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Offline blueleopard  
#76 Posted : Sunday, December 2, 2012 6:17:22 PM(UTC)
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Starks should get more carries. Guys a whole lot more explosive than Green.
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Offline Rios39  
#77 Posted : Sunday, December 2, 2012 6:24:41 PM(UTC)
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I liked the balance between the 2 RB actually they both being something different. I seem a bit of help on the right side but it was on and off. It wasn't every play
blank
Offline nerdmann  
#78 Posted : Sunday, December 2, 2012 6:45:57 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: blueleopard Go to Quoted Post
Starks should get more carries. Guys a whole lot more explosive than Green.



Starks: 4.4

Green: 4.8
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline nerdmann  
#79 Posted : Sunday, December 2, 2012 6:47:23 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: 68md Go to Quoted Post
Barclay had help the whole game in pass protection and still got flagged for holding...granted he was solid considering the situation but game ball ? Shame on you

Burnett's first INT turned the game around ..... Queens never overcame it.



Barclay showed that the season isn't over without Lang. GAME BALL.

As for Burnett, the season may have turned on that first INT. Dude's been around INTs all season, but hasn't been hanging onto them.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline wpr  
#80 Posted : Sunday, December 2, 2012 7:25:26 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: 68md Go to Quoted Post
Barclay had help the whole game in pass protection and still got flagged for holding...granted he was solid considering the situation but game ball ? Shame on you

Burnett's first INT turned the game around ..... Queens never overcame it.



I concur. Barclay had a decent game but he did have help on frequent plays. The holding penalty was half on AR. Barclay had to do something when Rodgers ran past both of them.
And a whiff is a whiff. It doesn't matter that it worked out well and Starks got the TD. It was no thanks to Barclay. It is similar to a db who is out of position and makes gets a pick because the pass in off target and the receiver tips it.
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Offline nerdmann  
#81 Posted : Sunday, December 2, 2012 7:56:52 PM(UTC)
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Quote:
Against a dangerous Vikings front four, Barclay held his own. Both Rodgers and McCarthy said that the offense didn't need to do anything differently in the second half with the undrafted rookie in the game. McCarthy said he didn't need to dull down his playcalling.

"There’s no surprise for me to see him play, especially as physical," McCarthy said. "He’s a physical guy, he’s a tough guy. He’s what you’re looking for as far as your right tackle, as far as your attitude and he gave us a chance to just keep playing today, and that’s all you ever ask for out of a young rookie when he comes in."


Quote:
Barclay did get some occasional help from a back or tight end and managed to keep Brian Robison (two tackles, no sacks) at bay. In the run game, Barclay swung wide and cut off outside linebacker Erin Henderson on James Starks' 22-yard touchdown run.


“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline doddpower  
#82 Posted : Sunday, December 2, 2012 8:35:30 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: wpr Go to Quoted Post
I concur. Barclay had a decent game but he did have help on frequent plays. The holding penalty was half on AR. Barclay had to do something when Rodgers ran past both of them.
And a whiff is a whiff. It doesn't matter that it worked out well and Starks got the TD. It was no thanks to Barclay. It is similar to a db who is out of position and makes gets a pick because the pass in off target and the receiver tips it.


I disagree on the whiff. Had Barclay not been there, there's not way the defender shoots inside like that. Yes, it probably didn't matter if it had been Barclay or anyone else, but the fact of the matter is that the presence of Barclay made the defender make a decision, and it was one that benefited the Packers. The end kind of justifies the means here. If the defender made the right cut and blew up the play, it'd be a different story, but he didn't. Barclay didn't actually block him, but that guy didn't make the play, so the end result is the same. That one play doesn't concern me at all. It's easy to miss quicker defenders in space. Sometimes it's best to just get in the way or be in the right place and the right time, and in this case, Barclay was.

The main concern should still be his pass protection, as it wasn't great. His run blocking was pretty good. I thought his pass blocking was no worse than Lang's at RT, and perhaps a little better. That's a good thing. Perhaps Lang can move back inside, and then we can give the right side help most of the time, and as a result, perhaps the entire line would be better. Time will tell. I thought Lang was pretty bad at RT, honestly.
Offline DarkaneRules  
#83 Posted : Sunday, December 2, 2012 8:49:43 PM(UTC)
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We still looked look below average overall on the line but when he came into the game it looked more physical on that side. That was nice to see. Rodgers was under seize.
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Offline porky88  
#84 Posted : Sunday, December 2, 2012 10:09:07 PM(UTC)
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Barclay definitely received help from John Kuhn and Jermichael Finley, despite what they‘re suggesting. I don't care what players or coaches say in public. It's like politicians. They're just trying to get through the question. In this case, Rodgers is boosting morale.

