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Offline Pack93z  
#26 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 2:18:29 PM(UTC)
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Megatron... +1.

Excellent point.. if the talent projection is high enough it still makes sense, but it factors in as well.
I think when there's enough will and aggression, there's no shortage of talent either.

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Offline dfosterf  
#27 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 3:44:43 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
The two players currently on the Roster that can play good at two gap NT are Pickett and Harrell (if healthy). Maybe somebody else grow into it or one of the younger guys I haven't seen much of could also....


Harrell is interesting because he is very strong, and has the ability to become a NT if he fills out even more.

My only problem with Harrell though is that he will struggle with added bulk, because I feel he needs to be a bit more bulky to fit as a NT. Harrell has said in the past he'd prefer to play around 310, which is what he played at in college. That makes him a difficult fit for a NT.

I still think Jolly is our second NT, more so than a DE. He's listed at 320, but I'd guess he's at least 330. He's got a thick body, very instinctive, and frankly he plays with an attitude. I think he's got the tools to be a very effective NT.


If Jolly isn't in prison.

As to Justin, I have read your posts in this thread, and think you have it just about pegged. Harrell WAS pegged as a "two gap" DT out of college, but everything I have read would indicate that he is a natural DE in the 3-4, at a playing weight of around 300-310. The one thing that is missing on the "great search" is this... we last left off as regards Justin with him not being able to play vs. Chicago, and probably requiring more surgery. Just like last year, he then fell off the radar, except for the bitching about him as a bust.

I want to know where he is, what he is doing, has he been told what he is projected to be doing in this scheme, is he getting surgery or not, is he eating his mom's cooking again down in Tennessee, is he in Green Bay... I want this fat f#$k WATCHED. He has until the end of training camp, from my view.
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Offline Nonstopdrivel  
#28 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 4:15:19 PM(UTC)
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I don't want to see Harrell put on injured reserve again. If he's not fit to make the roster from Game 1 of next season, I want him CUT.
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Offline go.pack.go.  
#29 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:18:59 PM(UTC)
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May be off topic, but what exactly did Jolly do to get him in legal trouble? Could he really go to prison, or would he get suspended by the NFL?
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Offline dfosterf  
#30 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:32:20 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
May be off topic, but what exactly did Jolly do to get him in legal trouble? Could he really go to prison, or would he get suspended by the NFL?


Link:

Jolly decides to open a cough syrup factory
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Offline go.pack.go.  
#31 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:39:26 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
May be off topic, but what exactly did Jolly do to get him in legal trouble? Could he really go to prison, or would he get suspended by the NFL?


Link:

Jolly decides to open a cough syrup factory


Wow, what I'm wondering is why didn't they take action before the season? If they were going to do something, wouldn't they have already done it?
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Offline Nonstopdrivel  
#32 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:47:33 PM(UTC)
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I want to go on record and say that I think it's ridiculous this nation can consider putting a man in prison for having too much cough syrup. I sincerely hope that one day this nation has the moral courage to reexamine the Controlled Substances Act and abandon a set of flawed laws that imprisons nonviolent people for no other reason than they want to feel good. I find it to be a national embarrassment that the nation who claims to be the "Land of the Free" has more people per capita in prison than any other country on the face of the planet -- and that goes for Communist China and formerly Soviet Russia.
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Offline dfosterf  
#33 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:49:24 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
May be off topic, but what exactly did Jolly do to get him in legal trouble? Could he really go to prison, or would he get suspended by the NFL?


Link:

Jolly decides to open a cough syrup factory


Wow, what I'm wondering is why didn't they take action before the season? If they were going to do something, wouldn't they have already done it?


This should answer all of your questions.

Link:

Jolly in trouble
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Offline Nonstopdrivel  
#34 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 5:53:43 PM(UTC)
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Foster, what is your theory as to why they haven't moved yet on Jolly? Is it simply because he has a clean record prior to this incident?
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Offline dfosterf  
#35 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:00:19 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Foster, what is your theory as to why they haven't moved yet on Jolly? Is it simply because he has a clean record prior to this incident?


