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Offline Gaycandybacon  
#1 Posted : Thursday, November 8, 2012 3:32:08 PM(UTC)
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Sacks>Interceptions We don't wanna be Cutler and do both!
Offline zombieslayer  
#2 Posted : Friday, November 9, 2012 10:18:45 PM(UTC)
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Gaycandybacon said: Go to Quoted Post
Sacks>Interceptions We don't wanna be Cutler and do both!


Wish Aaron would throw the ball away more and not take sacks.
Offline Gaycandybacon  
#3 Posted : Friday, November 9, 2012 11:01:34 PM(UTC)
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zombieslayer said: Go to Quoted Post
Wish Aaron would throw the ball away more and not take sacks.


He really shouldn't worrie about that though. That's the fault of to many QBs. They're afraid to take nothing and make it into something.

Every QB does it not just Aaron. I think it's a piss poor excuse imo that a lot of people make because there's so many things happening on the field at once and sometimes he's inside the pocket and no ones open. I say try to make a play everytime just be smart with the football. Most times than not he does it very well.
Offline steveishere  
#4 Posted : Saturday, November 10, 2012 6:35:55 AM(UTC)
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zombieslayer said: Go to Quoted Post
Wish Aaron would throw the ball away more and not take sacks.


Every time I start thinking that I wait a few plays and watch him have a play where he holds the ball too long but buys enough time to make a huge first down or throw a TD. I really don't have any problem either with a 3rd down sack as opposed to throwing the ball away. It doesn't really change much.

I've never been a big fan of the sack stat though I think it's extremely overrated. It's the same thing as a TFL and it's an extra 4 or 5 yards as opposed to a throwaway but it's so revered as this amazing thing (or damaging thing if it happens to you) that changes the game so much when all it changes is a single drive (and that's only if the offense doesn't get a first down afterwards, in that case it really meant nothing).
Offline zombieslayer  
#5 Posted : Saturday, November 10, 2012 9:27:14 AM(UTC)
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steveishere said: Go to Quoted Post
Every time I start thinking that I wait a few plays and watch him have a play where he holds the ball too long but buys enough time to make a huge first down or throw a TD. I really don't have any problem either with a 3rd down sack as opposed to throwing the ball away. It doesn't really change much.

I've never been a big fan of the sack stat though I think it's extremely overrated. It's the same thing as a TFL and it's an extra 4 or 5 yards as opposed to a throwaway but it's so revered as this amazing thing (or damaging thing if it happens to you) that changes the game so much when all it changes is a single drive (and that's only if the offense doesn't get a first down afterwards, in that case it really meant nothing).


Couldn't disagree with you more about the sack stat, amigo.

Past 5 SB winners, 4 of them were among the top in the NFL in sacks. The lone exception were the '09 Saints who were #1 in INTs.

No coincidence.

Stop the pass, win the game. You either stop it by having one hell of a pass D or you put the opposing QB on his back. Either way is fine.
Offline doddpower  
#6 Posted : Saturday, November 10, 2012 12:22:24 PM(UTC)
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steveishere said: Go to Quoted Post
Every time I start thinking that I wait a few plays and watch him have a play where he holds the ball too long but buys enough time to make a huge first down or throw a TD. I really don't have any problem either with a 3rd down sack as opposed to throwing the ball away. It doesn't really change much.

I've never been a big fan of the sack stat though I think it's extremely overrated. It's the same thing as a TFL and it's an extra 4 or 5 yards as opposed to a throwaway but it's so revered as this amazing thing (or damaging thing if it happens to you) that changes the game so much when all it changes is a single drive (and that's only if the offense doesn't get a first down afterwards, in that case it really meant nothing).


The mental effect of a QB getting swarmed and slammed to the ground cannot be over rated. If a QB is nervous in the pocket, it effects his entire game. That's a big reason sacks are important. A throw away generally doesn't hurt the QB at all. But a nasty sack of a 250 lb + (perhaps 325+) defensive player falling on their shoulder sticks with them the entire game.

thanks Post received 2 applause.
zombieslayer on 11/10/2012(UTC), Since69 on 11/12/2012(UTC)
Offline zombieslayer  
#7 Posted : Saturday, November 10, 2012 12:30:48 PM(UTC)
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doddpower said: Go to Quoted Post
The mental effect of a QB getting swarmed and slammed to the ground cannot be over rated. If a QB is nervous in the pocket, it effects his entire game. That's a big reason sacks are important. A throw away generally doesn't hurt the QB at all. But a nasty sack of a 250 lb + (perhaps 325+) defensive player falling on their shoulder sticks with them the entire game.



