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beast  
#21 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:28:14 AM(UTC)
First of all we would need to figure out what kind of 3-4 the Packers plan on running. Yes there are different type just like there are different type of 4-3.

First off Cole isn't signed with the Packers and turned down there offer. Second he would complete suck at NT. Yes he's body is huge, but a huge body doesn't mean your any good at football. Cole suck at two gap which is what the NT usually (not always depending on the system) does. Cole would more likely be a DE. Because all he's good at is bull rushing one on one.

The two players currently on the Roster that can play good at two gap NT are Pickett and Harrell (if healthy). Maybe somebody else grow into it or one of the younger guys I haven't seen much of could also.....

Jolly, Jenkins, Harrell, Cole (if he resigns) and Montgomery (if he resigns) could play DE in this system. (Kampman could too but sounds like they are making him an OLB)

Also I would be looking at those DTs from Boston College in the draft and a few others because I think the Packers need more DL.
all_about_da_packers  
#22 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:13:10 AM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
The two players currently on the Roster that can play good at two gap NT are Pickett and Harrell (if healthy). Maybe somebody else grow into it or one of the younger guys I haven't seen much of could also....


Harrell is interesting because he is very strong, and has the ability to become a NT if he fills out even more.

My only problem with Harrell though is that he will struggle with added bulk, because I feel he needs to be a bit more bulky to fit as a NT. Harrell has said in the past he'd prefer to play around 310, which is what he played at in college. That makes him a difficult fit for a NT.

I still think Jolly is our second NT, more so than a DE. He's listed at 320, but I'd guess he's at least 330. He's got a thick body, very instinctive, and frankly he plays with an attitude. I think he's got the tools to be a very effective NT.
dfosterf  
#23 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 12:35:35 PM(UTC)
Have you fellas ever heard of the planet theory? There is a strong argument made that this theory is what brought Justin Harrell to the Packers at 16. There are several articles available to explain. In a google box, type in "planet theory nfl" (without the quotes) I found the athelon article particularly enlightening... So many said (and say) we "reached" for Justin, and "blame" Ted Thompson for doing so. I recommend all take a moment to do this little google exercise, especially as we debate the merits of B.J. Raji, for example.
Pack93z  
#24 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 1:22:59 PM(UTC)
That is why Pieria Jerry will begin to rocket up boards.. with the show he is putting on at the Senior Bowl.. he will climb the draft boards.

Raji as well.. both have shown that they can penetrate, take on the doubles and both look pretty unstoppable against any of the oline talent at the senior bowl.

Read complete article...

Quote:
The famous Planet Theory originated by the late great N.Y. Giants executive George Young and popularized by Parcells states that there are a finite number of athletic 300-pounders on Earth. And when a team has a chance to draft one, it should.
Megatron  
#25 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 1:42:57 PM(UTC)
i've been reading good things about Pieria Jerry but my biggest knock against him is his age. He will be 25 by the time next season comes around. At that age he got to be ready to play in the NFL straight away otherwise we would have to wait a year or two for him to finally come good. By then he could be 27!! investing a high draft pick for him is a risk as it means if he does come good, you could only get maybe 3 or 4 years out of him before he his production starts declining.

A player in the same position is Ziggy Hood is 22 and has apparently impressed in the senior bowl with his vast array of pass rush moves. A high draft pick for him is fine because you could have him producing at a high level for a longer period of time even with the inital adjustment period to the NFL before he starts producing consistently.
Pack93z  
#26 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 2:18:29 PM(UTC)
Megatron... +1.

Excellent point.. if the talent projection is high enough it still makes sense, but it factors in as well.
dfosterf  
#27 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 3:44:43 PM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
The two players currently on the Roster that can play good at two gap NT are Pickett and Harrell (if healthy). Maybe somebody else grow into it or one of the younger guys I haven't seen much of could also....


Harrell is interesting because he is very strong, and has the ability to become a NT if he fills out even more.

My only problem with Harrell though is that he will struggle with added bulk, because I feel he needs to be a bit more bulky to fit as a NT. Harrell has said in the past he'd prefer to play around 310, which is what he played at in college. That makes him a difficult fit for a NT.

I still think Jolly is our second NT, more so than a DE. He's listed at 320, but I'd guess he's at least 330. He's got a thick body, very instinctive, and frankly he plays with an attitude. I think he's got the tools to be a very effective NT.


If Jolly isn't in prison.

As to Justin, I have read your posts in this thread, and think you have it just about pegged. Harrell WAS pegged as a "two gap" DT out of college, but everything I have read would indicate that he is a natural DE in the 3-4, at a playing weight of around 300-310. The one thing that is missing on the "great search" is this... we last left off as regards Justin with him not being able to play vs. Chicago, and probably requiring more surgery. Just like last year, he then fell off the radar, except for the bitching about him as a bust.

I want to know where he is, what he is doing, has he been told what he is projected to be doing in this scheme, is he getting surgery or not, is he eating his mom's cooking again down in Tennessee, is he in Green Bay... I want this fat f#$k WATCHED. He has until the end of training camp, from my view.
Nonstopdrivel  
#28 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 4:15:19 PM(UTC)
I don't want to see Harrell put on injured reserve again. If he's not fit to make the roster from Game 1 of next season, I want him CUT.
go.pack.go.  
#29 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:18:59 PM(UTC)
May be off topic, but what exactly did Jolly do to get him in legal trouble? Could he really go to prison, or would he get suspended by the NFL?
dfosterf  
#30 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:32:20 PM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
May be off topic, but what exactly did Jolly do to get him in legal trouble? Could he really go to prison, or would he get suspended by the NFL?


