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QCHuskerFan  
#1 Posted : Tuesday, December 4, 2012 1:34:40 PM(UTC)
There was a lot of dismissal over the winter when Joe Philbin went to Miami. Most of us seemed to think that since Mike McCarthy was essentially the OC, we wouldn't miss Philbin much.

Now, 12 games into the season, it seems like we have had a lot of playcalling issues that I don't remember having in the past. Was Philbin's role in the booth to count running plays and tell McCarthy when he was being pass happy? I know that is an oversimplification, but is there an assistant coach that is 'strongly' counseling Mike McCarthy during his playcalling? I would assume there is an assistant something or other than tracks in game stats to work with predictability.
Mike McCarthy didn't overnight forget how to call a balanced game. Philbin seems to be the main change form last year. Maybe we are missing him more than we thought we would.
Pack93z  
#2 Posted : Tuesday, December 4, 2012 1:47:15 PM(UTC)
Actually we are running more this season than the last couple with exception of the end of the 2010 season.

I am sure Philbin leaving hurts, but it is not like this offense can't get it done if they have the time to get it done.

My opinion, this season has been a struggle because of injury and offensive protection issues. If Philbin had a hand in the protection schemes.. I will concur with the impact his leaving had.

But short of that, I think it was manageable.
Gaycandybacon  
#3 Posted : Tuesday, December 4, 2012 1:55:02 PM(UTC)
There is a lot of moving pieces going around this year, and I think that's the problem. The emergance of Cobb, The Injures of Greg Jennings, Jordy Nelson, and Cedric Benson. The offensive line shuffling because of injures.. Jermichael Finley and Mason Crosby struggling.. The Offense trying to become more balenced. Etc. Etc.

Honestly the Offense is still there, I just think the defense has not caught up to us at times, mostly not taking away the ball as much.. but still production, 29 or 30 TDs to 8 INTs for Rodgers. The running game becoming a little better week by week (it looks worse than it is because so many different players carried the ball). We just need to be consistant for 4 Quarters. I'm not worried about losing Philbin either, and I'm not gonna blame it all on him not being here. Because even when he was there, Mccarthy still called the plays.
PackFanWithTwins  
#4 Posted : Tuesday, December 4, 2012 1:57:59 PM(UTC)
I don't see much if any difference in play calling. I see mostly the same type routes and plays being called. The same disregard for the run, lack of short pass and slow to make adjustments.

Only difference I see is those plays are not working like they did. Think it has some to do with defenses being better prepared for us, and some of it just being luck. Sometimes the difference between a completion and a reception is just fractions of inches or seconds.
steveishere  
#5 Posted : Tuesday, December 4, 2012 4:10:51 PM(UTC)
The offense overall hasn't been as successful as last year but they have also played tougher defenses this year and had more serious injures. Despite that this season hasn't been a whole lot different offensively than any of the other seasons besides 2011 with Philbin as OC.
nerdmann  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, December 4, 2012 4:33:52 PM(UTC)
Philbin should be a good coach, but while in Green Bay he provided too many damn off field distractions. If his kid wasn't getting drunk and killing himself, he was raping people.

We'll be fine.

Arodge just needs to learn to take the checkdown once in awhile. GET THE FIRST DOWN.
macbob  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, December 4, 2012 5:37:15 PM(UTC)
I think some of the offensive problems were due to WR injury. Gregorious missed most of the year so far, Jordy's missed all/portions of more than one game. When you lose your top two WRs that's got to impact your passing game.

coltonja  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, December 4, 2012 6:09:53 PM(UTC)
nerdmann said: Go to Quoted Post
Philbin should be a good coach, but while in Green Bay he provided too many damn off field distractions. If his kid wasn't getting drunk and killing himself, he was raping people.



If a few things were different I might punch you in the face for saying something like this. I've seen a lot of crap on the internet but that is just insensitive, terribly untrue, and utterly pathetic.

