PackerTraxx
8 years ago
It's quite understandable that Boykin had more trust from the staff than Janis. Janis quite clearly has much more of an upside but small college to the pros is a huge jump. I expect to see a huge jump, after having a year in the program, from Janis this year.
Why is Jerry Kramer not in the Hall of Fame?
nerdmann
8 years ago

Quite true, but we (myself included here) always seem eager to drop the returning guy in favor of the unknown guy. In this case, both are actually unknown.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



I love Abbrederis, I still hope he makes it.

But this MOntgomery kid has skills.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
PackerTraxx
8 years ago
I wouldn't be surprised to see six wide receivers on the team and two on the practice squad, if someone else doesn't grab them. I see a good dose of 5 wide coming this year, at least that is my hope.
Why is Jerry Kramer not in the Hall of Fame?
uffda udfa
8 years ago
Unless there's injury to either Abby, Janis or our "Big 3" I would all but guarantee 6 WR's make this team, and possibly 7.

Montgomery is a lock...he makes 4 locks. We didn't want to lose Janis on the PS so we rostered him, so I can't see how he doesn't make it again. He makes 5. I'm sure the org felt they got a steal in Abbrederis and want to see what he has to offer, so I can't see him going. That's 6.

Are we really going to cut a guy like Pinkard or Coxson if they light it up in pre-season? I'd rather have 7 WR's and have Montgomery/Cobb as the emergency RB's than to lose a STUD WR. Jordy is closing toward his end. A few more and he's done.
UserPostedImage
Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."


texaspackerbacker
8 years ago
I also wouldn't mind keeping 7 WRs. Didn't we keep 5 WRs and 5 TEs a couple of years ago? So 7 WRs and 3 TEs is not out of line at all.

The thing that got me about Janis - and various other seemingly talented young players - Jayrone Elliot comes to mind the most - is that talented young players on other teams, particularly wideouts, don't get basically red-shirted. They get their experience on the field. McCarthy and the Packers are exceptionally prone to being overly cautious that way.
Expressing the Good Normal Views of Good Normal Americans.
If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
gbguy20
8 years ago

I also wouldn't mind keeping 7 WRs. Didn't we keep 5 WRs and 5 TEs a couple of years ago? So 7 WRs and 3 TEs is not out of line at all.

The thing that got me about Janis - and various other seemingly talented young players - Jayrone Elliot comes to mind the most - is that talented young players on other teams, particularly wideouts, don't get basically red-shirted. They get their experience on the field. McCarthy and the Packers are exceptionally prone to being overly cautious that way.

Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker 



We did carry an obscene amount of TEs not too long ago.
Bigbyfan
8 years ago
I just read that Janis got some time with 1s today. Even capped off a 2 minute drill with a TD catch from Rodgers.
blank
greengold
8 years ago

We did carry an obscene amount of TEs not too long ago.

Originally Posted by: gbguy20 



I think they carried 5 one year. Of course that was with only 2 QBs, 1 FB, and probably only 7 O-linemen.

It will be interesting to see how it shakes out but I think they keep 3 QBs and possibly 2 FBs putting roster spots at a premium.



Barfarn
8 years ago

Thanks for the link hahahaha. It's hard to believe he - an NFL coach judging talent - could have concluded that Boykin was better - or doing better.

Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker 



Here’s some of the things Janis needs to get down before he can play effectively, the measurables/talent are only 10% of being a WR:

1. Where he has to go whether WR is playing r, h, x, y or z.

2. The time he needs to be at a certain spot [EG if he's third read in progression, he often will need to delay his move for separation to a certain spot and/or time].

3. How 1 and 2 change depending on the alignment of the D [After a play is called, routes often change depending on whether, EG, the D shows, EG, a cover 0, 1, 2 or 3 look].

4. How 1 and 2 change if D makes pre-snap adjustments [The D may show, EG, a cover 2 and then drop a safety in box, this will often change the routes of the WRs].

5. How 1 and 2 change if D adjusts after snap [The D may show, EG, a Cover 2 and then at the snap transition to a Cover 3 by dropping a safety into the hook zone, this will often change the routes of the WRs].

6. How 1 and 2 change if there's a blitz [If the D blitzes of routes are shortened and or otherwise adjusted and this may have several variable depending whether the blitzer is a CB, a S, a LB and/or whether a DLman drops into coverage].

7. When running his route the way the CB plays him can change whether he does, EG, a stop and go, aback shoulder, dig, come back, etc.

8. Often the after snap movement of the safety will similarly cause an alteration of the route.

9. If Aaron Rodgers audibles to run, WR needs to know his blocking assignment and this can change depending on the alignment, last second shift or unexpected movement of D after snap.

ETC.

After getting all this down, Janis needs to understand what Aaron Rodgers sees and when. EG, if the play calls for Janis to set up for a back shoulder if CB stays on top and flips his hips, Janis needs to process EXACTLY WHEN Aaron Rodgers will see this movement. If Aaron Rodgers is looking for the flip in 1.5 seconds and Janis not seeing the flip at 1 second runs a go; the play fails.

