Join Our Green Bay Packers Interactive Community!

We have been providing fans with the best source of Packers information since 2006!
Your participation is greatly anticipated!
Login or Register.
10 Pages«<678910>
Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
Offline nerdmann  
#71 Posted : Wednesday, June 19, 2013 1:35:53 PM(UTC)
nerdmann

Rank: Most Valuable Player

Joined: 9/14/2008(UTC)

Applause Given: 2,701
Applause Received: 663

Originally Posted by: doddpower Go to Quoted Post
I think James Campen is invincible or something. I just don't get it. How many years of average at best--and often horrible--offensive line play must the Packers endure before they try another coach? I would think it would be difficult to get an offensive line coach that was MUCH worse, and they could likely get one that was better. Hmpf.

Campy


Breaking a rookie's ankle on a fumble drill should have been the final straw.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline DoddPower  
#72 Posted : Wednesday, June 19, 2013 2:15:47 PM(UTC)
DoddPower

Rank: 1st Round Draft Pick

FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Gold: 2011

United States
Joined: 9/24/2007(UTC)
Location: Visalia, CA

Applause Given: 2,086
Applause Received: 528

Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
Breaking a rookie's ankle on a fumble drill should have been the final straw.


The final straw should have been pulled some time ago, imo.

thanks Post received 1 applause.
nerdmann on 6/19/2013(UTC)
Offline Dexter_Sinister  
#73 Posted : Wednesday, June 19, 2013 2:43:06 PM(UTC)
Dexter_Sinister

Rank: 2nd Round Draft Pick

Joined: 6/12/2010(UTC)

Applause Given: 292
Applause Received: 266

Originally Posted by: play2win Go to Quoted Post
The patience to run the ball consistently.

Man, that is what I am looking for this season. Running successfully is a mindset, established by the HC/OC. Wear teams the F out. That's what I am after. Do this, and Rodgers will be able to complete anything he wants in the passing game.


Cart before the horse.

Running the ball consistently without the ability to run effectively is going to put them in 3rd and long. It is going to come up short when you need to rely on it. 3rd & short, goal line and protecting a 4th quarter lead.

What I am looking for is the ability to run the ball effectively.
I want to go out like my Grandpa did. Peacefully in his sleep.

Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
Offline Dexter_Sinister  
#74 Posted : Wednesday, June 19, 2013 2:47:42 PM(UTC)
Dexter_Sinister

Rank: 2nd Round Draft Pick

Joined: 6/12/2010(UTC)

Applause Given: 292
Applause Received: 266

Dodd, they were right exactly in the middle of the league in rushing attempts.

Juuuust enough to pass, or juuuust a normal amount.
I want to go out like my Grandpa did. Peacefully in his sleep.

Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
Offline macbob  
#75 Posted : Wednesday, June 19, 2013 8:02:19 PM(UTC)
macbob

Rank: 2nd Round Draft Pick

Yahoo! NCAA March Madness - Gold: 2013FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Silver: 2012PackersHome NFL Pick'em - Silver: 2012

Joined: 10/12/2008(UTC)

Applause Given: 303
Applause Received: 250

Originally Posted by: Dexter_Sinister Go to Quoted Post
In the Seattle game, the 8 sacks and a couple penalties in the first half putting then in long downs kind of forced them to pass on a few drives. Out of the 5 they had in the first half.

They also looked like they were trying to supplement the running game with short passes to Benson and the TEs. (like a WCO).

We didn't run for 2 series in the playoff game playing from behind. The "entire half" is an exaggeration. The last drive doesn't count.

My point being that basing the argument that McCarthey doesn't want to run on a small handful of drives where you don't even know the play call is not a credible argument to me. You don't know what the call was and you don't know what the D alignment was. You can't say they made a mistake because all you really know is how many times they ran.




We ran 1 running play in the first quarter of the Seattle game. If that is not the definition of abandoning the run, I don't know what is.

For the SF game, your argument that we can't know whether the play call was a run or a pass to me isn't credible. If Aaron Rodgers audibled out of running plays in the second half then Mike McCarthy made it easy for him by coming out almost exclusively in shotgun formations.

There was a dramatic shift in the first half and the 2nd half in the formations we used. First half we ran 22 plays, 12 out of the shotgun and 10 from under center. In our first TD drive in the first half alone, Harris carried the ball twice from under center, gaining 5 yards and 18 yards, with the 2nd run resulting in the TD.

Second half, we came out in the shotgun on every single play in the 3rd quarter (17), including all 11 plays before we fell behind. If Aaron Rodgers audibled out of running plays on any of these plays he was audibling out of a draw play out of the shotgun. 4th quarter 16 out of 20 plays were out of the shotgun, all were passes, but by then we were well behind.

To summarize:
1st half: 12 - 10 plays out of shotgun / under center
2nd half: 33 - 4 plays out of shotgun / under center

So, which is more credible--MM called a bunch of draw plays out of the shotgun and Aaron Rodgers audibled out of them, or Mike McCarthy called pass plays out of the shotgun in the first place?
UserPostedImage
thanks Post received 1 applause.
DoddPower on 6/20/2013(UTC)
Offline nerdmann  
#76 Posted : Wednesday, June 19, 2013 10:01:09 PM(UTC)
nerdmann

Rank: Most Valuable Player

Joined: 9/14/2008(UTC)

Applause Given: 2,701
Applause Received: 663

Are there still people who deny Mike and Aaron abandon the run?
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
thanks Post received 1 applause.
DoddPower on 6/20/2013(UTC)
Offline play2win  
#77 Posted : Thursday, June 20, 2013 5:20:37 AM(UTC)
play2win

Rank: 1st Round Draft Pick

United States
Joined: 3/29/2012(UTC)
Location: Milwaukee

Applause Given: 1,076
Applause Received: 725

Originally Posted by: Dexter_Sinister Go to Quoted Post
Cart before the horse.

