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Offline Dulak  
#1 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 7:21:33 AM(UTC)
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So I was at a CPD seminar last week. Basically a mix/mosh of speakers.

Attended a seminar 'http://www.copashow.co.uk/workshops/spartanova/' on ACL tears and returning back to sports. Basically the seminar was a taster and they try to get you to 'buy' their product. They are from belgium (I think) - seemed to have made diagnosing injuries and if injured what is desired to return back to your current sport - into a science.

Anyways ... to make a long story short. I talked with one of the presenters; he told me he was in contact from someone from the denver broncos that day.

I couldnt find a site that lists injuries except for this: http://mmqb.si.com/2013/...fl-injury-increase-2013/

point is - maybe if the packers org wanted less injuries they need to get serious on prevention first and 2nd treating the injury correctly/effectively. cough like some teams are doing cough

or what is that saying ... they can keep doing what they have always done ...








Offline Zero2Cool  
#2 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 7:27:31 AM(UTC)
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I have a problem with folks always trying to medicate or apply bandaids to things. My perception is, find the source, find the root cause and fix that and everything else will flow well down stream.

Example. You're getting headaches three or four times a week. Most will load up on painpills. I think that is wrong. Go in, get checked out and find the root cause of your headaches. Fix the root of the problem.

I've said this before too. I watched two or three training camp practices last season and I was appalled by the effort during the stretches. Any trainer worth his/her weight in salt will tell you that the warm-up and stretch are the most important parts to any workout.

The Packers players didn't seem to care about stretching whatsoever. The quad stretches were poor. The bending for hamstring stretches was a joke. It was more or less just lean and go into the next 'stretch'. When you stretch, you really need to feel it for it to be effective.
"I do not think there is any thrill that can go through the human heart like that felt by the inventor as he sees some creation of the brain unfolding to success... such emotions make a man forget food, sleep, friends, love, everything." - Nikola Tesla

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thanks Post received 2 applause.
wpr on 6/17/2014(UTC), hardrocker950 on 6/17/2014(UTC)
Offline play2win  
#3 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 8:56:48 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool Go to Quoted Post
I have a problem with folks always trying to medicate or apply bandaids to things. My perception is, find the source, find the root cause and fix that and everything else will flow well down stream.

Example. You're getting headaches three or four times a week. Most will load up on painpills. I think that is wrong. Go in, get checked out and find the root cause of your headaches. Fix the root of the problem.

I've said this before too. I watched two or three training camp practices last season and I was appalled by the effort during the stretches. Any trainer worth his/her weight in salt will tell you that the warm-up and stretch are the most important parts to any workout.

The Packers players didn't seem to care about stretching whatsoever. The quad stretches were poor. The bending for hamstring stretches was a joke. It was more or less just lean and go into the next 'stretch'. When you stretch, you really need to feel it for it to be effective.


In the OTAs that I saw, they worked through their stretching rather quickly as well. I agree with your premise and believe they could dedicate themselves to being a lot better in emphasizing proper stretching prior to taking the field.

I wonder how much of the CBA comes into play with this, as they seem very intent on getting into the practice drills as quickly as possible, with limited opportunities for on field work under the current agreement. Essentially what I saw was stretching for about 5 minutes, then some running on the field, leg kicks across the field, lateral steps across the field, etc. Sure, it is all designed to stretch everyone out prior to taking part in drill work, but it all seemed somewhat rushed, with little attention paid to players individually.

Being proactive and dedicating more time, or allocating a higher percentage of their time together with better stretching programs might be highly beneficial, and I think this is kind of where you are going here Zero2Cool. I agree. They really should be doing all they can to -prevent- injury on a grand scale after their last 4 seasons.

Maybe they are working on stuff indoors prior to taking the field that we are unaware of. I'm really hoping so.
Offline nerdmann  
#4 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 1:06:44 PM(UTC)
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All this and they're STILL not stretching!? WHAT. THE. FUCK.

