Green Bay Packers Forum

Welcome to your Green Bay Packers Online Community!

Since 2006, PackersHome has been providing a unique experience for fans.
Your participation is greatly anticipated!
Login or Register.
10 Pages«<23456>»
Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
Offline play2win  
#46 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 9:49:05 AM(UTC)

Rank: Registered
United States
Joined: 3/29/2012(UTC)
Location: Milwaukee
Applause Given: 1,076
Applause Received: 724
Tezzy said: Go to Quoted Post
Longwell had two slump seasons he overcame in his career, a 22 pt(86% to 64% back to 82%) in 2000-2002 and yet another season with a 11 pt drop. Morten Anderson had successive seasons of 85%+ followed by successive season of less than 72%, and back to seasons in the 80%+. What about Nick Folk, he plummets from 90% to 65%, and after three straight improving seasons, kicking at 82% this season. I disagree that it is rare or nonexistent for kickers to get out of slumps.

I think Mason can get back to his already pedestrian, but most the time tolerable, sub 80% lifetime. If Mason can recover for the remainder of the season he can get back to respectable and still maintain a pretty solid career stat line.



Teezy, you are right that there are instances where kickers have gotten out of slumps, so, the "non-existent" statement I made was incorrect. However, they are indeed rare. You would have to admit that.

BTW, it is normal for an ebb and flow type of percentage for accuracy amongst all kickers from one season to the next. That is the norm. The thing that has me concerned is actually climbing out of a rather severe slump. He was fine prior to the IND game, making 100% of his FGs, with a long of 54 yds. Since that game he had made just 6 of his 13 attempts, with a long of 48 @ STL.
Offline Pack93z  
#47 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 10:20:38 AM(UTC)

PackersHome NFL Pick'em - Bronze: 2012

Rank: Select Member
United States
Joined: 3/16/2007(UTC)
Location: North Central Wisconsin
Applause Given: 410
Applause Received: 1,130
I don't know if it is that rare of a thing.

Took a look at three of the longest tenured K's in the league.

David Akers, Jason Hanson, Adam Vinatieri.

All have had sucessive seasons with drops or peaks of greater than 10% from the previous season. For a graphical look..
Pack93z attached the following image(s):
Kickers % Made by Season..JPG (127kb) downloaded 49 time(s).

You cannot view/download attachments. Try to login or register.
thanks Post received 1 applause.
Kyle on 11/20/2012(UTC)
Offline Pack93z  
#48 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 10:24:02 AM(UTC)

PackersHome NFL Pick'em - Bronze: 2012

Rank: Select Member
United States
Joined: 3/16/2007(UTC)
Location: North Central Wisconsin
Applause Given: 410
Applause Received: 1,130
The problem, if any with Mason is that he is a lower percentage kicker overall, so his lows seem more apparent.

But just the same, the Packers resigned him with that knowledge in place.
Offline Pack93z  
#49 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 10:42:32 AM(UTC)

PackersHome NFL Pick'em - Bronze: 2012

Rank: Select Member
United States
Joined: 3/16/2007(UTC)
Location: North Central Wisconsin
Applause Given: 410
Applause Received: 1,130
I wanted to slice the numbers for kickers, by summary comparisons.

By range, by overall percentage and percent of their attempts over 50 yards, something I thought Crosby had suffered by the hands of MM. Meaning that he had a proportionally higher attempts in relation to all attempts from over 50 yards because of his leg strength.



Pack93z attached the following image(s):
K by the Numbers.JPG (61kb) downloaded 52 time(s).

You cannot view/download attachments. Try to login or register.
thanks Post received 1 applause.
Kyle on 11/20/2012(UTC)
Offline play2win  
#50 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 12:04:52 PM(UTC)

Rank: Registered
United States
Joined: 3/29/2012(UTC)
Location: Milwaukee
Applause Given: 1,076
Applause Received: 724
Pack93z said: Go to Quoted Post
I don't know if it is that rare of a thing.

Took a look at three of the longest tenured K's in the league.

David Akers, Jason Hanson, Adam Vinatieri.

All have had sucessive seasons with drops or peaks of greater than 10% from the previous season. For a graphical look..


Yeah, but the mean there is around 75%. As I mentioned, the norm is an ebb and flow from year to year. He was perfect through the first 4 games, with 0 attempts in two of those contests (5-5 in both CHI and SEA games).

