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Wade  
#21 Posted : Friday, January 31, 2014 10:08:38 AM(UTC)
texaspackerbacker said: Go to Quoted Post
Good Analysis, Wade. I'm pretty sure you meant Boykin at WR instead of Bostick. I agree about the O Line, especially the lack of positivity so many have for Bakhtiari. Ditto for Bulaga last year anyway. As for D, I'm still hopeful for Datone Jones, but I share your pessimism for Perry. I disagree with you on Hayward - still good hope if he can stay healthy, and Richardson - I saw nothing good in him.


I did mean Boykin, yes. Thanks for the correction.

Re: Jones, OL, et al...I guess I'm just tired of hearing the same "potential" and "develop" and "grow" predictions every year.

And I just can't buy it anymore, especially on the OL.

Spitz, Moll, Colledge, Barbre, Giancomini, etc etc etc etc etc etc., Bulaga, Bakhtiari, and whoever they draft this year in the sixth round. It just gets old.



wpr  
#22 Posted : Friday, January 31, 2014 10:49:43 AM(UTC)
nice summary Wade.
DoddPower  
#23 Posted : Friday, January 31, 2014 2:04:05 PM(UTC)
Wade being pessimistic? Neeeever. I just can't believe it.

Other than perhaps a few teams, the Packers will be as good as any other team in the NFL. True, the Seahawks, 49'ers, and Broncos MIGHT be better next season, but beyond that, the Packers will be as good or better than the other teams on any given Sunday. That's pretty good. Packer fans should expect more, but realistically, it's hard to ask for much more. As weak as some areas of the team may be, Aaron Rodgers and Eddie Lacy will compensate for many of those weaknesses. Will that be enough to win another Super Bowl? Maybe not, but it's possible. All the Packers have to do to have a chance is keep Rodgers healthy, and improve slightly in a few areas. Those are very realistic goals. The 49'ers playoff game this year was a perfect example. The Packers competed the entire game, but just lost. Things could bounce differently next time.

Things could be better in Packer land, but they certainly could be much, much worse.
nerdmann  
#24 Posted : Friday, January 31, 2014 3:31:09 PM(UTC)
Wade said: Go to Quoted Post

Offense:
WR -- surprisingly, no change. I thought Jennings loss would be bigger, but Boykin stepped up.
TE -- also a surprise. improvement.
RB -- clearly the major accomplishment of the year with Lacy. One draft pick I am really glad to have been really wrong about.
QB -- same. The one place where, IMO, an injury explanation holds. On the other hand, I and others have been pointing out for years that with the Packers OL, its a real risk to happen again. Because:
OT, OG, C -- no change. I thought Newhouse would finally step up, but was not to be; I was wrong there. OTOH, I fail to understand the great optimism re: Bahktiari. He showed me virtually nothing to warrant it. And I've never been as sold on Bulaga or Lang as other people. EDS showed as serviceable long term player, but overall I see no grounds for thinking this unit has any more going for it than it did a year ago. I thought it was (excluding Sitton) a mediocre/serviceable unit then, and I think it is a mediocre/serviceable unit now. Same possible unproven potential as before. Until it gets better, I expect to lose Rodgers for some games every year.
Backups: QB slightly better, RB slightly better prosects, TE wash, WR wash, OL no change.
Overall: better because of Lacy.


Wow, Bakhtiari showed you NOTHING? He came is as a rookie, weighting under 300lbs and held up, all year. Was he pro bowl level? NO. But he held up, and with an offseason in the program, he should be able to bulk up plenty. Dude with a 4th rounder, who played better at LT than the top pick overall and the one shortly thereafter did at RT. And did so as the starter for the entire year.

EDS has shown he could get it done at an adequate level. Which is to say, he surprised me. Tretter might beat him out, but EDS can play.

Lang had a great year too. The only really off-year he's had was his second year, when he couldn't life during the offseason, due to a wrist injury. And Bulaga is as solid as anyone. Sherrod's really the only question mark. Sherrod and Tretter. But we're definitely getting stronger at this position, no question.