Maybe Mike just isn't The Guy.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
thanks Post received 2 applause.
gbguy20 on 6/17/2014(UTC), wpr on 6/17/2014(UTC)
Offline Laser Gunns  
#5 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 1:39:42 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool Go to Quoted Post


The Packers players didn't seem to care about stretching whatsoever. The quad stretches were poor. The bending for hamstring stretches was a joke. It was more or less just lean and go into the next 'stretch'. When you stretch, you really need to feel it for it to be effective.


sounds like me in High School...

yes, they are boring as heck... until you yank one bad Flapper


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Dec, 11, 2012 - FOREVER!
Offline DarkaneRules  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 2:00:51 PM(UTC)
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This is lame and I hope it isn't true. These are conditioned athletes. Haven't they been told the importance of stretching their whole lives. Something is missing here.
Circular Arguments: They are a heck of an annoyance
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wpr on 6/17/2014(UTC)
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 4:24:25 PM(UTC)
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It has always amazed me how the best conditioned athletes in the world - all teams in all sports - keep getting so many nagging little injuries, in addition to a lot of major ones. I have played organized sports since before my teens - almost sixty years - NEVER stretching except going through the motions when forced hahahaha, and I never had any injury to speak of, severe or otherwise, despite being overweight most of those years and now old for a decade or so. I have always said from first hand knowledge, stretching is overrated.
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Offline gbguy20  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 5:01:56 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post
It has always amazed me how the best conditioned athletes in the world - all teams in all sports - keep getting so many nagging little injuries, in addition to a lot of major ones. I have played organized sports since before my teens - almost sixty years - NEVER stretching except going through the motions when forced hahahaha, and I never had any injury to speak of, severe or otherwise, despite being overweight most of those years and now old for a decade or so. I have always said from first hand knowledge, stretching is overrated.


ok
call me Dan
thanks Post received 1 applause.
nerdmann on 6/17/2014(UTC)
Offline wpr  
#9 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 7:04:13 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool Go to Quoted Post
I have a problem with folks always trying to medicate or apply bandaids to things. My perception is, find the source, find the root cause and fix that and everything else will flow well down stream.

Example. You're getting headaches three or four times a week. Most will load up on painpills. I think that is wrong. Go in, get checked out and find the root cause of your headaches. Fix the root of the problem.

I've said this before too. I watched two or three training camp practices last season and I was appalled by the effort during the stretches. Any trainer worth his/her weight in salt will tell you that the warm-up and stretch are the most important parts to any workout.

The Packers players didn't seem to care about stretching whatsoever. The quad stretches were poor. The bending for hamstring stretches was a joke. It was more or less just lean and go into the next 'stretch'. When you stretch, you really need to feel it for it to be effective.


I will agree with all until you get to the trainer. The $50-60-80,000 a year guy will not be able to consistently get the $1,000,000-5,000,000 22 year old kids.

It is Mike's job to either stand out there and enforce the proper stretching techniques or to have one of the coaches maybe even one from the offense and one from the defense out there.
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Offline dfosterf  
#10 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 7:26:38 PM(UTC)
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Stretching does suck. I would imagine that it is very hard to enforce on young athletes. That being said, I think we need a very enforced regimen, though I admit that I do not know if it was already in place. I think it's possibly the hardest thing to get a young man to do.
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damn skippy I'm an owner. I currently own a full .00001924537805515393 % of the Green Bay Packers.



thanks Post received 1 applause.
play2win on 6/18/2014(UTC)
Offline wpr  
#11 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 8:01:20 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: dfosterf Go to Quoted Post
Stretching does suck. I would imagine that it is very hard to enforce on young athletes. That being said, I think we need a very enforced regimen, though I admit that I do not know if it was already in place. I think it's possibly the hardest thing to get a young man to do.


you are probably right. In high school I recall a coach walking every line of players. Perhaps they watched a couple of lines. The HC stood and looked over the whole team. They already know who goes through the motions and who gives it the full effort. The big tubbies are probably some of the worst offenders while the backs and wrs are generally more dedicated. These days they can put someone in the tower to watch. they can film it and chew the players out one on one or in team meetings as they see fit.
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Online hardrocker950  
#12 Posted : Tuesday, June 17, 2014 8:04:59 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool Go to Quoted Post
I have a problem with folks always trying to medicate or apply bandaids to things. My perception is, find the source, find the root cause and fix that and everything else will flow well down stream.