The last 6 weeks he is kicking at 46%, which is WAY out of that mean. That is where I have a concern. Every kicker slumps to some extent at certain points in their careers. It is just, how badly, and for how long.

I would say this a considerable stretch here. I hope he can climb out of it. He has remarkable support from his coaches and teammates. I'm pulling for him, as I am a pretty big fan of his.
Offline Pack93z  
#51 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 12:56:03 PM(UTC)

PackersHome NFL Pick'em - Bronze: 2012

Rank: Select Member
United States
Joined: 3/16/2007(UTC)
Location: North Central Wisconsin
Applause Given: 410
Applause Received: 1,130
I am trying to leverage your point and looking for similarities within seasons. Just took one.

Jason Hanson - 2001. Career 82.80% kicker.

He had to stretches in 2001 that were way out of mean..

Kicks 5 - 18 Made 9 of 14 - 64.28% - Average Length of miss - 48.2 (one 65 yarder all others under 50) - 18.52 points from norm.

Kicks 17 - 29 Made 7 of 13 - 53.85% - Average Length of miss - 47.2 (two 51 rest under 50) - 28.95 points from norm.

Now compare that to Crosby - Career 78.23% kicker.

Kicks 6 - 18 Made 6 of 13 - 45.15% - Average Length of miss - 46.42 ( 4 of 50 or more, including a 58 yarder) - 33.08 points from norm.


Again.. each of the three tenured kicks have similar patterns, they all seem to go into slumps similar to Crosby's at the moment.

All I am trying to illustrate here is that the sky isn't falling in terms of Crosby at the moment, actually this is somewhat normal swoon for a kicker.

Again, if there is a problem here is the overall performance from Crosby to this point in his career, a lower percentage overall. But for Aikman and others to say that this is atypical of a kicker overall, slumps wise, it just isn't that different than some of the most tenured kickers in the game today.

Even then.. it is 4 points lower than a kicker that has kicked a majority of his kicks in a dome.
Offline play2win  
#52 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 1:07:57 PM(UTC)

Rank: Registered
United States
Joined: 3/29/2012(UTC)
Location: Milwaukee
Applause Given: 1,076
Applause Received: 724
Its cool Pack93. Yeah, I'm just trying like crazy to find a similar slump to his, and coming up with very little, especially looking to those who have recovered with like slumps. I'm just not finding them. His seems a bit more severe than most when looking outside the normal swings from 85-65% ish.

I'm really just hoping for the best for him, and wanting to recognize the struggle he is facing. If he recovers from this one, I think it may go down as one of the best recoveries ever. Really. he has great support from the rest of the team, and he did make his last one. It was good that he got that, giving him something to build off of.
Offline dfosterf  
#53 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 2:16:40 PM(UTC)

Rank: Veteran Member
United States
Joined: 8/19/2008(UTC)
Applause Given: 226
Applause Received: 473
We just gotta root for him and pray, imo

Offline Porforis  
#54 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 2:25:15 PM(UTC)

Rank: Veteran Member
United States
Joined: 8/22/2009(UTC)
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Applause Given: 203
Applause Received: 401
Maybe the refs haven't been getting out the K balls.
Offline beast  
#55 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 2:51:51 PM(UTC)

Rank: Veteran Member
Joined: 10/5/2008(UTC)
Applause Given: 356
Applause Received: 410
play2win said: Go to Quoted Post
II'm just trying like crazy to find a similar slump to his, and coming up with very little, especially looking to those who have recovered with like slumps. I'm just not finding them. His seems a bit more severe than most when looking outside the normal swings from 85-65% ish.



Ryan Longwell's slump of 2001...

1999: 83.3
2000: 86.8%
2001: 64.5%
2002: 82.4%
2003: 88.5%

and Crosby is asked to attempt a lot more 50+ yard kicks compared to Longwell which bring Crosby average down. If you look inside of the 50 Crosby numbers (in non-slump years) normally compare with some of the better kickers in the NFL.

Inside of 50 yards, Crosby is 10 for 13 (76.9%) this (slump) year... but that doesn't seem too bad ether... only missed 3 inside of 50. But it does seem like Mike McCarthy tries more 50 yarder with Crosby than some other coaches do with their kickers.