Joe Philbin is a good coach, was a good coach for the Green Bay Packers, and is respected by his players and fellow coaches both past and present.
Zero2Cool  
#9 Posted : Tuesday, December 4, 2012 6:28:50 PM(UTC)
So, are you saying the offense was prolific every year that Joe Philbin was OC? I think 2011 was more so all the pieces fell in the Packers favor than being on one man. I don't see the Dolphins putting up those kind of numbers either.

Surely he is missed. It's not likely he's the reason the Packers aren't putting up offensive scoring records. Keep things in relative.
nerdmann  
#10 Posted : Tuesday, December 4, 2012 7:43:19 PM(UTC)
coltonja said: Go to Quoted Post
If a few things were different I might punch you in the face for saying something like this. I've seen a lot of crap on the internet but that is just insensitive, terribly untrue, and utterly pathetic.

Joe Philbin is a good coach, was a good coach for the Green Bay Packers, and is respected by his players and fellow coaches both past and present.


I believe he's going to be a successful HC.

That said, I also believe there was an off field distraction last year that adversely effected the team in the playoffs.
beast  
#11 Posted : Tuesday, December 4, 2012 8:27:35 PM(UTC)

The offense as a whole hasn't seemed to gone as smoothly... but it's not just losing Philbin...

The Packers have been missing a lot of guys because of FA or injuries thought out the year... the list includes

Wells (FA)
Grant (not resigned)
Bulaga (injury)
Jennings (Missed time due to injuries)
Finley (disappeared for the first part of the season but might be coming back)
Nelson (Missed a little bit of time due to injuries)
Starks (injured/bang up early in the season, seems to start to get rolling again)


Long story short... it's not one guy... I think missing Wells and Bulaga (which one could argue were the Packers best two OL last year) is a HUGE blow... also missing you #1 WR hurts... and while this team has a LOT of depth at WR... I think Jennings is the only clear cut #1 WR we have. Nelson looks that way at times, but I don't think he's the complete package (at least not yet).
play2win  
#12 Posted : Wednesday, December 5, 2012 6:51:46 AM(UTC)
nerdmann said: Go to Quoted Post
Philbin should be a good coach, but while in Green Bay he provided too many damn off field distractions. If his kid wasn't getting drunk and killing himself, he was raping people.

We'll be fine.

Arodge just needs to learn to take the checkdown once in awhile. GET THE FIRST DOWN.


Wow. You're going to have to own your words here. Bad stuff. Asinine.
play2win  
#13 Posted : Wednesday, December 5, 2012 6:58:55 AM(UTC)
On the other comments I've read here, there are a lot of good ones that together bring it all home. So many factors have gone into our lesser production on O. I do think Rodgers, himself, misses working with Philbin on some level. But, for the most part, injuries, FA losses, and defenses having an entire year to figure us out together bring our numbers down. This has way less to do with Philbin IMO.
wpr  
#14 Posted : Wednesday, December 5, 2012 7:04:02 AM(UTC)
Mike and Philbin did work well together. There has to be a bit of a learning curve with Mike and Clements.

I don't mind Philbin getting his chance as a HC but in the long run I think he is a better OC than HC.
QCHuskerFan  
#15 Posted : Wednesday, December 5, 2012 9:02:44 AM(UTC)
We can claim injuries, etc. But in week 3, against the Seahawks, Mike McCarthy forgot to run the ball for 30 minutes. Line was intact. Benson was healthy. Not until halftime was an adjustment made.
Week 5 against Indy was another shaky half. Yes, Benson got hurt. But the line was still intact. And you have an 18 point lead. As Sandra Bullock said in the 'Blindside', "Run the dang ball"! Mike McCarthy and Aaron Rodgers passed the majority of the second half and the end result was...
Giants game was a disaster. But again, Mike McCarthy fell on the sword and criticized his playcalling. Injuries had become an issue by then, but, what has caused Mike McCarthy to forget to run?
So, if Philbin was here, would he be the one in MM's ear reminding him to run? Then again, I guess we don't know that Aaron Rodgers isn't changing the play from run to pass. So maybe it's AR's fault.
PackFanWithTwins  
#16 Posted : Wednesday, December 5, 2012 9:49:53 AM(UTC)
The numbers don't agree. Here is the percentages we have run the ball.

