Bacteria at RG. I'm taking a big leap in thinking that Sherrod and Bulaga will be taking their rightful places at Left and Right Tackles.
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wpr on 2/13/2014(UTC)
Offline nerdmann  
#5 Posted : Wednesday, February 12, 2014 6:09:29 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: DakotaT Go to Quoted Post
I think Tretter is going to be given every opportunity to win that job. But, I wouldn't mind seeing Lang at center, Bacteria at RG. I'm taking a big leap in thinking that Sherrod and Bulaga will be taking their rightful places at Left and Right Tackles.


They want Tretter to step up there. But then again they wanted BJ Coleman to step up too. And Jerrod McMillian. lol
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline DakotaT  
#6 Posted : Wednesday, February 12, 2014 6:23:40 PM(UTC)
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I'm less concerned about the O'line that year's past mostly because we have more of a train wreck on the defensive side of the ball. A pedestrian o-line that still yields a top ten offense every year can't be that horrible can it? We have 1 stud on the o-line and serviceable players at all the other positions. At least we no longer have guys starting named Newhouse, Whittaker, or Babre.
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nerdmann on 2/12/2014(UTC)
Offline PackFanWithTwins  
#7 Posted : Wednesday, February 12, 2014 7:29:02 PM(UTC)
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Sounds good to me. I've been hoping to increase size. Doing so should help with run blocking for lacy.

EDS is to limited, he has already put on lbs to get where he is at. Tretter has room to add some good weight.
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Offline nerdmann  
#8 Posted : Wednesday, February 12, 2014 8:29:48 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: DakotaT Go to Quoted Post
I'm less concerned about the O'line that year's past mostly because we have more of a train wreck on the defensive side of the ball. A pedestrian o-line that still yields a top ten offense every year can't be that horrible can it? We have 1 stud on the o-line and serviceable players at all the other positions. At least we no longer have guys starting named Newhouse, Whittaker, or Babre.


I like our Oline. I think they can play.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline beast  
#9 Posted : Wednesday, February 12, 2014 9:14:22 PM(UTC)
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Bill Baldini, agent for free-agent C Greg Van Roten wrote:

The Green Bay Packers released Van Roten because they are looking to get bigger at the center position.


Right and the fact he played only 10 of 32 games has NOTHING to do with it... I got you message Bill Speak to the hand


Anyways I stop expect them to give Tretter the job, after all he was riding the bench. Though they might have him pegged as a back-up at Center for the future. But D-Smith, Lang or Barclay will most likely be the starting Center going into camp.
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Offline beast  
#10 Posted : Wednesday, February 12, 2014 9:15:31 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
I like our Oline. I think they can play.


I like me...and I think I can play.

I don't think I can play very well for the NFL level but that's a different story Tongue
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Offline sschind  
#11 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 7:23:08 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: beast Go to Quoted Post
Right and the fact he played only 10 of 32 games has NOTHING to do with it... I got you message Bill Speak to the hand


Anyways I stop expect them to give Tretter the job, after all he was riding the bench. Though they might have him pegged as a back-up at Center for the future. But D-Smith, Lang or Barclay will most likely be the starting Center going into camp.


The only thing I don't like about Lang as center is the shuffling of the line again. I get that with people coming back from injuries (hopefully) that this will happen and if it results in the best people at the best position then I'm all for it. Its just that if Lang is our center and our top backup at guard if a guard goes down you move Lang and put in the backup center. one injury affects 2 positions. I'd like a line where our number 1 backup at any position is not a starter at any other.
I respect your right to have your opinion but that doesn't mean I agree with it or respect you for having it.
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buckeyepackfan on 2/13/2014(UTC)
Offline nerdmann  
#12 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 8:49:10 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: sschind Go to Quoted Post
The only thing I don't like about Lang as center is the shuffling of the line again. I get that with people coming back from injuries (hopefully) that this will happen and if it results in the best people at the best position then I'm all for it. Its just that if Lang is our center and our top backup at guard if a guard goes down you move Lang and put in the backup center. one injury affects 2 positions. I'd like a line where our number 1 backup at any position is not a starter at any other.


Lang is very good at G. If we move him to C, he's not as good there. Then we also have someone lesser at G.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline steveishere  
#13 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 12:11:38 PM(UTC)
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Lang is not as good of a C as EDS though so that wouldn't make sense. I get it if you want to get bigger for the sake of getting better but it's stupid to get bigger for the sake of getting bigger.

EDS was more than serviceable as a C this year so they better have someone good lined up if they are gonna let him walk.
Offline sschind  
#14 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 12:46:46 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
Lang is very good at G. If we move him to C, he's not as good there. Then we also have someone lesser at G.


Actually you are right. I said the only thing I don't like about Lang at center is shuffling the line but another thing I don't like is what you said. Leave Lang at guard where is not bad. If you want a better center go out and get one, don't cannibalize your own line.

