Zero2Cool
6 years ago
.... annnnnnnnnnnnnd suddenly Mason just made a lot of enemies

Why didn't Mike McCarthy fire Dom Capers? The answer: Mason Crosby

What do a once-struggling kicker and a defensive coordinator who has been a punching bag for the Green Bay Packers' fan base have in common?

Coach Mike McCarthy has stuck with both of them.

In the case of Mason Crosby, his slump of 2012 didn’t cost him his job, and he’s turned into one of the most reliable kickers ever since.

McCarthy appears to have applied that same line of thinking with Dom Capers, the 66-year-old who is returning for his ninth season in charge of the Packers defense despite coaching a unit that ranked 31st in the NFL in passing yards allowed last season and had another playoff meltdown.

“Well, going back to the Mason Crosby comment, and obviously applying that to the question about Dom, I think it’s important to recognize, as far answering your question about it being easy to make that change, it would give everybody a breath of fresh air,” McCarthy said during an interview that aired Thursday on ESPN Milwaukee.

Continue Reading @ ESPN 

ESPN wrote:


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DarkaneRules
6 years ago
Gotta give the man some players and then those players have got to stay healthy.
Circular Arguments: They are a heck of an annoyance
PackFanWithTwins
6 years ago
From what I can see watching the games. Dom has players in the right positions for them to try and make plays. It is up to the players to do that. I can't blame Dom for player failures.
The world needs ditch diggers too Danny!!!
Smokey
6 years ago
So you want to bash the Packers Defensive Coordinator Dom Capers, well your free to do so. However let's just look at the man's record.

Coach Capers will this season enter his 45th year in couching. His first 12 seasons at the college level, with 9 of those years couching the DB's . In 1984 he moved on to the pros , serving with 8 pro teams (7 NFL). Twice he was the Head Coach of new teams, Carolina and Houston, where he got them off to good starts .

Dom Capers is very smart too. He holds a degree in Physical Education and a minor in Psychology , then added a masters in Administration. Over his years as Head Coach and as Defensive Coordinator he has had some of the NFL's highest ranked defenses.

So why has this smart, accomplished coach had such a difficult road the past few seasons ? IMO , it was a combination of injuries and poor player performance . I have a better feeling going into the 2017 season about the Packers Defense. In particular at the CB ans S positions. Coach Capers pretty much started out as a Defensive Backs Coach. In addition , I see Kevin King and even possibly Josh Jones contributing in a big way this season.


[cheers]

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yooperfan
6 years ago

Gotta give the man some players and then those players have got to stay healthy.

Originally Posted by: DarkaneRules 


There is the problem, Thompson has been terrible drafting on the defensive side of the ball.

beast
6 years ago
Honestly Crosby and Capers have a couple of items in common, starting with some of their struggles being way over blown and not their fault.


Did Crosby have a slump year? Yes, but it was waaaay over blown, Crosby was normal inside of 40 yards and had a minor slump between 41 and 50 yards... Crosby big problem was that someone else kept asking him to line up for 50+ yarders... I believe Crosby was asked to kick 9 different 50+ yard FGs, in a year that the average kicker was asked to kick less than 2.

So how was Crosby's problem solved? The coach finally figured out he was the problem and they started attempting punt the ball into the other teams 20 yard line, instead of attempting the 50+ FGs. Did Crosby slump? Yes a little bit... but the bigger problem was the Coach.


Similar problems have happened with Capers, have his defense struggled? Yes... but honestly how often has Capers been given a complete defense?

The Packers defense has had some enormousness talent gap holes in them, which is not the fault at Capers at all... after the Super Bowl, they lost some guys and had almost no pass rush... then lost Collins and had nothing other than Burnett on the back end (and with all due respect, Burnett struggled a lot at FS), then losing the CBs. There has always been a HUGE hole in the Packers talent level at important roles/positions. That's not Capers fault at all, if anyone is to blame for that it's Ted Thompson. And this year we're going into training camp with big questions at important positions again on defense. The one that concerns me the most is the lack of quality depth at OLB... and then there is also the CB questions.



But it's like Rex and Rob Ryan... they are twins, and both run the same defense and have the same over aggressive style. I would even argue that Rob Ryan has played smarter with his team... when they both faced that Packers in the same season on different teams... Rex kept blitzing Rodgers over and over and over... and Rodgers kept burning him on it. Rob was smarter, when Rodgers burned him on blitzes, he adjusted and sent everyone back into coverage.

So why is Rex's resume look so much better than Rob's? Because of the GMs and talent difference... before becoming a head coach, Rex coached under some good GMs that got him more defensive talent (though they sometime struggled on offense talent), while Rob has coached under some really, really bad GMs and his defenses had very little talent to work with.

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PackFanWithTwins
6 years ago

Honestly Crosby and Capers have a couple of items in common, starting with some of their struggles being way over blown and not their fault.