Quote:

Defense:
DT: Weaker. I've been a Pickett fan forever. But, alas, I think he declined last year. And as for Raji, well, it's past time. I don't know whether Daniels should be considered DT or DE at this point, but I've always put him at DT and so does the Packers roster list, so I'll put him there. And he was a real positive, one of very few on the defensive side last year. So Daniels a big up; Pickett a down and Raji a down, so I'd say weaker overall, since this is a position that needs rotation during games.
DE: No change. Boyd -- flashes suggesting cautious optimism warranted. Jones -- I didn't like the pick, and I'm still underwhelmed. The rest -- bleh.


Boyd is a NT is he not? He's played well, and seems to have potential. I agree about Pickett, and Raji definitely has underwhelmed. DL needs some depth. I'd say we're weaker here. Jolly should be back, though.

I'm a little disappointed with Datone Jones, and I didn't like the pick at the time. LOL. I was saying IF GENO SMITH FALLS, GO GET HIM TED! Haha, but I still like Datone. I'm reserving judgement, and I do believe he'll be fine. Still overall, the DL needs to get stronger.



Quote:

OLB: No change. Didn't like the Perry pick, still don't. Matthews, injuries notwithstanding, still IMO is a stud. The rest -- same potential, different year.


This position is frustrating. Perry needs to prove he can get healthy. Then he needs to prove he can stay that way. Neal needs to show he can play. Just another tweener on a team full of guys who don't fit their prototypes. Be nice of Nate Palmer shows he can play.
I don't think we're weaker here. Palmer and Neal with have a year of experience.


Quote:

ILB: Slight improvement, but still mediocre. Improvement: Lighter Hawk looked better; Lattimore definitely looked better. Jones -- don't know if he belongs here or at OLB; regardless, looked, if anything, more underwhelming.
CB: Same. Hyde this year's pleasant surprise after last year's pleasant surprise of Hayward. OTOH, Hayward was disappointing -- I didn't like the draft pick two years ago, last year I thought I was wrong about the pick, and now, well I don't know what to think of the guy anymore. (Since this "before free agency" assessment, I'm counting Shields as still there. If Shields is lost, this position takes a major hit.)


Hayward was disappointing because of training issues, not because of his skills as a player. Huge difference. Not like he came out there and stunk up the joint. The key at this position is health.
It'd be nice if House took some yoga lessons and gained some fluidity in his hips. He's a bit mechanical. Also, he's the latest DB who needs to make the decision that he's willing to tackle. Dude has made some great plays in coverage, but he's also given up big plays. I think we're still ok here. Tramon's a year older. Shields may or may not be back...


Quote:

S: Worse. McMillian didn't even last the year and MD Jennings looked worse; a year ago, he still seemed, to me anyway, to offer some potential. Not as optimistic about Burnett either. Richardson -- more optimistic, because with the injury frankly I never expected anything from him before.
Depth? Only at CB and even there it could be better.
Overall: Worse.


This position is definitely worse. McMillian shit on his career, and MD Jennings proved that he can't play. On the plus side, those were two experiments that have proven to NOT work. So at least now we know we need to look elsewhere.


Quote:

Sorry, but the Pickett and Woodson examples are no longer credible examples that Ted Thompson is interested in playing anything other than bargain-basement and third-tier free agency. Both are among my all time favorite Packers, but both were 8 frigging years ago. Two major free agent acquisitions in 9 years -- that is not, IMO, a serious commitment.


What about guys like James Jones? Ted doesn't get credit for signing his own. Finley too. Then there's DuJuan Harris, who might turn out to be a pretty significant acquisition.

Bottom line for me is, Packers need to do SOMETHING about all the injuries. It's costing this franchise, year after year.
luigis  
#25 Posted : Friday, January 31, 2014 4:22:50 PM(UTC)
I believe you need 3 things:

- A francjise QB (check)
- Some luck
- The right path to reach the SB

Some teams are better prepared to defeat some other teams. Some coaches fit better against some others.