06 - 40%, 07 - 40%, 08 - 44%, 09 - 44%, 10 - 43%, 11 - 41%.

As of current, this year we have run the ball 43% so we are pretty close to normal. For the number of plays run, 3% comes out <2 runs per game.

I don't think the problem is how often we run, more when those runs happen, and which runs are called.
QCHuskerFan  
#17 Posted : Wednesday, December 5, 2012 12:56:20 PM(UTC)
PackFanWithTwins said: Go to Quoted Post
The numbers don't agree. Here is the percentages we have run the ball.

06 - 40%, 07 - 40%, 08 - 44%, 09 - 44%, 10 - 43%, 11 - 41%.

As of current, this year we have run the ball 43% so we are pretty close to normal. For the number of plays run, 3% comes out <2 runs per game.

I don't think the problem is how often we run, more when those runs happen, and which runs are called.


I have no doubt and no desire to question your numbers. But let's look at the games we have lost. In 3 of the 4 games, we went significant periods of time with essentially no attempts to run the ball. After each of those games, Mike McCarthy criticized his playcalling for the lack of balance.

Stats can be used to justify many things. During the Giants game, GB had 23 designed runs. Pretty good, especially when you consider there were 28 designed pass plays. Stats show good balance. But the truth is 7 of those runs occured in the last couple minutes of the game when Aaron Rodgers was already on the bench. There was a series in the second half when Aaron Rodgers attempted a pass 8 out of 9 plays. But the end of game stats look good, right?
Pack93z  
#18 Posted : Wednesday, December 5, 2012 1:04:46 PM(UTC)
QCHuskerFan said: Go to Quoted Post
I have no doubt and no desire to question your numbers. But let's look at the games we have lost. In 3 of the 4 games, we went significant periods of time with essentially no attempts to run the ball. After each of those games, Mike McCarthy criticized his playcalling for the lack of balance.

Stats can be used to justify many things. During the Giants game, GB had 23 designed runs. Pretty good, especially when you consider there were 28 designed pass plays. Stats show good balance. But the truth is 7 of those runs occured in the last couple minutes of the game when Aaron Rodgers was already on the bench. There was a series in the second half when Aaron Rodgers attempted a pass 8 out of 9 plays. But the end of game stats look good, right?


Not to long ago on here.. I compiled the numbers during Rodgers tenure.. we won like 80% of our games in which we ran 20+ times with the backs vs like ~ 42 % when we don't. With only a ~ +/- 2% increase in 4th quarter carries.

Attached is through week 6 of this season.

The basis was to show the impact on other facets of the game.. I did not expect that much of a variance in win % compared to the number of carries. YPC didn't have much of an impact.. and the # of Pass Attempts in relationship didn't change much. 1.5 more pass attempts on average for the games in which the backs didn't carry it 20 times.
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AKampfan78  
#19 Posted : Thursday, December 6, 2012 8:14:13 AM(UTC)
For the life of me I cannot remember where I read this, but earlier in the season when there was noise about practices lacking and the scout team not providing a solid look there was an interesting story posted. Apparently Philbin took the role of coaching the scout team every day. I am sure someone has filled that role, but with anything there is an adjustment period.

Personally I do think Philbin is missed more then we ever imagined he would be. That is also not an excuse for the way the team has played this year. But having to adjust to his absence is certainly a part of the equation!
PackerTraxx  
#20 Posted : Thursday, December 6, 2012 2:30:11 PM(UTC)
Clements > Philbin

Van Pelt > Clememts
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