With the said, I do believe the best solution is keeping Barclay at right tackle and moving T.J. Lang (if he's healthy) back to guard. EDS gets no push and Lang is more physical inside than outside. I think the lack of physicality is the problem. I want the most physical players out there, whether they're experienced or not. Barclay > EDS in that regard.

Regarding Burnett, he‘s a benefactor from Christian Ponder‘s incompetence. I wouldn’t reward him a game ball either. I’d give them to Ponder actually. He was the difference in the game. A quality quarterback doesn’t throw the first one and completes the second one. I wasn’t encouraged by Burnett’s play against the run. Aikman pointed it out on the telecast, but I think Adrian Peterson flat out overwhelmed him.
Offline doddpower  
#85 Posted : Sunday, December 2, 2012 10:16:57 PM(UTC)
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Who cares if they helped him? I often wonder why the Packers don't give their tackles more help. They need to do whatever it takes to give Rodgers some time. If all it takes to be mildly successful is Barclay starting with some help, than so be it. If Lang can come back to LG, than they should be able to give even more help on the right side. That's all about good coaching to me. There's always going to be a weakness. Do what it takes to cover up that weakness, especially when it's protecting the franchise in Aaron Rodgers.
thanks Post received 1 applause.
porky88 on 12/2/2012(UTC)
Offline nerdmann  
#86 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 1:36:15 AM(UTC)
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Quote:
Don Barclay, an undrafted rookie free agent who had played one snap on offense, replaced Lang and more than held his own after a rocky start. Packers coach Mike McCarthy gave Barclay some blocking help early, then decided he didn’t need it. Barclay must have been doing something right because the Packers rushed for 152 yards, their second-highest total this season.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Online Zero2Cool  
#87 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 5:36:28 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: porky88 Go to Quoted Post
I wasn’t encouraged by Burnett’s play against the run. Aikman pointed it out on the telecast, but I think Adrian Peterson flat out overwhelmed him.


That holds as much as weight as knocking someone for getting their jock juked by Barry Sanders. Far more in the league have that happen than not.
"I do not think there is any thrill that can go through the human heart like that felt by the inventor as he sees some creation of the brain unfolding to success... such emotions make a man forget food, sleep, friends, love, everything." - Nikola Tesla

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Offline zombieslayer  
#88 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 7:01:37 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: porky88 Go to Quoted Post
Barclay definitely received help from John Kuhn and Jermichael Finley, despite what they‘re suggesting. I don't care what players or coaches say in public. It's like politicians. They're just trying to get through the question. In this case, Rodgers is boosting morale.

With the said, I do believe the best solution is keeping Barclay at right tackle and moving T.J. Lang (if he's healthy) back to guard. EDS gets no push and Lang is more physical inside than outside. I think the lack of physicality is the problem. I want the most physical players out there, whether they're experienced or not. Barclay > EDS in that regard.

Regarding Burnett, he‘s a benefactor from Christian Ponder‘s incompetence. I wouldn’t reward him a game ball either. I’d give them to Ponder actually. He was the difference in the game. A quality quarterback doesn’t throw the first one and completes the second one. I wasn’t encouraged by Burnett’s play against the run. Aikman pointed it out on the telecast, but I think Adrian Peterson flat out overwhelmed him.


Yes. Thank you Christian Ponder. May the Vikings keep Christian Ponder as their starting QB for the next ten years. Big Grin
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Offline wpr  
#89 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 7:03:12 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: doddpower Go to Quoted Post
I disagree on the whiff. Had Barclay not been there, there's not way the defender shoots inside like that. Yes, it probably didn't matter if it had been Barclay or anyone else, but the fact of the matter is that the presence of Barclay made the defender make a decision, and it was one that benefited the Packers. The end kind of justifies the means here. If the defender made the right cut and blew up the play, it'd be a different story, but he didn't. Barclay didn't actually block him, but that guy didn't make the play, so the end result is the same. That one play doesn't concern me at all. It's easy to miss quicker defenders in space. Sometimes it's best to just get in the way or be in the right place and the right time, and in this case, Barclay was.

The main concern should still be his pass protection, as it wasn't great. His run blocking was pretty good. I thought his pass blocking was no worse than Lang's at RT, and perhaps a little better. That's a good thing. Perhaps Lang can move back inside, and then we can give the right side help most of the time, and as a result, perhaps the entire line would be better. Time will tell. I thought Lang was pretty bad at RT, honestly.


That makes no sense. Being the RT he has to be SOMEWHERE. Just being there doesn't count for anything. He has to do something. Just because the defender had a 50-50 chance and chose wrong is not a credit to Barclay.