Link:

Jolly decides to open a cough syrup factory
go.pack.go.  
#31 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:39:26 PM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
May be off topic, but what exactly did Jolly do to get him in legal trouble? Could he really go to prison, or would he get suspended by the NFL?


Link:

Jolly decides to open a cough syrup factory


Wow, what I'm wondering is why didn't they take action before the season? If they were going to do something, wouldn't they have already done it?
Nonstopdrivel  
#32 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:47:33 PM(UTC)
I want to go on record and say that I think it's ridiculous this nation can consider putting a man in prison for having too much cough syrup. I sincerely hope that one day this nation has the moral courage to reexamine the Controlled Substances Act and abandon a set of flawed laws that imprisons nonviolent people for no other reason than they want to feel good. I find it to be a national embarrassment that the nation who claims to be the "Land of the Free" has more people per capita in prison than any other country on the face of the planet -- and that goes for Communist China and formerly Soviet Russia.
dfosterf  
#33 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:49:24 PM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
May be off topic, but what exactly did Jolly do to get him in legal trouble? Could he really go to prison, or would he get suspended by the NFL?


Link:

Jolly decides to open a cough syrup factory


Wow, what I'm wondering is why didn't they take action before the season? If they were going to do something, wouldn't they have already done it?


This should answer all of your questions.

Link:

Jolly in trouble
Nonstopdrivel  
#34 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:53:43 PM(UTC)
Foster, what is your theory as to why they haven't moved yet on Jolly? Is it simply because he has a clean record prior to this incident?
dfosterf  
#35 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:00:19 PM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
Foster, what is your theory as to why they haven't moved yet on Jolly? Is it simply because he has a clean record prior to this incident?


Yes. The consensus is that because he has no "priors", the commish is waiting for the legal system to extract the pound of flesh prior to acting. It does NOT minimize the potential trouble he is in. "Purple Drank" is apparently a popular drug of choice in Texas, but the law is the law. For perspective, Robitussin AG contains about 10mg of codeine. He got popped with 200 grams... not of Robitussin, but codeine, hence the "factory" joke, but the reality is that it isn't very funny. He could easily wind up in prison, and that is a no sh!tter.

(Obviously not for your edification, Nonstop--- 1 Mg=1/1000 gram)
Nonstopdrivel  
#36 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:10:52 PM(UTC)
He certainly could, and while under the law of the land, he deserves it, I find the law itself embarrassing. You may be sure that if I am ever summoned to jury duty for a drug case, I will exercise my absolute right as an informed juror to practice Jury Nullification, render the law effectively null and void, and let the guy off the hook.

(Obviously, I'm talking about possession offenses here. I wouldn't excuse someone who murdered or raped another while under the influence.)
dfosterf  
#37 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:19:39 PM(UTC)
I haven't brought this up, because every time I do something like this, bad things happen. My theory is that Jolly is in one hell of a lot more trouble than people realize. Look at this link. Look at where the subject of the link is from. I hope a judge does not see this.

Link:

Terrence Kiel
Nonstopdrivel  
#38 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:23:41 PM(UTC)
If he really is in deep trouble, I'm surprised the media hasn't made more of it. There have been few leaks, hardly any whispers. I have a hard time remembering a legal proceeding that has been kept so successfully under wraps.

It strikes me, too, that if the Packers suspected he were truly in trouble, they would divest themselves of him as soon as possible to free up a roster spot before the draft. Unless they're hoping to use him as competition to force this year's draft picks to step their game up.

Thoughts?
dfosterf  
#39 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:32:43 PM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
If he really is in deep trouble, I'm surprised the media hasn't made more of it. There have been few leaks, hardly any whispers. I have a hard time remembering a legal proceeding that has been kept so successfully under wraps.

It strikes me, too, that if the Packers suspected he were truly in trouble, they would divest themselves of him as soon as possible to free up a roster spot before the draft. Unless they're hoping to use him as competition to force this year's draft picks to step their game up.

Thoughts?


Well, Kiel got his wrist slapped, at least by the legal system. I'm not inferring that Jolly has a "problem", btw... I'm pointing out that perhaps a Texas Judge and the league will look at what happened to Kiel and decide to take a more "proactive" approach with Jolly. I am alarmed that this thing is going to court... that COULD be because Jolly wanted to play this season, but it could just as easily be due to the prosecutor saying (if only to himself) "Well, we gave that other NFL guy a "pass", and now he's dead. Not this time." In other words, "NO DEAL". Who knows? I'm just pointing out that the ingredients are there for this to be very, very bad.
Since69  
#40 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 8:56:38 PM(UTC)
Starting to get a real good feeling about B.J. Raji.

From this page...

Quote:
Raji, who projects as a nose tackle in the 3-4, is physically similar to Packers tackle Ryan Pickett. Raji stood 6-2 and weighed 334 pounds at the Senior Bowl. At the combine in 2001 when he entered the draft, Pickett was 6-2 and 309, although he's closer to 350 now.

But the big difference in the two players is quickness off the ball. There wasn't a quicker tackle at the Senior Bowl. That's a 3-4 asset because if a player can shoot a gap, the offensive linemen might have to double-team him. That leaves other players unblocked.

The prototypical 3-4 NFL nose tackle is the 6-1, 323-pound Vince Wilfork of the New England Patriots. Wilfork is stronger but Raji is taller, just as heavy and quicker.

"The Packers were asking me where I felt comfortable playing," Raji said. "I definitely can do it. I'd love to do it. I'm their man if they need a nose tackle. Bring it on."
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