Exactly.

These guys are all supreme athletes. I worked out with semi-pro guys and got injured in a scrimmage. Those guys can't hang with the pro guys so I can imagine just how awesome even your #3 and #4 pro guy is.

So, when you have someone who is a supreme athlete vs someone else who is also a supreme athlete, it comes down to morale/heart. It becomes a test of wills. We saw Tom Brady put up the best season ever for a QB (up until that time) in 2007 and Tom Coughlin get into his head to beat Brady in the SB. That's one example I probably use too frequently, but it's for a reason - it was an extreme performance getting nullified by better chess moves.

After these QBs all retire, ask them how they feel about CM3 standing over them and doing the Predator move. Ask if that got inside their heads. I can guarantee you it did.

There was a commercial years ago with Joe Montana looking at ink blots. The psychologist asks him "what do you see?" Montana says "Reggie White." The psychologist shows another ink blot and asks the same question. Same answer. Repeat one or two more times.

I know it's a joke, but I can also guarantee you that at any time, those QBs were hoping they had a safe distance from Reggie White.
Offline steveishere  
#8 Posted : Sunday, November 11, 2012 8:42:14 AM(UTC)
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I'm not saying that getting pressure on the QB or hitting him is overrated. That's what matters. I'm saying that the individual aspect of getting a sack is overrated. Nobody ever talks about TFLs or hits on the QB that cause a bad pass with nearly the respect that they talk about sacks. Players have an amazing season if they have 15 sacks on the year which is great but that only explains what happened on 15 out of 300+ of their pass rushes and probably a bunch of those sacks were meaningless because the other team got a first down afterwards.

If a QB gets sacked on his first 5 plays of the game but gets a completely clean pocket the rest of the game the "psychological impact" would be minimal and it would look like the other team really got after him when in reality they spent most of the game being stonewalled.

Offline zombieslayer  
#9 Posted : Sunday, November 11, 2012 10:30:23 PM(UTC)
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steveishere said: Go to Quoted Post
I'm not saying that getting pressure on the QB or hitting him is overrated. That's what matters. I'm saying that the individual aspect of getting a sack is overrated. Nobody ever talks about TFLs or hits on the QB that cause a bad pass with nearly the respect that they talk about sacks. Players have an amazing season if they have 15 sacks on the year which is great but that only explains what happened on 15 out of 300+ of their pass rushes and probably a bunch of those sacks were meaningless because the other team got a first down afterwards.

If a QB gets sacked on his first 5 plays of the game but gets a completely clean pocket the rest of the game the "psychological impact" would be minimal and it would look like the other team really got after him when in reality they spent most of the game being stonewalled.



Sacks on 3rd down end drives. Unless you're in a 4 down situation. Sacks on 4th down of course end drives. Sacks on 2nd down usually end drives. I don't see how sacks can be overrated.

Even better than a sack is a sack + fumble.
Offline steveishere  
#10 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2012 10:30:37 AM(UTC)
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zombieslayer said: Go to Quoted Post
Sacks on 3rd down end drives. Unless you're in a 4 down situation. Sacks on 4th down of course end drives. Sacks on 2nd down usually end drives. I don't see how sacks can be overrated.

Even better than a sack is a sack + fumble.


Throwing the ball away on 3rd down ends the drive as well. My point is everyone gets all exited over like 12 sacks a year from a player when all that means is that 12 drives were effected MAX. How many pass rushes does a full time edge rusher take a year like 300+ maybe? Then a number of those sacks probably didn't mean that much due to The other team converting a first down afterwards or being in a meaningless garbage time situation etc..

There is never any context with them and it's such a small sample of a players total body of work. It's become a very overrated stat. Nobody ever cares about TFL or batted/defensed passes like they do sacks. I'm not saying they are worthless and don't mean anything just that people overrate the stat itself.
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