If Janis runs his route wrong, it probably will sabotage the entire play. The route trees and progressions are designed to account for the D’s reaction. EG, Read one slant left is jumped by box safety; read two TE deep right seem is doubled by CB and deep safety; read three Janis on shallow cross needing only to beat CB that had outside leverage and should be wide open. But if Janis aint there or not there at the appropriate time, Aaron Rodgers takes a hit from the DL. The entire play is sabotaged by one wrong route.

And then there’s the obvious like Cobb in champ game; where Cobb curled up instead of continuing his shallow cross and Maxwell INTed.

The coaches work w/ these guys every day. Over a period of time Janis gets reps w/ various QBs in camp and probably a few from AR. The tape is broken down, he's assigned a grade and it is explained what he did wrong/right on each play. Note: he doesn't have to get ball to be graded on his route running.

Over several other periods of time, he gets X # more reps and the same grading is done...and this occurs probably 1x per week each week.

If during one week Janis ran 38 of 40 routes perfect for Flynn, Aaron Rodgers would develop trust. And he get more reps w/ AR. Remember practice time is limited; each rep is precious and most cant be used on a guy who's not gonna play.

Bennett can even test him as they're walking to the parking lot [Jeff you're playing "H in 2x2" in a flip left double-Z Omaha jet 619 619 Blue five Z Thirds naked waggle on 2 and the Will moves to LOS 2 feet outside of weakside T; explain your route reads and adjustments on those reads"]. ESPN reported that when questioned like this Janis would routinely clutch his left arm, drop to ground and fake a heart attack-LOL j/k of course].

Now, it gets very simple, if Janis dont get this in practice he's not going to play; if he gets it in practice he will play. He may even play if his acumen is slightly below another WR; but his charted grades are improving steadily upward at a more rapid rate.

Note: Mike McCarthy said Janis' catch radius was not that good as well. This means the ball has to be more perfect than for other WRs to catch the ball. This becomes really critical on shorter inside routes, where the less than perfect pass instead of being caught by Jordy or Cobb bounces off Janis hands for an INT.

And as has been mentioned, even if Janis is a little better than WR #4; but WR 4 is better at special teams, Janis sits.
texaspackerbacker
8 years ago
My main agenda in starting this thread was to complain a little bit about the lack of use of Janis last season and to express the STRONG hope that situation will be remedied this year with the coaching changes on offense.

I hear crap about Janis can't play because he went to a small college, etc.. A lot of small colleges play just as sophisticated passing offense as major colleges - and some major colleges play less.

Jerry Rice, Randy Moss, and Terrell Owens all came from small or mid-major colleges, not to mention Greg Jennings. I don't remember any of them getting extended periods of inactivity for games. Other teams tend to let their rookies get experience on the field, not the bench.

The whole long laundry list in the previous post of what Janis can't do/needs to learn/whatever strikes me as nothing more than lame excuses. What Janis showed on the field in limited playing time in the preseason belies these "can'ts" and "needs". At very least, his speed and size should have made him an asset on special teams.

I'm generally satisfied with McCarthy's coaching, although he'd have to be pretty bad to not win with Aaron Rodgers playing. Just the same, this aspect - slowness to put young players on the field/seniority system/whatever is a hole in his game. Janis is far from the only case of that. Elliot, Tolzien, Barrington early on, maybe Goodson if he really has some talent, maybe Pennell, Starks early in his career, etc.

