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beast  
#1 Posted : Monday, March 4, 2019 4:59:41 PM(UTC)
All quote coming from this nfl.com article,.linked here

Quote:
Trent Brown, OT, New England Patriots

Dante Fowler Jr., OLB, Los Angeles Rams

Landon Collins, S, New York Giants

Ezekiel Ansah, DE, Detroit Lions

Rodger Saffold, OG, Los Angeles Rams (... or any other top interior OL)

Shane Ray, OLB, Denver Broncos

Clay Matthews and Randall Cobb, LB and WR, Green Bay Packers


Quote:
Landon Collins, S, New York Giants

If the Giants allow Collins to hit free agency rather than place the franchise tag on him, it's worth wondering why. A supernova in 2016, Collins hasn't quite reached that same All-Pro level the last two years. My biggest concern would be about how to use him. Collins wasn't able to play near the line of scrimmage as much in 2018, and the Giants admitted that he was used in coverage away from the ball more often than they would have preferred. But do you really want to pay more than $15 million per year for a safety whose strength isn't in coverage in the year 2019?
I think $15 million is a bit of an exaggeration on what he's looking for (though I could be wrong), currently top FS is getting $13 million per year, but it backs up my point that he's at his best as a SS and less coverage.

Quote:
On signing OGs to big money

There was scuttlebutt around Indianapolis last week that Saffold could become the highest-paid guard in football despite never making a Pro Bowl. Dynamic in the running game and on screens, Saffold is closer to average as a pass protector. He's a good player who is about to be paid like an absolute superstar as he enters his age 31 season and changes offensive systems.

There is this strange bromide often repeated at this time of year about guards in the draft being "plug-and-play 10-year starters" or free-agent guards being "safe pickups," but a look at recent interior lineman getting big money in free agency reveals results as mixed as any other position, with Jaguars guard Andrew Norwell, Bucs center Ryan Jensen, 49ers center Weston Richburg, Browns guard Kevin Zeitler, former Vikings guard Alex Boone and Lions guard T.J. Lang among the big-ticket items since 2016.

Saffold is my favorite interior lineman available, but paying him more than $12 million per year is a tell that a team can't develop its own guys.
Yes it would be nice to develop your own so you don't have pay an OG that huge contract.
Zero2Cool  
#2 Posted : Saturday, March 9, 2019 7:24:28 AM(UTC)
Fowler would be interesting. I liked him out of college
KRK  
#3 Posted : Monday, March 11, 2019 4:43:04 PM(UTC)
Could someone explain how an incentive laden contract works vis a vis the salary cap?
For example, if I were to say to Earl Thomas, “I will give you
- an $6 million Signing bonus
- a salary guaranteed of $8mm for 3 yrs
- if we win the NFC chmp $3 mil bonus
- if we win Super Bowl a $3 mil bonus”
what is his cap number...and when?
buckeyepackfan  
#4 Posted : Monday, March 11, 2019 5:27:30 PM(UTC)
KRK said: Go to Quoted Post
Could someone explain how an incentive laden contract works vis a vis the salary cap?
For example, if I were to say to Earl Thomas, “I will give you
- an $6 million Signing bonus
- a salary guaranteed of $8mm for 3 yrs
- if we win the NFC chmp $3 mil bonus
- if we win Super Bowl a $3 mil bonus”
what is his cap number...and when?


I am thinking you mean 8mil a year for 3 years
100% guaranteed
24 + 6 = 30 mil would be spread out over 3 years.
10mil per year.

Bonuses are capped when they are paid.

That is why you have workout bonuses, active gameday bonuses, even %of plays played bonuses.

Those all can be figured in at beginning of the year, then adjusted.

There are performance bonuses.
From what I have read those bonuses are not figured in at the beginning of the year, but the cap hit is adjusted if the bonuses are made.

Im sure it is more complicated, thats why guys like Russ Ball make big bucks and are considered one of the most important people in the building.

I don't think there are any bonuses for making NFC Championship or Super Bowl.

Players just get paid the set amount to play in the game.
Does not effect cap.
KRK  
#5 Posted : Monday, March 11, 2019 5:51:51 PM(UTC)
Buckeye,
tyvm.

It seems to me I would want guys who want team v individual bonuses.
Nonstopdrivel  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, March 12, 2019 9:34:52 AM(UTC)
It also matters if bonuses are designated (by the league/CBA) as "likely to be earned" or "unlikely to be earned," but I'm not exactly sure what the specific salary-cap ramifications of those designations are.
Zero2Cool  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, March 12, 2019 9:42:57 AM(UTC)
Something to remember about contract numbers right now is most of them are from the agents. How many times do we see four for sixty six and think HOLY CRAP and then realize it's really a two year deal with an out. It happens every year. We have to wait until the full details come out.
buckeyepackfan  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, March 12, 2019 10:11:58 AM(UTC)
Zero2Cool said: Go to Quoted Post
Something to remember about contract numbers right now is most of them are from the agents. How many times do we see four for sixty six and think HOLY CRAP and then realize it's really a two year deal with an out. It happens every year. We have to wait until the full details come out.