Example. You're getting headaches three or four times a week. Most will load up on painpills. I think that is wrong. Go in, get checked out and find the root cause of your headaches. Fix the root of the problem.

I've said this before too. I watched two or three training camp practices last season and I was appalled by the effort during the stretches. Any trainer worth his/her weight in salt will tell you that the warm-up and stretch are the most important parts to any workout.

The Packers players didn't seem to care about stretching whatsoever. The quad stretches were poor. The bending for hamstring stretches was a joke. It was more or less just lean and go into the next 'stretch'. When you stretch, you really need to feel it for it to be effective.


This is probably the most true post I have seen in quite some time Zero. Couldn't have said it better myself.
"I enjoy being just one of 53 on the team." - Aaron Rodgers
Offline PWT36  
#13 Posted : Wednesday, June 18, 2014 7:37:44 AM(UTC)
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Eight players didn't practice because of apparent injuries though the Packers don't have to reveal injury information in the off season..

Players injured are : OG Josh Sitton missed some practices in the offseason because of sore back, WR Chris Harper has ham-string injury, OLB Clay Mathews is coming off thumb surgery, RB Johnathon Franklin is coming off of a neck injury last season

Other players injured are LB Nick Perry, TE Andrew Quarless , DL Jerel Worthy
and , CB Jumal Rollie

Source; Green Bay Press-Gazette- Wednesday June 18, 2014 by Pete Dougherty- Press- Gazette media
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Zero2Cool on 6/18/2014(UTC)
Offline Zero2Cool  
#14 Posted : Wednesday, June 18, 2014 7:46:00 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: wpr Go to Quoted Post
I will agree with all until you get to the trainer. The $50-60-80,000 a year guy will not be able to consistently get the $1,000,000-5,000,000 22 year old kids.

It is Mike's job to either stand out there and enforce the proper stretching techniques or to have one of the coaches maybe even one from the offense and one from the defense out there.


I will have to disagree. It is the trainers responsibility to motivate his/her trainee's. That is the purpose of a trainer. If we all had the motivation and commitment to workout on our own, why would anyone need trainers?

You as the trainer find a way, you don't make excuses. You find a way to get your trainees to do it properly. The trainer is the expert in this regard and they absolutely have to be assertive. The trainer has to get them on the same page as them. If that means making a deal with them, so be it. You have to display confidence in what you're preaching.

If you're going to expect the Head Coach to do the Trainers job, what is the purpose of the trainer? The head coach needs to be the head coach, not the trainer.


If the trainer isn't able to get to the million dollar kids, then find a new trainer that can do their job effectively.
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thanks Post received 2 applause.
play2win on 6/18/2014(UTC), Dulak on 6/18/2014(UTC)
Offline nerdmann  
#15 Posted : Wednesday, June 18, 2014 9:36:38 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool Go to Quoted Post
I will have to disagree. It is the trainers responsibility to motivate his/her trainee's. That is the purpose of a trainer. If we all had the motivation and commitment to workout on our own, why would anyone need trainers?

You as the trainer find a way, you don't make excuses. You find a way to get your trainees to do it properly. The trainer is the expert in this regard and they absolutely have to be assertive. The trainer has to get them on the same page as them. If that means making a deal with them, so be it. You have to display confidence in what you're preaching.

If you're going to expect the Head Coach to do the Trainers job, what is the purpose of the trainer? The head coach needs to be the head coach, not the trainer.


If the trainer isn't able to get to the million dollar kids, then find a new trainer that can do their job effectively.


If the Packers are gonna include salary bonuses for offseason workouts, surely they could include a clause for stretching or doing yoga of some sort.

Incentives for not having a pulled fucking hammy.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
thanks Post received 1 applause.
Dulak on 6/18/2014(UTC)
Offline wpr  
#16 Posted : Wednesday, June 18, 2014 9:56:25 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool Go to Quoted Post
I will have to disagree. It is the trainers responsibility to motivate his/her trainee's. That is the purpose of a trainer. If we all had the motivation and commitment to workout on our own, why would anyone need trainers?