Crosby Inside of 50
2012: 10 of 13 (76.9%)
2011: 22 of 25 (88%)
2010: 20 of 24 (83.3%)
2009: 25 of 30 (83.3%)
2008: 24 of 28 (85.7%)
2007: 28 of 34 (82.35%)
Average before 2012 (84.4%)
Crosby slump (-7.47%)
Offline dfosterf  
#56 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 2:54:21 PM(UTC)

Rank: Veteran Member
United States
Joined: 8/19/2008(UTC)
Applause Given: 226
Applause Received: 473
beast said: Go to Quoted Post
Ryan Longwell's slump of 2001...

2000: 86.8%
2001: 64.5%
2002: 82.4%
2003: 88.5%

and Crosby is asked to attempt a lot more 50+ yard kicks compared to Longwell which bring Crosby average down. If you look inside of the 50 Crosby numbers (in non-slump years) normally compare with some of the better kickers in the NFL.




I think many of us stick with him because of the "eye-test" he doesn't look fucked up. I STILL like the mother-fucker.

Offline Pack93z  
#57 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 3:07:27 PM(UTC)

PackersHome NFL Pick'em - Bronze: 2012

Rank: Select Member
United States
Joined: 3/16/2007(UTC)
Location: North Central Wisconsin
Applause Given: 410
Applause Received: 1,130
play2win said: Go to Quoted Post
Its cool Pack93. Yeah, I'm just trying like crazy to find a similar slump to his, and coming up with very little, especially looking to those who have recovered with like slumps. I'm just not finding them. His seems a bit more severe than most when looking outside the normal swings from 85-65% ish.


I just gave you one with looking very hard.. Hanson late season slump of 2001.

Offline vikesrule  
#58 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 3:25:18 PM(UTC)

Rank: Registered
Joined: 8/4/2007(UTC)
Applause Given: 60
Applause Received: 193
dfosterf said: Go to Quoted Post
I think many of us stick with him because of the "eye-test" ....




UserPostedImage

thanks Post received 1 applause.
dfosterf on 11/20/2012(UTC)
Offline dfosterf  
#59 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 3:34:29 PM(UTC)

Rank: Veteran Member
United States
Joined: 8/19/2008(UTC)
Applause Given: 226
Applause Received: 473
lol... fuckin' Nick...

He's got a full 70 yarder in him, I really believe that.

Friggin' kickers, they'll drive ya.
Offline schroeder84  
#60 Posted : Tuesday, November 20, 2012 6:30:10 PM(UTC)

Rank: Registered
Joined: 9/14/2008(UTC)
Location: Hamilton, Ontario
Applause Given: 6
Applause Received: 8
My son was a high level kicker (but now retired due to concussion) - scholarship worthy, and ya, those kickers heads do drive one up the wall. Sad but true - one where you need a strong head to go with the strong leg.

Mason can work out of this. His last kick was good, and even though he didn't look amused when Jennings was trying to jolly him up a bit, success on the last, and a win, will carry through. This season will be fine. Just my opinion of course, but I live with a kicker (or ex-kicker) and have an idea of the ebb and flow of kicker emotional life.
Rss Feed 
Users browsing this topic
Guest (3)
10 Pages«<23456>»
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Notification

