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Online nerdmann  
#1 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 12:59:45 PM(UTC)
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Darin Gantt wrote:
From the moment the Packers went against stereotype and signed former Bears defensive end Julius Peppers, the question became how they'd use him. That has been answered, for now. According to Jason Wilde of ESPNWisconsin.com, Packers coach Mike McCarthy said Peppers would work with the linebackers in practice, but would have multiple roles in the...
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline Laser Gunns  
#2 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 1:09:37 PM(UTC)
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A "hand in the dirt" linebacker I hope."....


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Dec, 11, 2012 - FOREVER!
Offline gbguy20  
#3 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 2:04:20 PM(UTC)
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Clay and Julius coming off the same side would be a damn nightmare, coming off opposite sides they will be a damn nightmare. Peppers in coverage, probably not a nightmare, at least for the opponent.
call me Dan
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musccy on 3/26/2014(UTC)
Offline steveishere  
#4 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 2:41:10 PM(UTC)
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So something like we are replacing Neal with Peppers and Pickett/Wilson with Neal
Offline steveishere  
#5 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 2:44:23 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: gbguy20 Go to Quoted Post
Clay and Julius coming off the same side would be a damn nightmare, coming off opposite sides they will be a damn nightmare. Peppers in coverage, probably not a nightmare, at least for the opponent.


The being in coverage thing gets pretty overblown I think. Even if one of the OLB is bad in coverage he's still not going to be doing it very often. The most targeted OLB last season was only thrown at 23 times and only 5 guys were thrown at at least 15 times. It's a pretty insignificant part of an OLB game for how much it gets talked about. One of those things where if you have one that can cover then great but if you don't then meh, who cares.
thanks Post received 3 applause.
Mucky Tundra on 3/25/2014(UTC), wpr on 3/25/2014(UTC), Yerko on 3/26/2014(UTC)
Offline dhazer  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 2:55:10 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: gbguy20 Go to Quoted Post
Clay and Julius coming off the same side would be a damn nightmare, coming off opposite sides they will be a damn nightmare. Peppers in coverage, probably not a nightmare, at least for the opponent.


Well we won't see much of Matthews and Peppers together because at the going rate Matthews should miss around 8 games this year. We should really trade his injury prone ass. Maybe get a 1st rounder from oakland and draft mack or clowney.



Clay Matthews doing well and is ready for the regular season. head coach Mike McCarthy said LB Clay Matthews (thumb) broken thumb has knitted together nicely and he does not expect him to have any issues with it moving forward.
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Just Imagine this for the next 6-9 years. What a ride it will be :)
thanks Post received 1 applause.
DoddPower on 3/25/2014(UTC)
Offline steveishere  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 3:50:46 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: dhazer Go to Quoted Post
Well we won't see much of Matthews and Peppers together because at the going rate Matthews should miss around 8 games this year. We should really trade his injury prone ass. Maybe get a 1st rounder from oakland and draft mack or clowney.



Clay Matthews doing well and is ready for the regular season. head coach Mike McCarthy said LB Clay Matthews (thumb) broken thumb has knitted together nicely and he does not expect him to have any issues with it moving forward.


Clay averages 14 games a season.
Offline DoddPower  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 5:11:20 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: steveishere Go to Quoted Post
Clay averages 14 games a season.


What about the two most recent seasons?
Offline dhazer  
#9 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 5:33:30 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: steveishere Go to Quoted Post
Clay averages 14 games a season.




Ok so a guy starts off with 2 games which he got 4 sacks each and the next 6 games he gets none, would he be an awesome pass rusher with an average of 1 a game or is it just an average player that got lucky?


Here is his games played starting from rookie year

2009 16 games played (only season he played every game)
2010 15 games
2011 15 games
2012 12 games
2013 11 games


to we see a bad trend here or is he worth the 22 million a year?



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Just Imagine this for the next 6-9 years. What a ride it will be :)
Offline steveishere  
#10 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 5:37:46 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: DoddPower Go to Quoted Post
What about the two most recent seasons?


What about them? Guy broke his thumb and came back before it was fully healed and re broke it. The only real recurring injury he's had is the hamstrings and he's missed a whopping 5 games from them in 5 years. The injury prone thing is getting a bit overblown. Either way saying "the going rate" is he'll miss 8 games is just stupid.
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nerdmann on 3/25/2014(UTC)
Offline steveishere  
#11 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 5:43:56 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: dhazer Go to Quoted Post
Ok so a guy starts off with 2 games which he got 4 sacks each and the next 6 games he gets none, would he be an awesome pass rusher with an average of 1 a game or is it just an average player that got lucky?