I am happy with the end result but there is no attaboy for Barclay for simply standing there then trying to engage the defender but missing him completely as the play unfolded.
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Online musccy  
#90 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 7:32:37 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: wpr Go to Quoted Post
That makes no sense. Being the RT he has to be SOMEWHERE. Just being there doesn't count for anything. He has to do something. Just because the defender had a 50-50 chance and chose wrong is not a credit to Barclay.

I am happy with the end result but there is no attaboy for Barclay for simply standing there then trying to engage the defender but missing him completely as the play unfolded.


Exactly, Aikman was trying to give him credit, but he basically "pulled a Homer."

Considering the circumstances, I thought he did a decent job and he showed some reasons to be optomistic about him on the right end especially in the run game, but his play was still far from "game ball worthy."
Offline yooperfan  
#91 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 8:46:28 AM(UTC)
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Game ball to McCarthy for sticking with the run.
thanks Post received 1 applause.
Pack93z on 12/3/2012(UTC)
Offline play2win  
#92 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 11:54:04 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: doddpower Go to Quoted Post
Who cares if they helped him? I often wonder why the Packers don't give their tackles more help. They need to do whatever it takes to give Rodgers some time. If all it takes to be mildly successful is Barclay starting with some help, than so be it. If Lang can come back to LG, than they should be able to give even more help on the right side. That's all about good coaching to me. There's always going to be a weakness. Do what it takes to cover up that weakness, especially when it's protecting the franchise in Aaron Rodgers.


Yeah, I agree doddpower. So much so, that I wouldn't mind if they went with a power set full-time against some of the more prominent pass rushes. 6 OL instead of 5. Why not?
Offline PackerTraxx  
#93 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 1:49:52 PM(UTC)
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Kudos to Barclay, he did much better than anyone could hope for from an UDA thrown into the fire. That situation had potential for disaster. Now the key is consistent improvement. Anybody can avoid a block by avoiding contact but if he takes himself out of the play the blocker wins.
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thanks Post received 1 applause.
nerdmann on 12/3/2012(UTC)
Offline doddpower  
#94 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 5:00:04 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: wpr Go to Quoted Post
That makes no sense. Being the RT he has to be SOMEWHERE. Just being there doesn't count for anything. He has to do something. Just because the defender had a 50-50 chance and chose wrong is not a credit to Barclay.

I am happy with the end result but there is no attaboy for Barclay for simply standing there then trying to engage the defender but missing him completely as the play unfolded.



He wasn't just "standing there." The defender made a quick cut inside in space on the run, and he missed him. It's not good, but it happens. I just don't see the big deal about it since it didn't effect the play. He didn't make a pancake block on that one running play that still resulted in a touchdown, but some are busting his balls about it? That defender didn't make the play. Do better next time (as he did multiple other times) and move on.
Offline wpr  
#95 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 5:55:35 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: doddpower Go to Quoted Post
He wasn't just "standing there." The defender made a quick cut inside in space on the run, and he missed him. It's not good, but it happens. I just don't see the big deal about it since it didn't effect the play. He didn't make a pancake block on that one running play that still resulted in a touchdown, but some are busting his balls about it? That defender didn't make the play. Do better next time (as he did multiple other times) and move on.


I am not trying to bust his balls. All I said was that he didn't merit a game ball. He did an ok job. it was nice that they were able to give him help and it worked. I was thrilled MN didn't eat him alive like some rooks would have been.

The whiff was just one play. I merely mentioned it as it was a play everyone could see and others had talked about as well.

It could have been worse. It could have been better.

He did step into a bad situation with very few reps and made the most of it. Still no game ball.
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Offline PackFanWithTwins  
#96 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 6:10:39 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: wpr Go to Quoted Post
That makes no sense. Being the RT he has to be SOMEWHERE. Just being there doesn't count for anything. He has to do something. Just because the defender had a 50-50 chance and chose wrong is not a credit to Barclay.

I am happy with the end result but there is no attaboy for Barclay for simply standing there then trying to engage the defender but missing him completely as the play unfolded.


Can't really blame Barclay for there not being a player in position for him to really block. On that play, When gets outside, he has blocking rules. Henderson was at best at the very backside of his responsibility.
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Offline porky88  
#97 Posted : Monday, December 3, 2012 6:26:12 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool Go to Quoted Post
That holds as much as weight as knocking someone for getting their jock juked by Barry Sanders. Far more in the league have that happen than not.

Very true. You still have to make an effort, though. The tackling was atrocious. I think some players, especially Burnett, were intimidated. That's where we miss Charles Woodson. Burnett isn't an in-the-box safety. He's more of a centerfielder. Woodson almost thrives near the line of scrimmage. I saw a post questioning Woodson's future, but I think he still has a future with this team. This game proved that. Woodson puts forth the effort, and even if you fail to get Peterson to the ground, you still slow him up for other players to come in and finish.
thanks Post received 1 applause.
Zero2Cool on 12/3/2012(UTC)
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