You as the trainer find a way, you don't make excuses. You find a way to get your trainees to do it properly. The trainer is the expert in this regard and they absolutely have to be assertive. The trainer has to get them on the same page as them. If that means making a deal with them, so be it. You have to display confidence in what you're preaching.

If you're going to expect the Head Coach to do the Trainers job, what is the purpose of the trainer? The head coach needs to be the head coach, not the trainer.


If the trainer isn't able to get to the million dollar kids, then find a new trainer that can do their job effectively.


I am not saying that Mike has to do the trainer's job. I am not saying the trainer (s) don't have a program in place. What I am saying is even if they get down in the face of a player there are 90 of them in TC it is difficult to be all places at one time and if the HC doesn't show up to verify that this is a priority there are some players who will not give it the attention it deserves. Once again it doesn't have to be the HC. Mike can designate it to position coaches to watch their group. The trainer isn't their to look for compliance. he is there to make sure they have the correct technique. They the player is going to his fullest range when stretching.

How many young kids think they are "bullet proof" so to speak? Most. Athletes even more so. Athletes that make it to the pros have had a higher degree of luck when it comes to avoiding injuries than other players. I am not saying none of them have ever had an injury. I am saying that, as a group, they have had less. None of those who have been injured have had a career ending injury. Obviously. Because of their greater resilience to injury there is going to be a degree of apathy to stretching. After all they have not needed to do so for the past 10-15 years so why start now?

A few years ago Mike made ST a priority. He actually showed up for ST practice and low and behold the ST group got better. The last few years has been different because of the player turnover they have not had the same quality on ST as they had in the past. Point is when the HC makes it a priority the players do too.
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Offline nerdmann  
#17 Posted : Wednesday, June 18, 2014 10:14:39 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: wpr Go to Quoted Post

A few years ago Mike made ST a priority. He actually showed up for ST practice and low and behold the ST group got better. The last few years has been different because of the player turnover they have not had the same quality on ST as they had in the past. Point is when the HC makes it a priority the players do too.


This year Mike is making the defense a priority.

He SAYS he's making hammy's a priority, but clearly he is not. I submit that injuries are a bigger factor keeping us from the big show than the defense. Just my own two cents.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline Dulak  
#18 Posted : Wednesday, June 18, 2014 1:02:12 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
If the Packers are gonna include salary bonuses for offseason workouts, surely they could include a clause for stretching or doing yoga of some sort.

Incentives for not having a pulled fucking hammy.


like to see that ... 20k bonus not to have a pulled hammy, and ACL tears - 1/2 your pay. Back injuries a beating ... and neck injuries - you get to be the training dummie for a week.

thanks Post received 1 applause.
nerdmann on 6/18/2014(UTC)
Offline Dulak  
#19 Posted : Wednesday, June 18, 2014 1:07:33 PM(UTC)
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Pepper Burruss, Head Athletic Trainer
Dr. Patrick McKenzie, Team Physician
Dr. John Gray, Associate Team Physician
Bryan Engel, Assistant Athletic Trainer
Kurt Fielding, Assistant Athletic Trainer
Nate Weir, Assistant Athletic Trainer
Joshua McCullough, Intern Athletic Trainer
John Michel, Intern Athletic Trainer

These are their trainers ...

http://www.packers.com/t...1-4594-9046-d9ee46552f8f

This is their head trainer.

Heck - Id like to move back to the states. Wonder how much they pay to get kids to stretch their hammys; prob better then what I am making here.

Offline nerdmann  
#20 Posted : Wednesday, June 18, 2014 1:34:51 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Dulak Go to Quoted Post
like to see that ... 20k bonus not to have a pulled hammy, and ACL tears - 1/2 your pay. Back injuries a beating ... and neck injuries - you get to be the training dummie for a week.



10K per yoga session, something like that. As for neck injuries, 10k per acupuncture treatment.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
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