Here is his games played starting from rookie year

2009 16 games played (only season he played every game)
2010 15 games
2011 15 games
2012 12 games
2013 11 games


to we see a bad trend here or is he worth the 22 million a year?





He does a hell of a lot more during a game than get sacks. You are crying about plays that happen 10-15ish times a season that's with like 800-1000 defensive plays total. Do you understand how ridiculous that is? You are going to have to come with a hell of a lot more than just sack totals. He didn't miss any games from injury in 2011 so he really played every game that year.

You are so misinformed it's just ridiculous. You are only off on his yearly average salary by about 9m but hey nice try. Dude's costing us 11m this year. GTFO till you know what you are talking about.
Offline steveishere  
#12 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 6:00:54 PM(UTC)
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lol trading him is a genius idea as well (Sarcasm ) considering not only would it not save money while taking the best player off an already not great defense but it would cost an extra 6m against the cap to do so.
Offline DakotaT  
#13 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 6:01:30 PM(UTC)
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So if Peppers is going to play one of the OLB positions, where will they play Perry? I wonder if he could do some thumping in the middle? God knows we haven't had a linebacker know the snot out of a running in a long time.
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thanks Post received 2 applause.
nerdmann on 3/25/2014(UTC), musccy on 3/26/2014(UTC)
Offline Zero2Cool  
#14 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 6:01:36 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: dhazer Go to Quoted Post
Ok so a guy starts off with 2 games which he got 4 sacks each and the next 6 games he gets none, would he be an awesome pass rusher with an average of 1 a game or is it just an average player that got lucky?


Here is his games played starting from rookie year

2009 16 games played (only season he played every game)
2010 15 games
2011 15 games
2012 12 games
2013 11 games


to we see a bad trend here or is he worth the 22 million a year?





I didn't see where you mentioned that in 2011 he was a healthy scratch. Why is that? Why would you exclude that? Would it be due to you trying to slant the facts to your opinion?


You can quit trying to validate someone being worth 22 million dollars a year because NO ONE is worth that, period.


I'm also struggling to see where he is bringing home said 22 million dollars a year. Closest i found was his signing bonus which we all know those get spread out.

4/17/2013: Signed a six-year, $69.73 million contract. The deal included a $20.5 million signing bonus. Matthews is eligible for annual $500,000 workout bonuses throughout the contract's life. He can earn $500,000 in annual per-game roster bonuses in years two through six.
2014: $1 million (+ $5 million roster bonus due in March),
2015: $7.6 million,
2016: $8.65 million,
2017: $10.1 million,
2018: $10.4 million,
2019: Free Agent
"I do not think there is any thrill that can go through the human heart like that felt by the inventor as he sees some creation of the brain unfolding to success... such emotions make a man forget food, sleep, friends, love, everything." - Nikola Tesla

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Offline gbguy20  
#15 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 6:02:17 PM(UTC)
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Its been said Peppers will play fewer than 800 snaps this season. I assume that leaves Perry for the rest.
call me Dan
Offline buckeyepackfan  
#16 Posted : Tuesday, March 25, 2014 6:11:33 PM(UTC)
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Who wants to get back on topic?

I can't believe The Packers haven't laid the whole 2014 season defensive game plan out for the media, fans and OPPOSING teams to go over.


MIS-INFORMATION PEOPLE!!!!!

Peppers isn't going to be an every down player.

What he will be is a nightmare for opposing DC's, not knowing just when and where he will be lining up.

With the guys The Packers have signed now, and probably a couple more additions thru the draft or FA, if they stay relatively healthy, hell we could be seeing different looks from series to series.

What he will bring is great veteran knowledge and leadership(which will be needed if Pickett and Jolly are not back).

Enjoy the ride – It kicks and just keeps on kickin’. "Stats are for Losers"
thanks Post received 1 applause.
Yerko on 3/26/2014(UTC)
Offline steveishere  
#17 Posted : Wednesday, March 26, 2014 4:11:14 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: DakotaT Go to Quoted Post
So if Peppers is going to play one of the OLB positions, where will they play Perry? I wonder if he could do some thumping in the middle? God knows we haven't had a linebacker know the snot out of a running in a long time.