The few exceptions to this tendency have been fairly successful - Bakhtiari and Linsley (and O Line supposedly requires more learning that WR or most defensive positions), Richard Rodgers etc.
Expressing the Good Normal Views of Good Normal Americans.
If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
Fan Shout
dfosterf (27m) : Suit him up and have him stand in front of the big board as a draft day cautionary tale.
Zero2Cool (1h) : Packers sign T Andre Dillard.
Mucky Tundra (16h) : Adds most of the information this time of year comes from agents.
Mucky Tundra (16h) : @RealAlexBarth Bill Belichick says accurate draft information doesn't leak from teams until about 12 hours before the draft. Adds most of th
Mucky Tundra (16h) : I am very happy that for moment, Jordan Love seems like a normal human being
Zero2Cool (17-Apr) : Belichick * whatever
Zero2Cool (17-Apr) : "There's a lot of depth at Offensive Tackle and Wide Receiver." Bill Bellichick
Zero2Cool (17-Apr) : Thanks! I can't believe it's over haha
Martha Careful (16-Apr) : Congratulations
Zero2Cool (16-Apr) : Boom. Student Loan. $0.00. Only took about 20 years.
Zero2Cool (14-Apr) : Packers DT Kenny Clark: New defensive coordinator Jeff Hafley will 'allow us to be way more disruptive'
Zero2Cool (12-Apr) : Saints have agreed to terms on a contract with former Packers wide receiver Equanimeous St. Brown.
beast (12-Apr) : No, but of it's for legislation, then half of the country will find it evil, not good, whatever it says....
Mucky Tundra (12-Apr) : Draft is still 2 weeks away. UGH
dhazer (11-Apr) : Does anyone know of a good AI generator to create letters of Support for legislation?
Zero2Cool (11-Apr) : Gordon "Red" Batty retires as equipment manager
Zero2Cool (10-Apr) : Sounds like that's pretty certain now.
Zero2Cool (10-Apr) : Packers "at" Eagles in Brazil. Week One
dfosterf (10-Apr) : Va' Fazer As Malas Va' !
Zero2Cool (9-Apr) : Mark Murphy tipping us off?
Zero2Cool (9-Apr) : “We’re either the first- or second-most popular team in Brazil.”
Zero2Cool (9-Apr) : Christian Watson got married. Wife better be careful with those hamstrings!! 😂😂
dfosterf (9-Apr) : Those poor bastards
Zero2Cool (8-Apr) : Falcons have signed former Packers CB Kevin King, who has been out of football since 2021.
dfosterf (8-Apr) : Collectively, we need to spend more time in what we have, when analyzing ostendible needs and historical proclivities
dfosterf (8-Apr) : I say he is better than so many of these draft picks
dfosterf (8-Apr) : Question of the week for me: Has anyone besides me done any deep dive into the potential of Alex McGough, our 3rd string qb?
Zero2Cool (8-Apr) : Or in Tunsil's case, something gets released day of draft or day before lol
Zero2Cool (8-Apr) : Seems every year someone does something pre-draft.
dfosterf (8-Apr) : Falling down drunk. The draft board
dfosterf (8-Apr) : Allright! Potential character guy/f#×k up pickup in D'Vondre Sweat!
Zero2Cool (7-Apr) : Go Badgers!!!
Martha Careful (6-Apr) : Go Boilermakers!!!
Martha Careful (5-Apr) : Diggs has not stepped up in the playoffs and has a high cost
beast (5-Apr) : Probably not going to let Diggs walk away unless he's horrible... but according to reports he also might not be as good as he used to be.
beast (5-Apr) : The 25th pick in the draft has been an offensive player since 2017, 2 TE, 2 WR, 1 RB, 1 OC
Mucky Tundra (5-Apr) : Odd, why give up a 2025 2nd Rounder for him if you're just gonna let him walk?
Zero2Cool (4-Apr) : Texans to let Diggs be free agent in '25
buckeyepackfan (4-Apr) : 49r's aign RB Patrick Taylor.
Martha Careful (4-Apr) : Reversion to the mean would indicate we will keep it
Zero2Cool (4-Apr) : It's also been utilized in a trade in 14 of the past 20 years
Zero2Cool (4-Apr) : The 25th pick in the draft hasn't been made by it's original holder since 2016.
Mucky Tundra (4-Apr) : Gotta imagine that Green Bay vs Houston will be a primetime game this upcoming season
Zero2Cool (3-Apr) : No. Kill QB. No worries. 😁
Mucky Tundra (3-Apr) : Diggs, Collins, Dell and Schultz is gonna be tough to cover
Zero2Cool (3-Apr) : Stefon Diggs' trade will not be processed as a post-June 1 designation, so that is just over $31 million in dead cap this year.
Zero2Cool (3-Apr) : Bills trading WR Stefon Diggs to the Texans in exchange for a 2025 2nd-round pick. (via @rapsheet)
beast (3-Apr) : Using Patterson as RB and RB/WR tweener... so I think they also signed Patterson as a 3rd down RB, not just a kick returner as articles are
beast (3-Apr) : I think PFT missed the real Steelers/Patterson connection, Steelers new OC Arthur Smith has been Patterson's head coach the last 3 years
wpr (2-Apr) : It has Martha. I was stunned when I was in HS to learn Iowa was still playing half court BB in the 70's.
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2023 Packers Schedule
Sunday, Sep 10 @ 3:25 PM
Bears
Sunday, Sep 17 @ 12:00 PM
Falcons
Sunday, Sep 24 @ 12:00 PM
SAINTS
Thursday, Sep 28 @ 7:15 PM
LIONS
Monday, Oct 9 @ 7:15 PM
Raiders
Sunday, Oct 22 @ 3:25 PM
Broncos
Sunday, Oct 29 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Sunday, Nov 5 @ 12:00 PM
RAMS
Sunday, Nov 12 @ 12:00 PM
Steelers
Sunday, Nov 19 @ 12:00 PM
CHARGERS
Thursday, Nov 23 @ 11:30 AM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 3 @ 7:20 PM
CHIEFS
Monday, Dec 11 @ 7:15 PM
Giants
Sunday, Dec 17 @ 12:00 PM
BUCCANEERS
Sunday, Dec 24 @ 12:00 PM
Panthers
Sunday, Dec 31 @ 7:20 PM
Vikings
Sunday, Jan 7 @ 3:25 PM
BEARS
Sunday, Jan 14 @ 3:30 PM
Cowboys
Saturday, Jan 20 @ 7:15 PM
49ers
Recent Topics
1h / Random Babble / Zero2Cool

1h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

3h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

14h / Random Babble / Mucky Tundra

16h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

17-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

17-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

17-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

17-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

17-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

16-Apr / Random Babble / Martha Careful

15-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

12-Apr / Random Babble / Nonstopdrivel

12-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

11-Apr / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2024 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.