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Offline StarrMax1  
#11 Posted : Thursday, July 17, 2014 11:43:28 AM(UTC)
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AJ hawk was 1 of 2 defensive players last year that was on the field over 1000 plays(Tramon Williams the other).

I hope to hell that Hawk isn't on the field for over 1000 plays this year, if he is, that means that once again, like so many years in the past, he is the only LB who can stay healthy.

It's just amazing how Hawk gets lambasted every year for being able to stay on the field and do his job at a pretty high level.

I checked this stat when this same subject came up a month or so ago.

Since 2010 there have been 25 different lbr's who have started games with Hawk.

Most were rookies and street FA's who had to be brought in in an emergency because the other starters were out.

Pretty funny actually to read how Hawk is one of the big reasons The Packers run defense went into the tank last year, when by week 6 or 7 he was once again the only starter left on the field.

Haters hate, never gonna change, every team needs those guys who know the defense, not only know what their assignment is, but everyone elses is also.

Hawks that LB for The Packers.

Again, If AJ Hawk is on the field for 1000+ plays this year, then The Packers will once again be going through injury problems.

Edit: this article just appeared in news feed, makes sense.

http://lombardiave.com/2...-jim-ringo-jim-carter/2/
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QCHuskerFan on 7/17/2014(UTC)
Offline uffda udfa  
#12 Posted : Thursday, July 17, 2014 1:36:35 PM(UTC)
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QCHuskerFan said: Go to Quoted Post
So Hayward and Perry are less disappointing players? Both high draft picks. Hayward and Perry have certainly made some impact plays.

A player is supposed to play. Hawk does that. Every game. Who's his backup? Doesn't matter. All of us know who Clay's backup is as he will be playing prominent minutes.

In 2006 draft, Mario Williams, Reggie Bush, Vince Young and D'Brickashaw Ferguson were picked above AJ. Williams has had injury issues and is not on the same team that drafted him. Bush is on his 3rd team and has never lived up to expectations. Young was a bad pick to start with. Ferguson has been solid for the Jets.

From the Packer standpoint, I would say that Hawk is a better pick than Bush or Young. About even with Williams and behind Ferguson. Either the entire draft is a disappointment or your standards are too high.

The player picked #5 in 2005 was Cadillac Williams. Is he headed to the HOF? He only played 2 complete seasons. Was injured or bad the other 5. Averaged only 3.8 yds/ carry. 4,038 yards in 7 seasons or 577/ year. If that is the standard for #5 picks, AJ is awesome!

The player picked #5 in 2007 was Levi Brown. He is currently out of the league. He played 81 games in 7 years with the Cardinals and Steelers. Just 4 games in the last 2 years. No post season honors. Nothing remarkable at all. Just average when not injured. Essentially, he was an average player for 5 years. AJ has been average for 8. Which is better?


About even with Mario Williams? Mario has averaged nearly 10 sacks a season for 8 years. He had one season he appeared in only 5 games which keeps his average slightly below 10/season. Last year he had 13 sacks. I can't see how a guy who impacts games the way Mario Williams does could ever be compared to a steady eddie like AJ Hawk? The comparison of being "even" is way off to me. They're not even in the same strata. Hawk goes 2.5 seasons with ZERO splash plays but "at least he's on the field" is the battle cry for him? I admire durability but it fits nowhere with the much preferred productivity. If you could choose, right now... Hawk or Williams are you telling me you'd just keep AJ? Gimme Mario, yesterday.

I consider Nick Perry to be a major disappointment due to health. Casey Hayward I consider a budding young star who had an excellent 1st season and a lost 2nd. Perry has shown some exciting things but I question that guys heart. I don't see the passion for the game out of him.

Obviously, you've gotten past the idea he's a 5th overall and way overpaid. I haven't on either front.

Hawk is a middling steady player. Nothing spectacular or worthy of getting excited about. There's definitely a lot better out there. Why we haven't found it or tried very hard is beyond me. He's a ZERO time probowl starter... Mario has 3 starts.

I love this quote from Hawk from JSOnline.com:

Yes, he absolutely wishes he could make more big plays.

"I'd love to," he says. "I'd love to get more picks, force more fumbles and get more sacks. I'm constantly trying. I don't really have an answer, I guess."

---At least he's not making excuses for not being good enough. I admire that as much as his durability.


Offline nerdmann  
#13 Posted : Thursday, July 17, 2014 1:44:23 PM(UTC)
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Is Perry a disappointment, or is Dom an asshole for not putting him on the side where he is clearly much better?

Is it his fault that he's injured all the time, or is he on a team for which there is no accountability when it comes to injuries?
Offline DakotaT  
#14 Posted : Thursday, July 17, 2014 3:11:02 PM(UTC)
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Having Hawk on the field too much is not a good thing for our defense. He is clearly outmatched when in coverage, and this is a passing league. But if he is the only guy that can stay healthy, I guess that is what has to be.

I don't understand why we have so many hamstring injuries, but it sure would be nice to go through a season without losing a third of the team's starters to IR. It makes the 2010 season that much more special.
Offline DoddPower  
#15 Posted : Thursday, July 17, 2014 3:47:19 PM(UTC)
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AJ Hawk is not the problem. Teams can win with AJ Hawk, as the Packers have done. The biggest problem is the players around Hawk and/or the failure to find someone better. Hawk isn't the greatest, but there are many worse players in the league. I have no doubt he would be a very good #2 ILB beside a very good #1. The Packers just can't seem to find a very good #1 ILB, so Hawk keeps having to play that role.