Perry will probably be the starter but there will be plenty of snaps for a 3rd olb. It might even be a good idea to have perry and peppers at olb and throw clay in the middle here and there.
Offline play2win  
#18 Posted : Wednesday, March 26, 2014 5:11:39 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: buckeyepackfan Go to Quoted Post

Peppers isn't going to be an every down player.

What he will be is a nightmare for opposing DC's, not knowing just when and where he will be lining up.

With the guys The Packers have signed now, and probably a couple more additions thru the draft or FA, if they stay relatively healthy, hell we could be seeing different looks from series to series.

What he will bring is great veteran knowledge and leadership(which will be needed if Pickett and Jolly are not back).



Yep. Spot on buckeye. The beauty of having Peppers will be a vastly improved rotation, along with the ability to disguise looks to an opposing O.

What I think is really cool is that Peppers has been wanting to play in a 3-4 for years. Who cares if he has to drop back occasionally? He will be very tough to throw over. To have a guy with his talents, excited to be in a new defense, that should be something special to see, even if it is in rotation. Fewer snaps for everybody, solid play throughout with improved talent across the board. This could mean quite a lot to guys like Datone Jones, BJ Raji, Josh Boyd, Mike Daniels, Mike Neal and Nick Perry, not to mention Clay Matthews.

Add to it Peppers' sure motivation to win a ring, and this could get really interesting. Figure, he is a year younger right now than Reggie was when he won his ring. Should be fun to watch.
Offline QCHuskerFan  
#19 Posted : Wednesday, March 26, 2014 7:07:05 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: dhazer Go to Quoted Post

2009 16 games played (only season he played every game)
2010 15 games
2011 15 games
2012 12 games
2013 11 games


to we see a bad trend here?



If we employ 3rd grade math, we would see this is a trend. And not a positive one.

To further act like 3rd graders, we could make excuses for individual years. But excuses don't change the trend. They just make us feel better about it.

It's just a trend. Clay can change it. But I believe it was in the back of TT's mind that when he signed Peppers, it was to insure an impact player would be available if Clay went down. Again. (Or if Perry gets hurt again.)
Offline Wade  
#20 Posted : Wednesday, March 26, 2014 7:10:01 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: play2win Go to Quoted Post
Yep. Spot on buckeye. The beauty of having Peppers will be a vastly improved rotation, along with the ability to disguise looks to an opposing O.

What I think is really cool is that Peppers has been wanting to play in a 3-4 for years. Who cares if he has to drop back occasionally? He will be very tough to throw over. To have a guy with his talents, excited to be in a new defense, that should be something special to see, even if it is in rotation. Fewer snaps for everybody, solid play throughout with improved talent across the board. This could mean quite a lot to guys like Datone Jones, BJ Raji, Josh Boyd, Mike Daniels, Mike Neal and Nick Perry, not to mention Clay Matthews.

Add to it Peppers' sure motivation to win a ring, and this could get really interesting. Figure, he is a year younger right now than Reggie was when he won his ring. Should be fun to watch.


I'd probably replace "vastly improved rotation" with a more modest "improved rotation." I like the signing of Peppers quite a bit, but I consider him a tier 2 signing at this point in his career. He might have a tier 1A year left in him, and compared to the rest of the alternatives at LB/DE not named Matthews he is an upgrade, but even with him the team is, IMO, at best a middle-of-the-pack defense.

And, more likely, still below average.



And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
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musccy on 3/26/2014(UTC)
Offline musccy  
#21 Posted : Wednesday, March 26, 2014 7:19:29 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Wade Go to Quoted Post
I'd probably replace "vastly improved rotation" with a more modest "improved rotation." I like the signing of Peppers quite a bit, but I consider him a tier 2 signing at this point in his career. He might have a tier 1A year left in him, and compared to the rest of the alternatives at LB/DE not named Matthews he is an upgrade, but even with him the team is, IMO, at best a middle-of-the-pack defense.

And, more likely, still below average.


Agreed. Whether you loved, hated, or were indifferent about the defense, I don't see how anything that transpired since January to this point would dramatically change anyone's opinion. Mike said he expects the defense to be significantly improved, but why? Since January...

we added Julius who is 34, and Guion.

Clay, Perry, Heyward, and Worthy should be healthier

Datone hopefully matures, and Raji is shifting positions.

Hyde appears to be penciled at safety.