Did Crosby have a slump year? Yes, but it was waaaay over blown, Crosby was normal inside of 40 yards and had a minor slump between 41 and 50 yards... Crosby big problem was that someone else kept asking him to line up for 50+ yarders... I believe Crosby was asked to kick 9 different 50+ yard FGs, in a year that the average kicker was asked to kick less than 2.

So how was Crosby's problem solved? The coach finally figured out he was the problem and they started attempting punt the ball into the other teams 20 yard line, instead of attempting the 50+ FGs. Did Crosby slump? Yes a little bit... but the bigger problem was the Coach.

Originally Posted by: beast 



Crosby did actually have a kicking problem. If you go back and look, his misses were pretty much all knuckling not flying end over end like they should. they want the ball to spin for aerodynamics, the less spin the more the ball gets acted on as it passed through the air causing it the knuckle.


The world needs ditch diggers too Danny!!!
warhawk
6 years ago

The one that concerns me the most is the lack of quality depth at OLB... and then there is also the CB questions.

Originally Posted by: beast 


I agree for sure. I'm happy with how the draft fell and I think over time King/Biegel will contribute more than if they had gone with a TJ Watt. Here's to hoping so anyways. With the addition of King, Jones, and, House, this gives Capers many options to allow plugging these guys in where they can be most successful.

The bothersome part is that it would have been great to have addressed the OLB and pass rush issue first IMO. I say this because pass rushers can have a huge affect on pass coverage where pass cover guys don't affect the pass rushers. I knew, for example, half way thru the 1st quarter of the Atlanta game GB was in big trouble. No pressure on Ryan, great wr's, and they handed our asses to us. When it gets to playoff time most all the teams have good QB's, OL's, and Wr's. The only equalizer is getting to the QB NOT covering receivers longer.
What concerns me most about our pass rushers is Clay and Perry are the front line guys and they both have durability issues. You have to hope for a big jump from Elliot, Frackrell, some juice from Biegel, and some push from the interior guys. What absolutely cannot happen is for injuries to rip into the pass rushing group like it did to the WR group two years ago and to the CB's last year.


"The train is leaving the station."
beast
6 years ago

I agree for sure. I'm happy with how the draft fell and I think over time King/Biegel will contribute more than if they had gone with a TJ Watt. Here's to hoping so anyways. With the addition of King, Jones, and, House, this gives Capers many options to allow plugging these guys in where they can be most successful.

The bothersome part is that it would have been great to have addressed the OLB and pass rush issue first IMO. I say this because pass rushers can have a huge affect on pass coverage where pass cover guys don't affect the pass rushers. I knew, for example, half way thru the 1st quarter of the Atlanta game GB was in big trouble. No pressure on Ryan, great wr's, and they handed our asses to us. When it gets to playoff time most all the teams have good QB's, OL's, and Wr's. The only equalizer is getting to the QB NOT covering receivers longer.
What concerns me most about our pass rushers is Clay and Perry are the front line guys and they both have durability issues. You have to hope for a big jump from Elliot, Frackrell, some juice from Biegel, and some push from the interior guys. What absolutely cannot happen is for injuries to rip into the pass rushing group like it did to the WR group two years ago and to the CB's last year.

Originally Posted by: warhawk 



Yeah that's basically explains what I'm worried about... with the thin quality depth at OLB, injuries could potentially be a HUGE problem at the position... and that position effects the whole defense. One key injury could potentially ruin the entire defensive plans and force them into blitzing more. Which against good OL/QB that can handle the blitz well and find the open guy, that can be a bad thing.

Though, I think both Fackrell and Elliot have shown some surprisingly good pass rush in very limited snaps. Of course that's when they were fresh off the bench, going against guys that weren't fresh and there was a reason they were on the bench. But there is pass rush potential there... not sure about their run defense potential though.

Also all this means, they're counting on their DL more as well, which might be getting better.... as Clark and Lowry should be better their 2nd year (like more interior DL guys are normally much better than their rookie years), and adding Jean Francois and Adams should improve the depth and the interior pressure.
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yooperfan
6 years ago

Honestly Crosby and Capers have a couple of items in common, starting with some of their struggles being way over blown and not their fault.


Did Crosby have a slump year? Yes, but it was waaaay over blown, Crosby was normal inside of 40 yards and had a minor slump between 41 and 50 yards... Crosby big problem was that someone else kept asking him to line up for 50+ yarders... I believe Crosby was asked to kick 9 different 50+ yard FGs, in a year that the average kicker was asked to kick less than 2.

So how was Crosby's problem solved? The coach finally figured out he was the problem and they started attempting punt the ball into the other teams 20 yard line, instead of attempting the 50+ FGs. Did Crosby slump? Yes a little bit... but the bigger problem was the Coach.


Similar problems have happened with Capers, have his defense struggled? Yes... but honestly how often has Capers been given a complete defense?