Icon
Error


Fan Shout
steveishere (8m) : I don't think suspended players count toward the 53
uffda udfa (8h) : Incredible! Wilde's 53 man roster doesn't even have Datone Jones as "IN"...he's "looking good". Sad, a 3rd year 1st rounder isn't a lock f
Smokey (12h) : Attention Guests: Come join us here in the Forum ! A great place to post !
Smokey (12h) : 3rd Qtr/ Jax 17 Det 13
uffda udfa (27-Aug) : Guion suspension upheld...lost for 3 games
uffda udfa (27-Aug) : He works boundary...great body control...great feet...goes deep...runs well...is strong. Jordy Clone, maybe.
uffda udfa (27-Aug) : Tell me he doesn't remind you of 87...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zPZNolFvPI
Zero2Cool (27-Aug) : Only thing that matters : 40 Yrd Dash: 4.54
uffda udfa (27-Aug) : Butler is 6'2 215...Hmmm, wonder what TT has in mind. Ha.
uffda udfa (27-Aug) : TT went out and got us Jordy's replacement...James Butler...not even a camp invite.
uffda udfa (27-Aug) : I knew what you were saying and I loved it! From a production standpoint it was worse than college radio. It had Aaron which made it worth
Zero2Cool (27-Aug) : I wouldn't know good radio if it sat on my face, but I know what I find informational and worthwhile. Tuesday with Aaron, was both.
Zero2Cool (27-Aug) : I am saying my zero experience in radio > your whatever years. :D Bahahahahah
uffda udfa (27-Aug) : Ha! Yeah, I only was involved in making good radio for 8 years. Don't know a thing.
Zero2Cool (27-Aug) : Yeah, I'm not surprised I know good radio better than you. Not a big deal, you have your strengths, radio isn't one.
uffda udfa (27-Aug) : We have very different tastes. I worked in radio for many years. Thought the show was so much worse than it needed to be.
Zero2Cool (27-Aug) : NFL Pick'em v2.0 is here!
Zero2Cool (26-Aug) : Wilde was great choice and if not for Jason's rapport with Aaron, never would have happened.
uffda udfa (26-Aug) : I never caught it live...listened to podcast a few times. Wilde was the wrong guy for that show.
Zero2Cool (26-Aug) : That was poorly worded, my mistake. I was regular, it was great peak into his life. Planned meetings around it lol
uffda udfa (26-Aug) : As for Tuesday's with Aaron I did listen, but I wasn't a regular.
Smokey (26-Aug) : Anyone seen Polargrizzz lately, he's AWOL !
Zero2Cool (26-Aug) : If you listened to them, Aaron urged them to go past the 10 minutes. Jason would be an idiot to cut it off.
uffda udfa (26-Aug) : The contract stated 10 minutes but the show always went longer. Sounds like 540 took advantage and perhaps he got sick of it.
uffda udfa (26-Aug) : As for Aaron's radio show, sounds like he just didn't want to do it and they took too much of his time. Was only supposed to be 10 minutes.
Smokey (26-Aug) : Don't worry, be WR happy !
Zero2Cool (26-Aug) : WR!!
uffda udfa (25-Aug) : LeRoy Butler and Finley want TT to add a WR. Silverstein wrote a piece on it, including Rison mention. Let's get this!
uffda udfa (25-Aug) : The WHY is the big story, but that hasn't come out yet.
Zero2Cool (25-Aug) : noooooooooooooooooooo!
Zero2Cool (25-Aug) : Aaron is done? Why????
uffda udfa (25-Aug) : If you liked "Tuesday's with Aaron" he's not doing it this year. He's done.
Zero2Cool (23-Aug) : Tolzien being evaluated for concussion. What?
hardrocker950 (23-Aug) : wow... what a joke
dhazer (23-Aug) : Cheese heads are everywhere donot be sureprised ifor we are louder
Please sign in to use Fan Shout

Road To Super Bowl 50
Sunday, Sep 13 @ 12:00 PM
at Bears
Sunday, Sep 20 @ 7:30 PM
SEAHAWKS
Monday, Sep 28 @ 7:30 PM
CHIEFS
Sunday, Oct 4 @ 3:25 PM
at 49ers
Sunday, Oct 11 @ 12:00 PM
RAMS
Sunday, Oct 18 @ 3:25 PM
CHARGERS
Sunday, Oct 25 @ 12:00 AM
- BYE -
Sunday, Nov 1 @ 7:30 PM
at Broncos
Sunday, Nov 8 @ 12:00 PM
at Panthers
Sunday, Nov 15 @ 12:00 PM
LIONS
Sunday, Nov 22 @ 12:00 PM
at Vikings
Thursday, Nov 26 @ 7:30 PM
BEARS
Thursday, Dec 3 @ 7:25 PM
at Lions
Sunday, Dec 13 @ 3:25 PM
COWBOYS
Sunday, Dec 20 @ 3:05 PM
at Raiders
Sunday, Dec 27 @ 3:25 PM
at Cardinals
Sunday, Jan 3 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS

Think About It
Think About It

Recent Topics
24m / Green Bay Packers Talk / buckeyepackfan

1h / Green Bay Packers Talk / buckeyepackfan

9h / Green Bay Packers Talk / uffda udfa

9h / Green Bay Packers Talk / uffda udfa

10h / Green Bay Packers Talk / texaspackerbacker

10h / Green Bay Packers Talk / texaspackerbacker

13h / Green Bay Packers Talk / gbguy20

13h / Green Bay Packers Talk / sschind

18h / Green Bay Packers Talk / yooperfan

23h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

28-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / uffda udfa

28-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / RainX

28-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / RainX

28-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / RainX

27-Aug / Green Bay Packers Talk / Smokey


Tweeter