Are any of these personnel "moves" substantially different from what we saw in 2013?
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yooperfan on 3/26/2014(UTC)
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#22 Posted : Wednesday, March 26, 2014 8:14:23 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: musccy Go to Quoted Post
Agreed. Whether you loved, hated, or were indifferent about the defense, I don't see how anything that transpired since January to this point would dramatically change anyone's opinion. Mike said he expects the defense to be significantly improved, but why? Since January...

we added Julius who is 34, and Guion.

Clay, Perry, Heyward, and Worthy should be healthier

Datone hopefully matures, and Raji is shifting positions.

Hyde appears to be penciled at safety.

Are any of these personnel "moves" substantially different from what we saw in 2013?


Are you kidding? Hell Yeah, your own words reflect A LOT of difference, positive difference. Of course, this is assuming that all or most of the four you mentioned really are healthier, but there is no reason not to assume that.

Last year, we had at most, an out of balance one-sided pass rush with Matthews. The rest of the season - when he was hurt, we didn't even have that. This year, we will have balance - either Peppers opposite Matthews or look out, opponents, using them on the same side; When Peppers is not in, Perry should be a different guy from last year, health-wise. The other big difference I see, though is NOT being bogged down with Pickett and Raji both on the field. There should be more downs for Daniels and Boyd and D. Jones, as well as Worthy, and we should hopefully see Neal back where he belongs - at DE.

And I almost forgot a little thing called the Draft - I think we get a starting Safety and a possible starting ILB - either a new guy or Lattimore paired with Hawk.

All of that spells substantial difference.

Message modified by user Wednesday, March 26, 2014 8:28:24 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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DoddPower on 3/26/2014(UTC)
Offline gbguy20  
#23 Posted : Wednesday, March 26, 2014 8:19:48 AM(UTC)
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Our defense was 8th in sacks last year, putting up 44.
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Offline musccy  
#24 Posted : Wednesday, March 26, 2014 8:56:19 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post
Are you kidding? Hell Yeah, your own words reflect A LOT of difference, positive difference. Of course, this is assuming that all or most of the four you mentioned really are healthier, but there is no reason not to assume that.

Last year, we had at most, an out of balance one-sided pass rush with Matthews. The rest of the season - when he was hurt, we didn't even have that. This year, we will have balance - either Peppers opposite Matthews or look out, opponents, using them on the same side; When Peppers is not in, Perry should be a different guy from last year, health-wise. The other big difference I see, though is NOT being bogged down with Pickett and Raji both on the field. There should be more downs for Daniels and Boyd and D. Jones, as well as Worthy, and we should hopefully see Neal back where he belongs - at DE.

And I almost forgot a little thing called the Draft - I think we get a starting Safety and a possible starting ILB - either a new guy or Lattimore paired with Hawk.

All of that spells substantial difference.


I'm too lazy to dig up the active roster on opening day vs. the 49ers, but off memory, everyone but Worthy and Burnett were active, and the only other differences are Hyde (presumably) at safety, less Pickett, and the addition of Peppers and Guion to the rotation (who I personally don't see as an upgrade, but just that's just my opinion). That defense allowed I believe 400+ yards of passing and 500 total yards that day.

I actually think the D can be OK, I have faith in Heyward, Worthy, Boyd, and Perry and I'm not saying I wish we would have done more in FA or anything like that...as you said the draft is still to come but my point is I don't see why we should expect this unit to be dramatically improved. To me all we really have done is moved the furniture and bought a new lamp for the end table - it's not like there's a brand new furniture set in the living room.
Offline cheeseheads123  
#25 Posted : Wednesday, March 26, 2014 9:56:17 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: musccy Go to Quoted Post
I'm too lazy to dig up the active roster on opening day vs. the 49ers, but off memory, everyone but Worthy and Burnett were active, and the only other differences are Hyde (presumably) at safety, less Pickett, and the addition of Peppers and Guion to the rotation (who I personally don't see as an upgrade, but just that's just my opinion). That defense allowed I believe 400+ yards of passing and 500 total yards that day.

I actually think the D can be OK, I have faith in Heyward, Worthy, Boyd, and Perry and I'm not saying I wish we would have done more in FA or anything like that...as you said the draft is still to come but my point is I don't see why we should expect this unit to be dramatically improved. To me all we really have done is moved the furniture and bought a new lamp for the end table - it's not like there's a brand new furniture set in the living room.


Hayward wasn't active either. That game had more to do with the defensive game plan than the talent.
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