I respect your right to have your opinion but that doesn't mean I agree with it or respect you for having it.
Online DoddPower  
#15 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 1:23:46 PM(UTC)
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I've always thought EDS is nothing more than a serviceable center. Perhaps average, at best. The Packers just can't be content with several average at best players. They have to do better if they ever expect to be anything more than a "good" team. I'm not saying they are content, but I certainly hope they will explore all options to upgrade the center position, among others.
Offline GermanGilbert  
#16 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 1:41:14 PM(UTC)
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Does anyone remember the epic collapse of the OLine when EDS left the Thanksgiving game and Lang took over at C? No, I don't want to see this again.

Of course that was not all on Lang, the complete shift of personnel, Newhouse at LT and no practice snap in this formation didn't help as well. But overall Lang was way better at G than at C. If you think EDS is not servicable enough, bring someone in, but don't switch Lang to a position where he's worse and open a new hole at another position.
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Online DoddPower  
#17 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 1:43:15 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: GermanGilbert Go to Quoted Post
Of course that was not all on Lang, the complete shift of personnel, Newhouse at LT and no practice snap in this formation didn't help as well. But overall Lang was way better at G than at C. If you think EDS is not servicable enough, bring someone in, but don't switch Lang to a position where he's worse and open a new hole at another position.


I agree. Don't move Lang. Just try to upgrade the center position otherwise.
Offline Bigbyfan  
#18 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 2:31:08 PM(UTC)
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I'm not sure why everyone is so down on EDS at center. He is ranked as one of the best pass blocking centers in the league. ProFootballFocus even had him ranked as the 8th best center in the league last season.

This team has a few needs that need to be fixed this offseason. Center is not one of them.
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Offline GermanGilbert  
#19 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 2:40:48 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Bigbyfan Go to Quoted Post
This team has a few needs that need to be fixed this offseason. Center is not one of them.


With EDS being FA Center is a huge need to be fixed. Either with EDS himself or with someone else.

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Offline buckeyepackfan  
#20 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 3:17:06 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Bigbyfan Go to Quoted Post
I'm not sure why everyone is so down on EDS at center. He is ranked as one of the best pass blocking centers in the league. ProFootballFocus even had him ranked as the 8th best center in the league last season.

This team has a few needs that need to be fixed this offseason. Center is not one of them.


Agree, the problem being, he is a FA this year, is there enough money to sign him?

T.J Lang is due 5.1 mil this year, Josh Sitton 6.4 mil.

How much money can a team invest in the o-line?

The Packers usually keep 8 lineman on the 53 man roster, 7 are usually active on gameday.

Bulaga 3.8 mil , Sherrard 2.1mil, Bahktiari .61mil, Barclay .57mil, Lane Taylor .50 mil, and J. C Tretter .59 mil

There's also Geirhart, Coleman, Adams, Tiller, and Vujnovich who are pretty much irrelevant at this point.(for this discussion)

The Packers have 19.58mil invested in the line for 2014(top 8).

Tretter who is being talked about as maybe the future C can go on the PS if Ted decides to resign EDS.
I guess there are 3 easy options right now.
1.Sign EDS(if possible) and stash Tretter on the PS
2.Sign EDS keep Tretter on 53 man roster and let a Lane Taylor or Derrick Sherrard go.
3. Let EDS go and trust that Tretter can become the starter at C for The Packers.

I prefer option #1.

Would be great if The Packers could have these guys battle it out in Training Camp, but that's not an option at C, Ted has to make a decision on EDS.

Ted decides to sign EDS, HE IS THE STARTER, there is no camp battle.
Enjoy the ride – It kicks and just keeps on kickin’. "Stats are for Losers"
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DakotaT on 2/13/2014(UTC)
Offline warhawk  
#21 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 3:46:51 PM(UTC)
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I can't see McCarthy moving guys all over on the Oline. Ideally, they sign EDS and then:

See if Bahkitari makes that 2nd year leap and holds his job or if Bulaga earns it back. If not put Bulaga over at RT. That would actually be the ideal scenario if it panned out like that. Very little change (helps overall line play). Improved play at both tackle positions (helps overall line play too).

The wild card would be Sherrod with the talent he has that he has not been able to show to this point but that's certainly not a bad thing.

Again, I can't see them screwing around with the Oline. Arod went down for half the year and it was a disaster so IMO the last thing they will do is move people all over the place.

