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Offline zombieslayer  
#11 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2012 11:11:56 AM(UTC)
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steveishere said: Go to Quoted Post
Throwing the ball away on 3rd down ends the drive as well. My point is everyone gets all exited over like 12 sacks a year from a player when all that means is that 12 drives were effected MAX. How many pass rushes does a full time edge rusher take a year like 300+ maybe? Then a number of those sacks probably didn't mean that much due to The other team converting a first down afterwards or being in a meaningless garbage time situation etc..

There is never any context with them and it's such a small sample of a players total body of work. It's become a very overrated stat. Nobody ever cares about TFL or batted/defensed passes like they do sacks. I'm not saying they are worthless and don't mean anything just that people overrate the stat itself.


You're talking about an individual stat. I'm talking about a team stat. Like I said, 4 out of the 5 last SB winners were among the top or the top in sacks. The lone exception were the Saints who were #1 in the NFL in INTs.

A team that consistently sacks the opposing QB will be better than a team that doesn't. Of course the exception is if they consistently get INTs.
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nerdmann on 11/12/2012(UTC)
Offline doddpower  
#12 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2012 3:45:07 PM(UTC)
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I'm confused here. I hear people talking about pressure, hits, batted passes, etc. all the time. Sacks are a highlight obviously, but I always hear a lot about the other stats, too. In fact, most networks always show drop backs, hits, knockdowns, etc throughout the game. And with teams such as the Eagles and Cowboys, we hear about that kind of stuff anymore.

I agree that sacks themselves aren't all that matters. However, generally, if a team gets lots of sacks, chances are they also get a lot of pressure, hits, knockdowns, and possible even batted passes. I imagine those things are fairly highly correlated. Perhaps the 2012 Packers could be an exception though, since they are leading the league in sacks, but the pass rush seems to disappear at times. =/ There are always exceptions though, that's why it's important to state things as generalizations.

Throwing the ball away on 3rd down ends the drive, sure, but the QB might not get hit. I want mean sacks as often as possible to that the QB hears foot steps and is terrified in the pocket. That mental aspect cannot possible be over rated, imo. I'll gladly settle for some quick pressure and a throw away, but a sack would always be ideal.
Offline nerdmann  
#13 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2012 4:04:53 PM(UTC)
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doddpower said: Go to Quoted Post
I'm confused here. I hear people talking about pressure, hits, batted passes, etc. all the time. Sacks are a highlight obviously, but I always hear a lot about the other stats, too. In fact, most networks always show drop backs, hits, knockdowns, etc throughout the game. And with teams such as the Eagles and Cowboys, we hear about that kind of stuff anymore.

I agree that sacks themselves aren't all that matters. However, generally, if a team gets lots of sacks, chances are they also get a lot of pressure, hits, knockdowns, and possible even batted passes. I imagine those things are fairly highly correlated. Perhaps the 2012 Packers could be an exception though, since they are leading the league in sacks, but the pass rush seems to disappear at times. =/ There are always exceptions though, that's why it's important to state things as generalizations.

Throwing the ball away on 3rd down ends the drive, sure, but the QB might not get hit. I want mean sacks as often as possible to that the QB hears foot steps and is terrified in the pocket. That mental aspect cannot possible be over rated, imo. I'll gladly settle for some quick pressure and a throw away, but a sack would always be ideal.


We just lost BOTH of our starting OLBs.

That's gonna take a toll on any team.

Fortunately, we've got a little bit of depth there nowadays. Interesting they picked up So'oto again. I guess he'll take Perry's roster spot. Starters should be Walden and Moses, with Zombo and So'oto backing them up, no?
Offline PackerTraxx  
#14 Posted : Tuesday, November 13, 2012 7:53:09 AM(UTC)
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Both sacks and interceptions are important. But there's no question that interceptions are more important. Interceptions always stop drives and they always give you the ball and vice versa. So even though I'd like to see Aaron throw the ball away on occasion I'd sooner see him take the sack than throw an interception. As mentioned, he off sets some of the sacks, maybe even more than the number of sacks, by buying time and making something out of nothing.
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wpr on 11/13/2012(UTC)
Offline Zero2Cool  
#15 Posted : Tuesday, November 13, 2012 8:01:00 AM(UTC)
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nerdmann said: Go to Quoted Post
We just lost BOTH of our starting OLBs.

That's gonna take a toll on any team.

Fortunately, we've got a little bit of depth there nowadays. Interesting they picked up So'oto again. I guess he'll take Perry's roster spot. Starters should be Walden and Moses, with Zombo and So'oto backing them up, no?


Clay will play.
Offline PackerTraxx  
#16 Posted : Tuesday, November 13, 2012 8:04:05 AM(UTC)
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Have you heard something or is this just an educated opinion? I think that would be huge, as long as he's 100% healthy. Stafford can be deadly given time.
Offline gbguy20  
#17 Posted : Tuesday, November 13, 2012 9:59:36 AM(UTC)
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PackerTraxx said: Go to Quoted Post
Have you heard something or is this just an educated opinion? I think that would be huge, as long as he's 100% healthy. Stafford can be deadly given time.


I'm going to guess he is going by mccarthy saying "we'll see how it goes with clay this week" and he is just assuming that clay will not sit out if he is close. ~could be wrong~
Offline Zero2Cool  
#18 Posted : Tuesday, November 13, 2012 10:04:10 AM(UTC)
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PackerTraxx said: Go to Quoted Post
Have you heard something or is this just an educated opinion? I think that would be huge, as long as he's 100% healthy. Stafford can be deadly given time.


Experience following the Packers and Clay Matthews III. Chances are, he won't practice at all and will do a walk through before they fly out Saturday and will be a 'game time' decision. Coach will say Clay isn't progressing as well as he had hoped.

The flip side, if they feel he could aggravate it to the point he misses the Giants game, they will sit him.

Do you need Clay for the Lions game or Giants game and beyond? I think Clay came out more preventive than actual injury. I seen him running off the field with no limp after he came out of the game.
Online wpr  
#19 Posted : Tuesday, November 13, 2012 3:19:33 PM(UTC)
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PackerTraxx said: Go to Quoted Post
Both sacks and interceptions are important. But there's no question that interceptions are more important. Interceptions always stop drives and they always give you the ball and vice versa. So even though I'd like to see Aaron throw the ball away on occasion I'd sooner see him take the sack than throw an interception. As mentioned, he off sets some of the sacks, maybe even more than the number of sacks, by buying time and making something out of nothing.


very true. But then a sack that forces a fumble that your team recovers is almost always much more better than an int as you will end up with better field position. (Unless there is a great return on the int.)
Offline PackerTraxx  
#20 Posted : Wednesday, November 14, 2012 11:57:55 AM(UTC)
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