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Offline wpr  
#16 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:11:13 PM(UTC)
wpr

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Typical results from DC. Great results first couple of years and then it all falls apart. I can't say why but it has happened more than once.
"You don't hurt 'em if you don't hit 'em." Chesty Puller



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Offline dyeah_gb  
#17 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:15:36 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: wpr Go to Quoted Post
Typical results from DC. Great results first couple of years and then it all falls apart. I can't say why but it has happened more than once.


Interesting point. It is like the one idea works and they ride it for as long as it lasts. I think the big trick by Capers was the 3-4 and original application of the LBs. Apparently, the adjustment in the roster just made his head explode. I do think it is not entirely his fault because of the injuries. But what is more painful though: continuing with business as usual or holding some accountable for 2 wasted years of potential title runs?
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool - R. Feynman
Offline wpr  
#18 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:23:33 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: dyeah_gb Go to Quoted Post
Interesting point. It is like the one idea works and they ride it for as long as it lasts. I think the big trick by Capers was the 3-4 and original application of the LBs. Apparently, the adjustment in the roster just made his head explode. I do think it is not entirely his fault because of the injuries. But what is more painful though: continuing with business as usual or holding some accountable for 2 wasted years of potential title runs?


I can't say it was injuries that brought down his prior teams. I was not the one who first mentioned his long term demise. I actually liked the signing. He turned a defense that was in total disarray around in one season.
"You don't hurt 'em if you don't hit 'em." Chesty Puller



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Offline Wade  
#19 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:28:36 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Mortfini Go to Quoted Post
Having said that you don't know how this game would have went if we had a few more players back
Worthy
Perry


Yeah. They would have given up 38 points instead of 45.

Injuries are an excuse.

Staley was playing on one arm.

Injuries don't explain a quarterback downfield without a defender within 10 yards.

Injuries don't explain a team that got its ass handed to them from start to finish.

Take away the following: Jones long reception. Harris long run. Two other big plays by Rodgers/Jones.

What do you have left?

A dodo egg.
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
Offline all_about_da_packers  
#20 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:29:42 PM(UTC)
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It's amazing that people just assume all this is the fault of scheme.

Kaepernick's first TD: Clay completely jumps up the field, vacating his gap, and Neal spins inside, taking him out of his gap as well. Kaepernick just runs through it and scored.

Another play in the 2nd Q, Capers brings the blitz. Clay, again, vacates his gap by trying to get around the RB/FB through going around him. Kaepernick runs through the hole that creates and gets a first down.

Kaepernick's longest TD run in the game: Walden has set the edge and, instead of holding it decides to bite and moves towards the RB on the play-action. Kaepernick has an open lane to run through.

If you think any of that was planned by Capers, then you are absolutely an idiot.

The problem isn't the scheme. The game plan from last week would have worked. That said, Capers should have adjusted and had a spy on Kaepernick. He has some questions to answer, no doubt.

Beyond any single thing, though, we need play makers. Outside of Clay, there is no other playmaker on this team. Woodson isn't any more. Hayward has much to learn. Raji has his moments, but cannot be counted on for 60+ plays game in game out. Nick Collins is gone. Bishop is out injured.

We still need talent. More playmaking talent, to be precise. Changing some position coaches may be in the cards, but nothing will substitute for the fact that we never had the talent to match-up with a talented 49ers team. Add to that: 14 49ers points off 2 Packers' turnovers gave us a hole that was near impossible to climb out off.
The NFL: Where Greg Jennings Happens.
Offline dyeah_gb  
#21 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:35:08 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: all_about_da_packers Go to Quoted Post
It's amazing that people just assume all this is the fault of scheme.

Kaepernick's first TD: Clay completely jumps up the field, vacating his gap, and Neal spins inside, taking him out of his gap as well. Kaepernick just runs through it and scored.

Another play in the 2nd Q, Capers brings the blitz. Clay, again, vacates his gap by trying to get around the RB/FB through going around him. Kaepernick runs through the hole that creates and gets a first down.

Kaepernick's longest TD run in the game: Walden has set the edge and, instead of holding it decides to bite and moves towards the RB on the play-action. Kaepernick has an open lane to run through.

If you think any of that was planned by Capers, then you are absolutely an idiot.

...


I agree with your point but who was supposed to teach and emphasize these fundamentals from training camp to the playoffs? Maybe the LB coach needs to be fired too then?

If someone is going to commit to the blitz and try to get a shot at the ball in the backfield but then misses the god damn tackle than its like playing a man down.
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool - R. Feynman
Offline wpr  
#22 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:39:43 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: all_about_da_packers Go to Quoted Post
It's amazing that people just assume all this is the fault of scheme.

Kaepernick's first TD: Clay completely jumps up the field, vacating his gap, and Neal spins inside, taking him out of his gap as well. Kaepernick just runs through it and scored.

Another play in the 2nd Q, Capers brings the blitz. Clay, again, vacates his gap by trying to get around the RB/FB through going around him. Kaepernick runs through the hole that creates and gets a first down.

Kaepernick's longest TD run in the game: Walden has set the edge and, instead of holding it decides to bite and moves towards the RB on the play-action. Kaepernick has an open lane to run through.