And precisely why the will sign EDS. They know he can play and he happens to squat right in front of the guy that nobody can ever say again this team can win consistently without.
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buckeyepackfan on 2/13/2014(UTC)
Offline DakotaT  
#22 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 4:06:55 PM(UTC)
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I'd don't think resigning EDS is a bad idea, and just going with the boys we currently have on the roster. We have three decent tackles, and I have my fingers crossed that Sherrod makes it all the way back and earns the LT position, but I'm good with Bacteria too. It's a dream to have a line like the Sherminator gave us, but I'd rather go heavy on defense this off season, cause that side of the ball needs the attention.
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Offline Wade  
#23 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 4:18:43 PM(UTC)
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(shaking head)

I actually like EDS. I don't think he's the weakest link of the OL.

I think he's really good ... for a backup position.

I know I'm beating a dead horse, but debating between players who have demonstrated, at most, that they qualify as "serviceable" and those who might have "potential" for more, is a recipe for disaster.

The goal should not be to have an adequate OL. It should never be to have an adequate line. It should never be to have a serviceable OL. The goal should be to have a dominant line. A great line.

A great line makes an offense unstoppable. A serviceable line threatens the health of the Hall of Fame quarterback that is essential to that unstoppable offense.

Yes, the defense is a bigger train wreck. So it has to be a bigger priority overall. But however much of that train wreck can be cleaned up in one off season, it doesn't matter if Rodgers gets hurt. And, ISTM, if you approach the OL as "we're ok with serviceable and waiting for Tretter or Bahktiari or some pre-March "free agent servicable guys" to improve it, you're just risking #12 again.

The Packers were lucky that the injury last year was a collarbone. What if the next one is to the throwing shoulder or elbow? Or a concussion? Or a major knee injury?

Quarterbacks get injured. It's a reality of the game. But IMO you ought to be doing everything you can to ensure that they face as few hits as possible. And if you are continually content with combinations of "serviceable" and "potential for growth" and "late round picks", IMO you aren't doing everything you can.

IMO the Packers aren't going to be bona fide championship contender until they fix the defense. But they are also just one missed block away from having the same issues at quarterback as every other team in the NFC North.
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DoddPower on 2/15/2014(UTC)
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#24 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 4:19:01 PM(UTC)
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We were marginally decent in the interior last year, and horrible at OT. Ideally, as was said, Sherrod can play like a first rounder and Bulaga can play like he did several years ago. That would take care of things, but it is way short of a sure thing. I have no confidence in Bakhtiari, and Barclay is back up quality at best.

As for Center, like somebody said, if EDS signs, he will start. I think they are letting him shop around, and if nobody offers him what he wants, the Packers will sign him for less. That seems to say they think highly of Tretter.

As for the original topic, probably it's just sour grapes/excuses from the Van Roten people, but there is a chance the Packers did tell him that, and they don't care if EDS does leave. I'd hate to see that, because he did do a serviceable job, and Tretter is a unproven.

The bottom line, though, is that with Aaron Rodgers, Eddie Lacy, and our wideouts, we simply don't need all that great an O Line to have one of the best offenses in the NFL. Sure, I'd like it to get better, but the fact is, we don't absolutely need it.
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Offline buckeyepackfan  
#25 Posted : Thursday, February 13, 2014 5:25:56 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Wade Go to Quoted Post
(shaking head)

I actually like EDS. I don't think he's the weakest link of the OL.

I think he's really good ... for a backup position.

I know I'm beating a dead horse, but debating between players who have demonstrated, at most, that they qualify as "serviceable" and those who might have "potential" for more, is a recipe for disaster.

The goal should not be to have an adequate OL. It should never be to have an adequate line. It should never be to have a serviceable OL. The goal should be to have a dominant line. A great line.

A great line makes an offense unstoppable. A serviceable line threatens the health of the Hall of Fame quarterback that is essential to that unstoppable offense.

Yes, the defense is a bigger train wreck. So it has to be a bigger priority overall. But however much of that train wreck can be cleaned up in one off season, it doesn't matter if Rodgers gets hurt. And, ISTM, if you approach the OL as "we're ok with serviceable and waiting for Tretter or Bahktiari or some pre-March "free agent servicable guys" to improve it, you're just risking #12 again.

The Packers were lucky that the injury last year was a collarbone. What if the next one is to the throwing shoulder or elbow? Or a concussion? Or a major knee injury?

Quarterbacks get injured. It's a reality of the game. But IMO you ought to be doing everything you can to ensure that they face as few hits as possible. And if you are continually content with combinations of "serviceable" and "potential for growth" and "late round picks", IMO you aren't doing everything you can.

IMO the Packers aren't going to be bona fide championship contender until they fix the defense. But they are also just one missed block away from having the same issues at quarterback as every other team in the NFC North.


Then what is the answer?
The Packers have committed to the players on the roster, everyone of the O-line I mentioned are under contract except EDS.
Is there a better option available via Free Agency?
and if there is, can The Packers afford to sign that option without blowing up the salary cap?
Enjoy the ride – It kicks and just keeps on kickin’. "Stats are for Losers"
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