Running the ball consistently without the ability to run effectively is going to put them in 3rd and long. It is going to come up short when you need to rely on it. 3rd & short, goal line and protecting a 4th quarter lead.

What I am looking for is the ability to run the ball effectively.


Cart before the horse? BS. The Packers have had the talent IMO. It simply had not been used correctly.

If your HC is OK with pass:run ratios of 8:1, your OL will never be able to wear out an opponent to effectively run block. Run blocking is all about precision and power, knocking your opponent backwards off his mark. Good run blocking is simply the result of going to this well again and again. That is what makes good running teams.

"Effective" isn't just "oh, good, this is working. Now lets use it." I don't buy any of this stuff about us not being able to run last season. Too often, we simply chose not to, especially during our first 5 games, taking us to a 2-3 record.

Lets put it this way: our own OL complained publicly after our loss to IND. Were those complaints about their position coach, Campen? Their supposedly shitty RBs? No, they were about the play calling that chose pass over run, again and again and again, resulting in a really fucking stupid loss. Should have never happened. Same with the SEA game.

Mike McCarthy simply allowed himself to get away from fundamental football. Really simple. This isn't rocket science.

Odd too, that after the public outcry for more running plays, we ran more, not particularly "effectively", and won more.

I do think we are both wanting the same things dexter, and I think we will see it realized this season.

Message modified by user Thursday, June 20, 2013 6:02:51 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

thanks Post received 1 applause.
DoddPower on 6/20/2013(UTC)
Offline DarkaneRules  
#78 Posted : Thursday, June 20, 2013 9:15:20 AM(UTC)
DarkaneRules

Rank: 2nd Round Draft Pick

Joined: 8/15/2008(UTC)

Applause Given: 211
Applause Received: 357

I am more in the line with the camp of people that say with teams like this that your best defense is offense. The gameplan is a risk if it doesn't work, but I believe the best plan is to shorten the game with long clock killing drives. The more time teams like the 49ers are on the field with that QB, the more they will hurt you. Once Kap gets into rhythm, I don't believe you can stop him. To me he is one of the most exciting players in the NFL.
Circular Arguments: They are a heck of an annoyance
Offline nerdmann  
#79 Posted : Thursday, June 20, 2013 9:31:41 AM(UTC)
nerdmann

Rank: Most Valuable Player

Joined: 9/14/2008(UTC)

Applause Given: 2,701
Applause Received: 663

Suddenly everyone's on my side!

Shit's starting to warm my cockles.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
thanks Post received 1 applause.
DarkaneRules on 6/23/2013(UTC)
Offline Dexter_Sinister  
#80 Posted : Thursday, June 20, 2013 5:56:30 PM(UTC)
Dexter_Sinister

Rank: 2nd Round Draft Pick

Joined: 6/12/2010(UTC)

Applause Given: 292
Applause Received: 266

Originally Posted by: play2win Go to Quoted Post
Cart before the horse? BS. The Packers have had the talent IMO. It simply had not been used correctly.

If your HC is OK with pass:run ratios of 8:1, your OL will never be able to wear out an opponent to effectively run block. Run blocking is all about precision and power, knocking your opponent backwards off his mark. Good run blocking is simply the result of going to this well again and again. That is what makes good running teams.

"Effective" isn't just "oh, good, this is working. Now lets use it." I don't buy any of this stuff about us not being able to run last season. Too often, we simply chose not to, especially during our first 5 games, taking us to a 2-3 record.

Lets put it this way: our own OL complained publicly after our loss to IND. Were those complaints about their position coach, Campen? Their supposedly shitty RBs? No, they were about the play calling that chose pass over run, again and again and again, resulting in a really fucking stupid loss. Should have never happened. Same with the SEA game.

Mike McCarthy simply allowed himself to get away from fundamental football. Really simple. This isn't rocket science.

Odd too, that after the public outcry for more running plays, we ran more, not particularly "effectively", and won more.

I do think we are both wanting the same things dexter, and I think we will see it realized this season.


What was the pass run ratio last year?

Coincidentally, Benson also sucked as a runner and always has. He was all they had in the first 5 games.

So who was the RB that wasn't "Supposedly shitty"? Who had a good YPC average in the first 5 games. Green playing on a bad leg, Saine on IR or Starks on PUP?

Because if they were not really shitty and it was the lack of attempts, they should have had a decent YPC and not many carries.

In the Colts game, the Packers had their 3rd highest rushing total of the year.

The D giving up 30 is much more to blame than the lack of a run game.

Dropping picks was one of the issues I would identify as the biggest reason we lost. Not the run game.
I want to go out like my Grandpa did. Peacefully in his sleep.

Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
Rss Feed 
Users browsing this topic
Guest (2)
10 Pages«<678910>
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Notification

Icon
Error

Tweeter

Recent Topics
1h / Green Bay Packers Talk / macbob

1h / Green Bay Packers Talk / macbob

1h / Green Bay Packers Talk / macbob

11h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

13h / Green Bay Packers Talk / DakotaT

21-Nov / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

20-Nov / Green Bay Packers Talk / Since69

20-Nov / Green Bay Packers Talk / TheKanataThrilla

20-Nov / Green Bay Packers Talk / sschind

19-Nov / Green Bay Packers Talk / nerdmann

19-Nov / Green Bay Packers Talk / nerdmann

19-Nov / Green Bay Packers Talk / sschind

18-Nov / Green Bay Packers Talk / luigis

18-Nov / Green Bay Packers Talk / PackFanWithTwins

18-Nov / Green Bay Packers Talk / sschind