In 2010 we drawed Phily, Atlanta and Chicago. We could defeat those teams and we still can.
San Francisco and the Giants are teams that we can't defeat.

I'm sure we would have defeated Carolina this year, too bad we had San Francisco in the middle.
nerdmann  
#26 Posted : Friday, January 31, 2014 5:29:53 PM(UTC)
luigis said: Go to Quoted Post
I believe you need 3 things:

- A francjise QB (check)
- Some luck
- The right path to reach the SB

Some teams are better prepared to defeat some other teams. Some coaches fit better against some others.

In 2010 we drawed Phily, Atlanta and Chicago. We could defeat those teams and we still can.
San Francisco and the Giants are teams that we can't defeat.

I'm sure we would have defeated Carolina this year, too bad we had San Francisco in the middle.


We've beaten the Giants before.

As for the Niners, they fear us now, and they should. Last second FG? Two defensive starters down on the first drive? No way they take us lightly.
buckeyepackfan  
#27 Posted : Friday, January 31, 2014 8:30:01 PM(UTC)

Tramon Williams signs extension.(or cut him)

Sign Sam Shields to 4 yr deal(this is a must if Williams refuses to sign an extension)

Can't lose them both.

O-line-fine, plenty of deoth(say goodbye to EDS)

Te's fine(if Quarless is resigned)(say goodbye to Finley)

Rb's/Fb's fine(as long a Kuhn is resigned)(say good bye to James Starks)

Qb's fine (as long as Ted resigns Matt Flynn)

WR's fine (say goodbye to James Jones) A mistake IMO, but Ted knows better than me.

D-line need help(especially if Jolly and Pickett are not resigned)(say goodby to Raji)

(those "old slow fat-asses" as they have been described by some of this forums football geniuses, are needed back 1 more year to transition The Boyd's and Jones's on The Packers roster).

Packers will not sniff a SB without Jolly and Pickett back 1 more year.

LBr's fine, plenty of depth as long as they stay healthy(say goodbye to Lattimore and Francois)

CB's already adressed this at top, Packers will be set if Williams and Shields are both back, plenty of young deoth. Ted loses 1 , then Paxckers are in trouble, they lose both, forget about any SB run.

S need help, Richardson and Burnette can be solid starters(when healthy and play up to their potential), but no depth after that.

Ted will not change his philosphy of draft and develope.

Therefor any talk of a high-priced FA coming to The Packers is pretty much just that TALK.
#1 Packers can't afford it
#2 Not Teds way.

All likelyhood Ted will Turn his 7 picks into 10 or 11(which i think is a mistake).
He will draft 2 S'afeties , 2 - TE's, 2 d-linemn, a RB, a WR, an OT, a LBr, and a QB.

7 of these guys will nake the final 53 man roster, and The Packers will once again hope the Vets stay healthy or these players will be thown into the fire way before they are ready.

The Packers will make a run at The SupeBowl in 2014 if less than 3 starters end up on IR, and none of them are named Rodgers or Mathews.






User is suspended until 4/29/2043 11:56:55 PM(UTC) texaspackerbacker  
#28 Posted : Friday, January 31, 2014 8:44:36 PM(UTC)
buckeyepackfan said: Go to Quoted Post
Tramon Williams signs extension.(or cut him)

Sign Sam Shields to 4 yr deal(this is a must if Williams refuses to sign an extension)

Can't lose them both.

O-line-fine, plenty of deoth(say goodbye to EDS)

Te's fine(if Quarless is resigned)(say goodbye to Finley)

Rb's/Fb's fine(as long a Kuhn is resigned)(say good bye to James Starks)

Qb's fine (as long as Ted resigns Matt Flynn)

WR's fine (say goodbye to James Jones) A mistake IMO, but Ted knows better than me.

D-line need help(especially if Jolly and Pickett are not resigned)(say goodby to Raji)

(those "old slow fat-asses" as they have been described by some of this forums football geniuses, are needed back 1 more year to transition The Boyd's and Jones's on The Packers roster).