The Packers defense has had some enormousness talent gap holes in them, which is not the fault at Capers at all... after the Super Bowl, they lost some guys and had almost no pass rush... then lost Collins and had nothing other than Burnett on the back end (and with all due respect, Burnett struggled a lot at FS), then losing the CBs. There has always been a HUGE hole in the Packers talent level at important roles/positions. That's not Capers fault at all, if anyone is to blame for that it's Ted Thompson. And this year we're going into training camp with big questions at important positions again on defense. The one that concerns me the most is the lack of quality depth at OLB... and then there is also the CB questions.



But it's like Rex and Rob Ryan... they are twins, and both run the same defense and have the same over aggressive style. I would even argue that Rob Ryan has played smarter with his team... when they both faced that Packers in the same season on different teams... Rex kept blitzing Rodgers over and over and over... and Rodgers kept burning him on it. Rob was smarter, when Rodgers burned him on blitzes, he adjusted and sent everyone back into coverage.

So why is Rex's resume look so much better than Rob's? Because of the GMs and talent difference... before becoming a head coach, Rex coached under some good GMs that got him more defensive talent (though they sometime struggled on offense talent), while Rob has coached under some really, really bad GMs and his defenses had very little talent to work with.

Originally Posted by: beast 


Excellent analysis!

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dhazer (3h) : Steelers sign Patterson because of new kickoff rule interesting
Zero2Cool (6h) : Former #Packers TE Josiah Deguara is signing a 1-year deal with the Jaguars, per source.
Zero2Cool (7h) : They do not do it for "content sake".
dfosterf (17h) : For the record, I enjoy Beast and Mucky drafts
Zero2Cool (27-Mar) : Haha
Mucky Tundra (27-Mar) : No time for talking! Back to work beast!
beast (27-Mar) : You saw only 4,201 of my mocks? 🥺 I think that means you missed more than half of them 😢
dfosterf (27-Mar) : Does anyone know what Lambeau field improvements got put on hold? My guess would be for the 2025 draft
Zero2Cool (27-Mar) : It's like listen, you made 4,201 mocks, no shit.
Zero2Cool (27-Mar) : Cuz during the draft "I had them mocked there!" as if it's amazing.
Zero2Cool (27-Mar) : They're fun to do once in awhile. It's people who think they are "content" that annoy me.
dfosterf (27-Mar) : Against tbd
dfosterf (27-Mar) : Answer to your question is yes, it's a Thursday, will be the Chiefs aga
dfosterf (27-Mar) : Luckily for all concerned, I don't post them. I did one, but that was like 25 mocks ago
Zero2Cool (27-Mar) : NFL 2024 gonna start Sept 5th isn't it???
Zero2Cool (27-Mar) : Ugh... kids these days!
dfosterf (27-Mar) : I'm gonna go do some more mock draft hell instead 🤪
Zero2Cool (27-Mar) : Did we do one of those prediction threads yet for 2024 season?
dfosterf (27-Mar) : In my city, they are playing the nimby game, in order to keep some railroad tracks vs. 2 professional sports teams and a concert venue.
dfosterf (27-Mar) : And/Or a city council, of which I haven't seen a good one in a very long time
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buckeyepackfan (26-Mar) : Packers halt scheduled 80mil upgrade of stadium until lease agreement talks are restarted
Zero2Cool (26-Mar) : City of Green Bay puts Packers' Lambeau Field lease talks on hold
buckeyepackfan (26-Mar) : Packers 1 of 3 teams to vote no on new kickoff rule.
Zero2Cool (26-Mar) : Packers sign another Kicker
dfosterf (26-Mar) : Lengthy explanation at PFF if you click the link
dfosterf (26-Mar) : Kickoff rules officially changed.ngthy explan
Zero2Cool (26-Mar) : lol
Cheesey (26-Mar) : 2009? No thanks! One open heart surgery is enough!
dfosterf (26-Mar) : Good for you!
Zero2Cool (26-Mar) : Yes. That's the one.
dfosterf (26-Mar) : Is that "Lady Dugan" per chance?
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Zero2Cool (26-Mar) : Alan posts. Crystal back in my life. It's 2009 all over again! Lol
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Zero2Cool (25-Mar) : Gutekunst said early stages of Jordan Love contract being discussed.
Zero2Cool (25-Mar) : Shouldn't be penalized cuz official screwed up
Zero2Cool (25-Mar) : Yeah, challenge until you are incorrect twice.
Zero2Cool (25-Mar) : Fining them is the goal, per the people who made the rule anyway.
dfosterf (25-Mar) : Still waiting on the kickoff rule changes. Did hear yesterday that the touchback proposal will now be the 30 yard line, not the 35
dfosterf (25-Mar) : Probably speed of game issues with your proposal
dfosterf (25-Mar) : Hopefully the refs don't get in the habit of throwing flags on this
beast (25-Mar) : I think when it comes to Challenges should get two strikes, so unlimited challenges as long as they keep winning them, but 2 wrong then done
dfosterf (25-Mar) : Still subject to the fines etc
dfosterf (25-Mar) : Yes, I should have been more specific. Also, they are now saying it would be a 15 yard penalty. That makes more sense .
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