Yes. The consensus is that because he has no "priors", the commish is waiting for the legal system to extract the pound of flesh prior to acting. It does NOT minimize the potential trouble he is in. "Purple Drank" is apparently a popular drug of choice in Texas, but the law is the law. For perspective, Robitussin AG contains about 10mg of codeine. He got popped with 200 grams... not of Robitussin, but codeine, hence the "factory" joke, but the reality is that it isn't very funny. He could easily wind up in prison, and that is a no sh!tter.

(Obviously not for your edification, Nonstop--- 1 Mg=1/1000 gram)
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Offline Nonstopdrivel  
#36 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:10:52 PM(UTC)
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He certainly could, and while under the law of the land, he deserves it, I find the law itself embarrassing. You may be sure that if I am ever summoned to jury duty for a drug case, I will exercise my absolute right as an informed juror to practice Jury Nullification, render the law effectively null and void, and let the guy off the hook.

(Obviously, I'm talking about possession offenses here. I wouldn't excuse someone who murdered or raped another while under the influence.)
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Offline dfosterf  
#37 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:19:39 PM(UTC)
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I haven't brought this up, because every time I do something like this, bad things happen. My theory is that Jolly is in one hell of a lot more trouble than people realize. Look at this link. Look at where the subject of the link is from. I hope a judge does not see this.

Link:

Terrence Kiel
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Offline Nonstopdrivel  
#38 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:23:41 PM(UTC)
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If he really is in deep trouble, I'm surprised the media hasn't made more of it. There have been few leaks, hardly any whispers. I have a hard time remembering a legal proceeding that has been kept so successfully under wraps.

It strikes me, too, that if the Packers suspected he were truly in trouble, they would divest themselves of him as soon as possible to free up a roster spot before the draft. Unless they're hoping to use him as competition to force this year's draft picks to step their game up.

Thoughts?
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Offline dfosterf  
#39 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:32:43 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
If he really is in deep trouble, I'm surprised the media hasn't made more of it. There have been few leaks, hardly any whispers. I have a hard time remembering a legal proceeding that has been kept so successfully under wraps.

It strikes me, too, that if the Packers suspected he were truly in trouble, they would divest themselves of him as soon as possible to free up a roster spot before the draft. Unless they're hoping to use him as competition to force this year's draft picks to step their game up.

Thoughts?


Well, Kiel got his wrist slapped, at least by the legal system. I'm not inferring that Jolly has a "problem", btw... I'm pointing out that perhaps a Texas Judge and the league will look at what happened to Kiel and decide to take a more "proactive" approach with Jolly. I am alarmed that this thing is going to court... that COULD be because Jolly wanted to play this season, but it could just as easily be due to the prosecutor saying (if only to himself) "Well, we gave that other NFL guy a "pass", and now he's dead. Not this time." In other words, "NO DEAL". Who knows? I'm just pointing out that the ingredients are there for this to be very, very bad.
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Offline Since69  
#40 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 8:56:38 PM(UTC)
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Starting to get a real good feeling about B.J. Raji.

From this page...

Quote:
Raji, who projects as a nose tackle in the 3-4, is physically similar to Packers tackle Ryan Pickett. Raji stood 6-2 and weighed 334 pounds at the Senior Bowl. At the combine in 2001 when he entered the draft, Pickett was 6-2 and 309, although he's closer to 350 now.

But the big difference in the two players is quickness off the ball. There wasn't a quicker tackle at the Senior Bowl. That's a 3-4 asset because if a player can shoot a gap, the offensive linemen might have to double-team him. That leaves other players unblocked.

The prototypical 3-4 NFL nose tackle is the 6-1, 323-pound Vince Wilfork of the New England Patriots. Wilfork is stronger but Raji is taller, just as heavy and quicker.