Packers will not sniff a SB without Jolly and Pickett back 1 more year.

LBr's fine, plenty of depth as long as they stay healthy(say goodbye to Lattimore and Francois)

CB's already adressed this at top, Packers will be set if Williams and Shields are both back, plenty of young deoth. Ted loses 1 , then Paxckers are in trouble, they lose both, forget about any SB run.

S need help, Richardson and Burnette can be solid starters(when healthy and play up to their potential), but no depth after that.

Ted will not change his philosphy of draft and develope.

Therefor any talk of a high-priced FA coming to The Packers is pretty much just that TALK.
#1 Packers can't afford it
#2 Not Teds way.

All likelyhood Ted will Turn his 7 picks into 10 or 11(which i think is a mistake).
He will draft 2 S'afeties , 2 - TE's, 2 d-linemn, a RB, a WR, an OT, a LBr, and a QB.

7 of these guys will nake the final 53 man roster, and The Packers will once again hope the Vets stay healthy or these players will be thown into the fire way before they are ready.

The Packers will make a run at The SupeBowl in 2014 if less than 3 starters end up on IR, and none of them are named Rodgers or Mathews.



All I can say is I HOPE you are wrong about how Thompson handles things on about a dozen counts. I don't like what the guy has done with the team, but I give him more credit than most of the shit you are talking about - both prediction and wishes.

buckeyepackfan  
#29 Posted : Friday, January 31, 2014 8:59:48 PM(UTC)
texaspackerbacker said: Go to Quoted Post
All I can say is I HOPE you are wrong about how Thompson handles things on about a dozen counts. I don't like what the guy has done with the team, but I give him more credit than most of the shit you are talking about - both prediction and wishes.



Untill Ted proves me wrong, I'll stick by what I said.

You say it's shit, might be, but I'm not afraid to put it down and be wrong.

The question was what did The Packers need to do to make a SB run, the simple answer is "stay healthy", but the variables going into this offseason are the 18 Fa's currently on the roster.

Who to keep, who to let go, and how replace those that leave.

You don't like my answer, fine, move on.
Zero2Cool  
#30 Posted : Friday, January 31, 2014 9:28:52 PM(UTC)
DakotaT said: Go to Quoted Post
Why do you go completely out of your way to be a sniveling little pussy? Usually a dude likes to be masculine. We all know what you really think about this subject.

I don't think we will be sniffing a Super Bowl until we develop a solid Dline and acquire a much better safety to team up with Burnett. Why they didn't use Hyde more at safety this season is confusing.



Michael P. Watson said:
Strong people don't put others down... They lift them up.



User is suspended until 5/28/2018 11:54:40 AM(UTC) DakotaT  
#31 Posted : Friday, January 31, 2014 10:01:27 PM(UTC)
Zero2Cool said: Go to Quoted Post


That guy I could pull out of a well and he'd just jump back in half way up! Some men you just can't reach, which is the way he wants it - so he gets it! [grin1]

Maybe you ought to remind him that little sarcastic jabs in his long winded speeches isn't a good way to keep the peace.
mi_keys  
#32 Posted : Saturday, February 1, 2014 10:17:55 AM(UTC)
luigis said: Go to Quoted Post

San Francisco and the Giants are teams that we can't defeat.


You do realize that we had to beat New York in week 16 of 2010 in what was effectively an elimination game, right?
User is suspended until 5/28/2018 11:54:40 AM(UTC) DakotaT  
#33 Posted : Saturday, February 1, 2014 10:42:59 AM(UTC)
mi_keys said: Go to Quoted Post
You do realize that we had to beat New York in week 16 of 2010 in what was effectively an elimination game, right?