He could be better, but he could be much, much, worse. I'm OK with him. The Packers just need to improve all of the other linebacker positions with players that will stay healthy. At least he showed a little improvement last season. Every team needs guys like AJ Hawk.
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Dexter_Sinister on 7/17/2014(UTC)
Offline nerdmann  
#16 Posted : Thursday, July 17, 2014 4:21:17 PM(UTC)
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DoddPower said: Go to Quoted Post
AJ Hawk is not the problem. Teams can win with AJ Hawk, as the Packers have done. The biggest problem is the players around Hawk and/or the failure to find someone better. Hawk isn't the greatest, but there are many worse players in the league. I have no doubt he would be a very good #2 ILB beside a very good #1. The Packers just can't seem to find a very good #1 ILB, so Hawk keeps having to play that role.

He could be better, but he could be much, much, worse. I'm OK with him. The Packers just need to improve all of the other linebacker positions with players that will stay healthy. At least he showed a little improvement last season. Every team needs guys like AJ Hawk.


Move him to FB, ditch Kuhn.
Offline uffda udfa  
#17 Posted : Thursday, July 17, 2014 4:36:21 PM(UTC)
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AJ Hawk is or isn't a problem depending on context.

Is AJ Hawk worth a cap hit of 5.1 million this year? No. It would cost too much to cut him, though, with 3.2 million in dead money should he be released. Ain't happening. We're stuck with Hawk at 5.1 million this season. Depressing to me.

Has AJ Hawk lived up to his draft status? Nope... nowhere near it. A total failure as a 5th overall.

Does AJ Hawk have value in general? Yes...but it's limited and limited to 1st and 2nd down. He's not even a 3 down LB. Again, 5.1 million for 2 mediocrely played downs.

Does AJ Hawk have the confidence of Dom Capers? Yes...he "runs" the D. So, is that a positive. Has Hawk's running of our D been a good thing? Packers think it is. I don't really know.

Does AJ Hawk show up week to week? Yes, he brings his middling skills almost every Sunday.

Did he have one of his better years last season? Yes. Remarkably, so. Not sure how/why this happened considering he had little help around him. Anomaly, or sign of better days for AJ? Hard to say considering he's been average for years and a little better than that last season.

For my money, AJ Hawk is the poster child for everything I hate about our organizational approach. He's okay ...just not good enough but we'll keep on going with him, at least he's reliable and "could be worse".
Offline Dexter_Sinister  
#18 Posted : Thursday, July 17, 2014 6:22:15 PM(UTC)
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uffda udfa said: Go to Quoted Post
AJ Hawk is or isn't a problem depending on context.

Is AJ Hawk worth a cap hit of 5.1 million this year? No. It would cost too much to cut him, though, with 3.2 million in dead money should he be released. Ain't happening. We're stuck with Hawk at 5.1 million this season. Depressing to me.

Has AJ Hawk lived up to his draft status? Nope... nowhere near it. A total failure as a 5th overall.

Does AJ Hawk have value in general? Yes...but it's limited and limited to 1st and 2nd down. He's not even a 3 down LB. Again, 5.1 million for 2 mediocrely played downs.

Does AJ Hawk have the confidence of Dom Capers? Yes...he "runs" the D. So, is that a positive. Has Hawk's running of our D been a good thing? Packers think it is. I don't really know.

Does AJ Hawk show up week to week? Yes, he brings his middling skills almost every Sunday.

Did he have one of his better years last season? Yes. Remarkably, so. Not sure how/why this happened considering he had little help around him. Anomaly, or sign of better days for AJ? Hard to say considering he's been average for years and a little better than that last season.

For my money, AJ Hawk is the poster child for everything I hate about our organizational approach. He's okay ...just not good enough but we'll keep on going with him, at least he's reliable and "could be worse".


Hawk is the 5th best player taken in the first round of the '06 draft.

He lived up to his status.
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nerdmann on 7/17/2014(UTC)
Offline uffda udfa  
#19 Posted : Thursday, July 17, 2014 6:38:24 PM(UTC)
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Dexter_Sinister said: Go to Quoted Post
Hawk is the 5th best player taken in the first round of the '06 draft.

He lived up to his status.


LOL! Are you serious? So, using your logic, (here we go again) Alex Smith is better than Aaron Rodgers because Smith went 1st overall and Aaron 24th? You should be glad you're not a Niners fan or that's the kind of thing you'd be drafting in defense of your team taking Alex Smith...he was best because he was 1st. Wow.

Vernon Davis went 6th overall, but he's not as good because Green Bay made the mistake of selecting Hawk instead? Haloti Ngata went 9th overall...but he's not as good as Hawk because we didn't draft him at 5? I'll take Nick Mangold or Tamba Hali from that 1st round over AJ. I would mention the guys before him, too, but they're out of bounds because being drafted higher means better? [palm]

Wait, or do you mean that Hawk was the 5th best if you look at the players 1-32 and ranked them?
Offline nerdmann  
#20 Posted : Thursday, July 17, 2014 6:58:26 PM(UTC)
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uffda udfa said: Go to Quoted Post
LOL! Are you serious? So, using your logic, (here we go again) Alex Smith is better than Aaron Rodgers because Smith went 1st overall and Aaron 24th? You should be glad you're not a Niners fan or that's the kind of thing you'd be drafting in defense of your team taking Alex Smith...he was best because he was 1st. Wow.

Vernon Davis went 6th overall, but he's not as good because Green Bay made the mistake of selecting Hawk instead? Haloti Ngata went 9th overall...but he's not as good as Hawk because we didn't draft him at 5? I'll take Nick Mangold or Tamba Hali from that 1st round over AJ. I would mention the guys before him, too, but they're out of bounds because being drafted higher means better? [palm]

Wait, or do you mean that Hawk was the 5th best if you look at the players 1-32 and ranked them?


That's not what he's saying, as I read him. He might say that Alex Smith didn't live up to his draft position, because he's not better than the players taken around him, probably not better than Aaron Rodgers.
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