El3ment12
14 years ago
Is it me, or is our o-line protecting well, but the patterns ran just take too long to develop? I blame Mike McCarthy for calling crappy plays. Rodgers was standing back there all day waiting for something to develop, and gets sacked.
ILikeThePackers39
14 years ago
This is Football 101 - it all starts with the lines. If the lines are bad, everything else will suffer, be it defense or offense.

As fans, this sucks - we know there isn't much that can be done with the line anymore this season. So we start looking at other things in the hopes that it's not all due to the line. That's rationalizing. Is it the play calling? Sure, that's a small part of it - but what play do you call that'll mitigate jailbreaks all over the line? Is it the QB? Sure, maybe he holds it too long at times - but do we really expect him to get the ball out cleanly (and safely) with D-linemen quite literally in his face? Really?

It's the line. The personnel on the line. The line scheme (whatever it is at this point). Line coaching. This is tough to hear, I know, because that suggests it probably won't get fixed this year. But Occam's Razor is pointing in one direction: the line.
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PackFanWithTwins
14 years ago

Is it me, or is our o-line protecting well, but the patterns ran just take too long to develop? I blame Mike McCarthy for calling crappy plays. Rodgers was standing back there all day waiting for something to develop, and gets sacked.

"El3ment12" wrote:



That is the problem. If we had quick developing plays, the deficiencies in the line would be hidden by time.
The world needs ditch diggers too Danny!!!
Pack93z
14 years ago

This is Football 101 - it all starts with the lines. If the lines are bad, everything else will suffer, be it defense or offense.

As fans, this sucks - we know there isn't much that can be done with the line anymore this season. So we start looking at other things in the hopes that it's not all due to the line. That's rationalizing. Is it the play calling? Sure, that's a small part of it - but what play do you call that'll mitigate jailbreaks all over the line? Is it the QB? Sure, maybe he holds it too long at times - but do we really expect him to get the ball out cleanly (and safely) with D-linemen quite literally in his face? Really?

It's the line. The personnel on the line. The line scheme (whatever it is at this point). Line coaching. This is tough to hear, I know, because that suggests it probably won't get fixed this year. But Occam's Razor is pointing in one direction: the line.

"ILikeThePackers39" wrote:



+1.. football is won and lost predominately at the LOS.. simply put.

Unless something drastically changes in personnel or the overall pass protection scheme.. we are what we are.. a handcuffed team that has to change the play calling to at least help the unit.. that is a hot check down on every route.. but that is only a band aid at best.

We can't effectively run because of the line, and now our bread and butter is getting cuffed.. you can divert the blame anywhere you want.. but make no doubt it belongs with the 5 between the tackles. Period.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
PackFanWithTwins
14 years ago

This is Football 101 - it all starts with the lines. If the lines are bad, everything else will suffer, be it defense or offense.

As fans, this sucks - we know there isn't much that can be done with the line anymore this season. So we start looking at other things in the hopes that it's not all due to the line. That's rationalizing. Is it the play calling? Sure, that's a small part of it - but what play do you call that'll mitigate jailbreaks all over the line? Is it the QB? Sure, maybe he holds it too long at times - but do we really expect him to get the ball out cleanly (and safely) with D-linemen quite literally in his face? Really?

It's the line. The personnel on the line. The line scheme (whatever it is at this point). Line coaching. This is tough to hear, I know, because that suggests it probably won't get fixed this year. But Occam's Razor is pointing in one direction: the line.

"pack93z" wrote:



+1.. football is won and lost predominately at the LOS.. simply put.

Unless something drastically changes in personnel or the overall pass protection scheme.. we are what we are.. a handcuffed team that has to change the play calling to at least help the unit.. that is a hot check down on every route.. but that is only a band aid at best.

We can't effectively run because of the line, and now our bread and butter is getting cuffed.. you can divert the blame anywhere you want.. but make no doubt it belongs with the 5 between the tackles. Period.

"ILikeThePackers39" wrote:



Not to be picky but there are no hot routes for a 4 man rush. Hot routes are a free WR when being blitzed.
The world needs ditch diggers too Danny!!!
Stevetarded
14 years ago
Pass protection problems are correctable and have been since the season started. Just not by our coaching staff apparently.
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macbob
14 years ago

We can't effectively run because of the line, and now our bread and butter is getting cuffed.. you can divert the blame anywhere you want.. but make no doubt it belongs with the 5 between the tackles. Period.

"pack93z" wrote:



I don't know that I agree 100% with that, packz. I HATE the ZBS scheme that McCarthy brought in and dearly wish we'd go back to the power running game under Mike Sherman.

My opinion, it's extremely difficult to be a good ZBS team running the ball as infrequently as we do, and despite all his rhetoric otherwise, imo McCarthy will never commit to the run enough for the linemen to build up any kind of skill/rhythm in the scheme. Running 16 times a game just isn't going to do it.

Besides not liking the cut blocking, I dislike the fact that they'd been prefering smaller/lighter (more athletic???) linemen. When I've got a 3rd and 1, give me a brute squad line anyday.
UserPostedImage
Stevetarded
14 years ago
Watching the MNF game and Roethlisberger gets a huge pocket and forever to throw vs a 4 man rush. They aren't known as having a good offensive line but the difference in blocking between them and us is very noticeable.
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all_about_da_packers
14 years ago

As for this new "It's really Rodgers' fault" fad, even if the scout is right, that's 10 sacks on him as compared to 27 on the OL, through 8 games. Project that to the end of the season and it would be 54. All on the line.

"ILikeThePackers39" wrote:




No, these figures are as of Saturday, BEFORE the Bucs game. So the line was responsible for 21 sacks.... still high, but not "OMG we are terrible beyond all belief" bad...

The o-line is a problem, no doubt. But of course with experienced QBs like Manning, and dare I say Favre, they realize the protection struggles up front and get the ball rid quickly.

Look at Bedard's breakdown of protection time when the Packers first faced the Vikings - on average Rodgers had more time to throw than Brett.

The line is bad, yes. That's when you adjust. The team - including coaches and both players, especially QBs who can audible and change play and/or protections.
The NFL: Where Greg Jennings Happens.
macbob
14 years ago

Watching the MNF game and Roethlisberger gets a huge pocket and forever to throw vs a 4 man rush. They aren't known as having a good offensive line but the difference in blocking between them and us is very noticeable.

"Stevetarded" wrote:



I'd like to have their running game, too.
UserPostedImage
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