Yeah, that team was a shell of itself from the one that kicked our ass in 2007. The Packers are a finesse team posing as a tough team. When we get a legitimate power blocking run game and a lock down defense - we will kick the shit out of teams like the Giants and 9ers.
mi_keys  
#34 Posted : Saturday, February 1, 2014 11:02:51 AM(UTC)
DakotaT said: Go to Quoted Post
Yeah, that team was a shell of itself from the one that kicked our ass in 2007. The Packers are a finesse team posing as a tough team. When we get a legitimate power blocking run game and a lock down defense - we will kick the shit out of teams like the Giants and 9ers.


Shell of itself? They went 10-6 and had many of the same players as the team that won the Super Bowl the next year.
User is suspended until 5/28/2018 11:54:40 AM(UTC) DakotaT  
#35 Posted : Saturday, February 1, 2014 11:18:42 AM(UTC)
mi_keys said: Go to Quoted Post
Shell of itself? They went 10-6 and had many of the same players as the team that won the Super Bowl the next year.


If you think those Giants teams were comparable, then I feel sorry for you. Also, if you can't admit that the Packers of 2011-2012 were softer than Liberace at the Playboy Mansion - I also feel sorry for you. These things make me angry about our team, funny how some of you just accept it.
mi_keys  
#36 Posted : Saturday, February 1, 2014 12:16:23 PM(UTC)
DakotaT said: Go to Quoted Post
If you think those Giants teams were comparable, then I feel sorry for you. Also, if you can't admit that the Packers of 2011-2012 were softer than Liberace at the Playboy Mansion - I also feel sorry for you. These things make me angry about our team, funny how some of you just accept it.


I'm not talking about the Packers being soft or not. I've discussed before improvements I'd like to see to our defense and our offensive line.

What I'm commenting on, and what annoys me, is historical revision for the sake of trying to make a point. Never mind that we also beat the Giants during the regular season of 2011 as far as whether or not we "can't" beat them.

Suggesting the 2010 and 2011 Giants aren't comparable--teams that had many of the same significant contributors including most of the offensive line, running back tandem, and most of the defensive line (those positions often determining whether or not a team is tough or soft); the same head coach, offensive coordinator and defensive coordinator; and probably over 40 of the same players--is laughable.
luigis  
#37 Posted : Saturday, February 1, 2014 12:43:04 PM(UTC)
mi_keys said: Go to Quoted Post
You do realize that we had to beat New York in week 16 of 2010 in what was effectively an elimination game, right?


Yes of course. But any team can defeat any other any given Sunday.
Teams like the Giants and San Francisco have given us a lot of headeaches.

I believe it is about coaching. Mike McCarthy is outcoached by Coughlin and Harby in the same way that was easy to outcoach Redi, Tomlin and Smith in the 2010 SB run.

nerdmann  
#38 Posted : Saturday, February 1, 2014 1:02:49 PM(UTC)
DakotaT said: Go to Quoted Post
Yeah, that team was a shell of itself from the one that kicked our ass in 2007. The Packers are a finesse team posing as a tough team. When we get a legitimate power blocking run game and a lock down defense - we will kick the shit out of teams like the Giants and 9ers.


OUR team was also a shell of itself.

We've beaten the Giants a number of times over the years. It's getting to be a pretty good rivalry, but it's not like they have our number or anything.
play2win  
#39 Posted : Monday, February 3, 2014 6:24:39 AM(UTC)
One look at Seattle's D last night and I would say we are pretty far away from our next Superbowl.

We need, still, to get bigger and faster on D, and I'll add, meaner. We seemed to play uninspired football far too often last season.

I'm taken aback by our loss of toughness and inspired play. We clearly don't have the same types of players on our D, as was on display with Seattle.
wpr  
#40 Posted : Monday, February 3, 2014 6:51:20 AM(UTC)
play2win said: Go to Quoted Post
One look at Seattle's D last night and I would say we are pretty far away from our next Superbowl.

We need, still, to get bigger and faster on D, and I'll add, meaner. We seemed to play uninspired football far too often last season.

I'm taken aback by our loss of toughness and inspired play. We clearly don't have the same types of players on our D, as was on display with Seattle.


in other words, despite Coach Michael's contrary insistence, the Packers are a soft team. Especially on defense.
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