"Guaranteed Money" is what you want to look at in most contracts.
Thats where the majority of "dead money" comes from..
sschind  
#9 Posted : Wednesday, March 13, 2019 3:14:23 PM(UTC)
KRK said: Go to Quoted Post
Could someone explain how an incentive laden contract works vis a vis the salary cap?
For example, if I were to say to Earl Thomas, “I will give you
- an $6 million Signing bonus
- a salary guaranteed of $8mm for 3 yrs
- if we win the NFC chmp $3 mil bonus
- if we win Super Bowl a $3 mil bonus”
what is his cap number...and when?


Nonstopdrivel said: Go to Quoted Post
It also matters if bonuses are designated (by the league/CBA) as "likely to be earned" or "unlikely to be earned," but I'm not exactly sure what the specific salary-cap ramifications of those designations are.


This is real long so you have been warned.

likely to be earned incentive is one that a player had achieved the year before. An unlikely to be earned incentive is if the player didn't earn it the year before. In KRKs example since the Seahawks did not win the NFC Championship or the SB last year both 3 million dollar bonuses would be "unlikely to be achieved" They would not count against the cap in 2019 If the Packers did win the SB he would earn both bonuses and they would count against next years cap.

I'm going to make a couple of assumptions. (1) you mean 8 million a year for 3 years guaranteed (like Buckeye suggested) if you did mean 8 million OVER 3 years you can subtract 5.3 million from the total I give you. (2) the salary is the same for each of the three years (not 6 million, 8 and 10 or some other breakdown) (3) the 3 million dollar incentives for NFCC and SB wins are in place for each of the three years. Finally, just to make my numbers clearer we assume the years are 2019, 2020, and 2021

2019) The cap hit for 2019 would be 2 million in signing bonus (6 million /3 years) plus year 1 salary. If you mean 8 million a year for 3 yrs guaranteed (like Buckeye said) it would be a 10 million. If you mean 8 million over 3 years guaranteed it would be 4.667 million cap hit in There would be no incentives paid in 2019 and the incentives are considered unlikely to be earned so they wouldn't count against the cap.

If the Packers do not go to the SB in 2019 the 2020 cap hit would be the same as 2019 (10 million)

2020) If the Packers win the SB in 2019 his 2020 cap for salary and signing bonus would be the same as 2019 (again assuming an equal split for salary) Then you would add the the 6 million in incentives he earned for winning the SB in 2019. Since they were actually earned in 2109 but not counted against the cap in 2019 they would be counted against the cap in 2020. That brings us up to 16 million for 2020. But we are not done. Since he won the SB in 2019 the 6 million dollars in incentives for 2020 would now be considered likely to be earned (since he earned them the year before) and they would count in the current year. For a total of 22 million cap hit in 2020. If the lose the SB in 2019 only the NFCC incentive would count so it would be 16 million for 2020

2021)If they do not make the SB in 2020 his cap hit for 2021 would be salary + signing bonus (10 million) since no incentive was earned in 2020 there would be no cap hit for them. BUT since they counted 6 million in likely to be earned bonuses in 2020 that he did not actually earn they would get a credit of 6 million in 2021 so their cap hit in 2021 would be 4 million.

If they win the SB in 2020 his cap hit for 2021 would be 10 million plus 6 million for the likely to be earned incentives (because he earned them in 2020.) However, because his incentives for wining the SB in 2020 were counted against the 2020 cap (they were likely to be earned in 2020 so they counted in 2020) they would not count against the 2021 cap for a total of 16 million.

If they do not make the SB in 2019 or 2020 but win it in 2021 the packers would carry a 6 million dollar dead cap hit in 2022 because the incentives were always considered unlikely to be earned and thus not counted against the current years cap Since he earned them in 2021 they need to be accounted for in 2022.

If they win the SB in 2020 and 2021 they will not have any dead money in 2022 because the 6 million incentive for 2021 would have been counted against the cap in 2021.

Lastly I figured it as if he played out all three years. If they cut him after 2019 the 4 million left for the signing bonus (they counted 2 in 2019) would be dead money as would 1/2 the remaining guaranteed salary and would go against the 2020 cap and the remaining 1/2 of the guaranteed salary would still count against the 2021 cap. If they cut him after 2020 they would count 2 million from the signing bonus and the remainder of the guaranteed salary in 2021. This assumes no SB wins in 201 or 2020

I am fairly confident I got this all right. It looks confusing because it is and because of the incentives. Since we are going to three peat I bolded the appropriate cap figures for each year. You would need to adjust downward for any SB loss since only 1 incentive would be earned.

You can see why teams may be reluctant to do this. In this example they would have to account for an additional 12 million in cap money in 2020 if they win the SB in 2019. It would be worth it for sure but it could mean having to do something drastic to fit it in.

Likely to be earned incentives are easier because they count right now but unlikely to be earned can add a surprise cap hit if the player gets hot. Lets just say for example the offer Kizer a 10 million dollar bonus for 2019 if he makes the pro bowl. Its a good target for him to shoot for and it seems pretty safe for the Packers since they hope he never sees the field. They are fine for 2019 because he didn't make the probowl in 2018 so the unlikely to be earned incentive doesn't count against the 2019 cap but if Rodgers goes down and Kizer plays lights out and makes the pro bowl the Packers will have to count an additional 10 million in 2020.

If you have a headache after reading all that how do you think I feel. Blink Hope it helps a little.
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