If you think any of that was planned by Capers, then you are absolutely an idiot.

The problem isn't the scheme. The game plan from last week would have worked. That said, Capers should have adjusted and had a spy on Kaepernick. He has some questions to answer, no doubt.

Beyond any single thing, though, we need play makers. Outside of Clay, there is no other playmaker on this team. Woodson isn't any more. Hayward has much to learn. Raji has his moments, but cannot be counted on for 60+ plays game in game out. Nick Collins is gone. Bishop is out injured.

We still need talent. More playmaking talent, to be precise. Changing some position coaches may be in the cards, but nothing will substitute for the fact that we never had the talent to match-up with a talented 49ers team. Add to that: 14 49ers points off 2 Packers' turnovers gave us a hole that was near impossible to climb out off.


stop trying to be logical. We want to bitch dammit. we just watched the team we love play s shitty game.
"You don't hurt 'em if you don't hit 'em." Chesty Puller



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Offline rabidgopher04  
#23 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:39:52 PM(UTC)
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I still say that the Packers will stick by Capers as they have Mason. If Capers sucks next year then maybe they'll drop him, but I would be surprised if they let him go this offseason.
Do you like bacon?
Offline all_about_da_packers  
#24 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:42:27 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: dyeah_gb Go to Quoted Post
Who was supposed to teach and emphasize these fundamentals from training camp to the playoffs? Maybe the LB coach needs to be fired too then?




So we simply fire coaches at random? That's stupid. At least wait until the coaches + players speak to get a better sense of what went wrong.

My point is pretty simple, though: any proposed solution that stops at firing coaches is absolutely stupid. Any DC - playing 3-4 or 4-3 - is going to need more talent. Players may grow into playmakers (Burnett, Shields, Walden), and that'd be awesome. But the main problem requires someone else besides Clay to be a threat to make game-changing / impact plays.

Remember, we stuck with this team for more than half the game despite a bad offense. 2 Huge turnovers cost us 14 points. Scheme could have been better - no question. Capers has some questions to answer. But seriously, what good does firing a DC do for getting you more players capable of playing at a very high level?
The NFL: Where Greg Jennings Happens.
Offline dyeah_gb  
#25 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:49:41 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: all_about_da_packers Go to Quoted Post


Remember, we stuck with this team for more than half the game despite a bad offense. 2 Huge turnovers cost us 14 points. Scheme could have been better - no question. Capers has some questions to answer. But seriously, what good does firing a DC do for getting you more players capable of playing at a very high level?


On a purely objective level, I think there is adequate evidence to dump Capers with little downside. Last year's team was not riddled with injuries and gave up the most yards out of 32 teams.
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool - R. Feynman
Offline all_about_da_packers  
#26 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:55:46 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: dyeah_gb Go to Quoted Post
On a purely objective level, I think there is adequate evidence to dump Capers with little downside. Last year's team was not riddled with injuries and gave up the most yards out of 32 teams.


And to counter: this year's defence, minus all playmakers (Bishop, Woodson, Collins) except Clay and playing 6 rookies at times was generally average. Even then, Clay missed like 4 games, too.

I'm not sure I can think of any other DC outside of Rex Ryan (he's out of the question) or Jim Bates (he ain't coming back) who could have done much better than Capers, given what Capers had.
The NFL: Where Greg Jennings Happens.
Offline K_Buz  
#27 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 9:57:53 PM(UTC)
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Its like the D didn't expect the read-option and didn't prepare for it. I am open for a D Coordinator change. This is two years in a row that we have looked utterly lost...unprepared...silly out there.

(side note...as I watch Rodger's press conference...did he chip a tooth?)

Offline musccy  
#28 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 10:03:34 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: all_about_da_packers Go to Quoted Post
And to counter: this year's defence, minus all playmakers (Bishop, Woodson, Collins) except Clay and playing 6 rookies at times was generally average. Even then, Clay missed like 4 games, too.

I'm not sure I can think of any other DC outside of Rex Ryan (he's out of the question) or Jim Bates (he ain't coming back) who could have done much better than Capers, given what Capers had.


You're citing Collins to make your argument? He was released before F.A. and woodson is very close to the end if not already there. Clay missing 4 games in November has nothing to do with giving up 600 yards tonight.

Offline shield4life  
#29 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 10:19:09 PM(UTC)
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Truth be told Eric Walden shouldn't even be playing IMO, luckily for him there's always a LB getting injured.

IMO, Perry's speed and Bishop's middle present was missed today.

Executions was terrible out there.

Muffed punt ---> 7 points
Aaron Rodgers pulling a Brett Favre ---> 7 points

That we're 14 points that we just handed them over. Let's not forget also that Rodgers did fumble the ball and luckily he landed on it could of been a different outcome.

The muffed punt did really change momentum of this game, we had killed the crowd @ that point and we're going to ride down the momentum but just killed everything handed the momentum back to the 49ers and they didn't look back!
Glad To Be A Packers Fan.
Offline gbguy20  
#30 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 10:20:27 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Mortfini Go to Quoted Post
You might laugh but dam lovey can coach D


I don't think we have the personnel to run Lovie's D
call me Dan
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