"The Packers were asking me where I felt comfortable playing," Raji said. "I definitely can do it. I'd love to do it. I'm their man if they need a nose tackle. Bring it on."
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Offline Nonstopdrivel  
#41 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 10:16:46 PM(UTC)
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Quote:
General manager Ted Thompson has said publicly that the Green Bay Packers' switch to a 3-4 defense is "not a big deal."


I bet Ted Thompson plays a mean game of poker. He is dead set on not revealing too much of his strategy to the rest of the world. While to a certain extent I'm sure he's telling the truth, since the team plans to run a hybrid defense, I think we can be fairly certain it will be a bigger deal than he's letting on. Unless he's trying to signal that the Packers' primary focus in the draft will in fact be offense, not defense. This I find hard to believe, however.
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Offline toronto_cheesehead  
#42 Posted : Saturday, January 24, 2009 11:04:42 PM(UTC)
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CNNSI story

It's comforting to hear that Capers has successfully transitioned a 4-3 DE into a 3-4 OLB when he was with Jacksonville.
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Offline Megatron  
#43 Posted : Monday, January 26, 2009 12:27:53 PM(UTC)
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Read this, it's quite eye opening.

www.milehighreport.com wrote:
As best I can tell, there are 9 teams in the NFL that primarily ran a 3-4 defense this season: Baltimore, Pittsburgh, Dallas, San Diego, New England, New York (Jets), Miami, San Francisco, and Cleveland.

This means that there are 9 starting Nose Tackles right now: Haloti Ngata, Casey Hampton, Jay Ratliff, Jamal Williams, Vince Wilfork, Kris Jenkins, Jason Ferguson, Isaac Sopoaga, and Shaun Rogers.

Of the 9 NT's:

3 are 1st round picks (Ngata, Hampton, and Wilfork)

3 are second round picks (Wiliams, Jenkins, and Rogers)

3 are later round picks (Ferguson, Sopoaga, and Rogers).

3 have played for more than one NFL team (Rogers, Jenkins and, Ferguson) and only Jason Ferguson has played for more than one 3-4 team.


What's immediately evident in those numbers is just how hard it is to get a nose tackle. Once a 3-4 team gets a good NT, they pretty much don't give him up


We have the 9th pick. 49ers have the 10th pick and Denver who will almost certainly need a NT has the 12th pick. All are 3-4 teams so i just cannot see Ted Thompson trading down. Unless he identified someone who is as can be as good as Raji but at a better value which is unlikely.

I would be amazed if we dont go for a NT with our 1st pick. Guys of that size and quality are hard to come by and we dont want to miss our chance of getting a good one.

It would be good to have an insurance policy in case Pickett needs a breather during the game or he gets injured. You can never have enough good NT's considering the importance of that position.
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Offline bozz_2006  
#44 Posted : Monday, January 26, 2009 3:25:05 PM(UTC)
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I wouldn't be surprised to see Denver or San Francisco trade up to "steal" Raji, regardless of whether we have actually targeted him.
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Offline beast  
#45 Posted : Monday, January 26, 2009 4:34:01 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
I wouldn't be surprised to see Denver or San Francisco trade up to "steal" Raji, regardless of whether we have actually targeted him.


I could really see that.
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Offline warhawk  
#46 Posted : Monday, January 26, 2009 4:38:46 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
I wouldn't be surprised to see Denver or San Francisco trade up to "steal" Raji, regardless of whether we have actually targeted him.


Both of those teams need a LOT of players. While it's always possible I kind of doubt it. I would be more worried about a team that runs the 3-4 that has all the components but a NT. Tha'ts the team that can afford sacrificing other picks for the guy.
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Offline bozz_2006  
#47 Posted : Monday, January 26, 2009 5:00:40 PM(UTC)
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prudence is a slim commodity in the NFL. especially when it comes to a role like NT that is so hard to fill. see: planet theory. if you get an athletic big man, you can't assume that another one will come along next year.
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