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Gravedigga  
#141 Posted : Tuesday, October 27, 2009 11:19:49 PM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
If I am a Viking fan, I'm jacked about this loss. You went head to head with one, if not the best, team in the league and you had them beat. It took fluke plays and crap calls for the Steelers to win that game.

I am a registered official in Ohio and that was a garbage call. Just because you TRIP over someone in NO WAY means it is a trip. Dugan went low for a cut block and the guy tried to hurdle him and got his legs contacted with the legs of the blocker. Not intentional in ANY WAY. Terrible call. That type of thing could be called 10 times every game.

And the Favre screen pass? Are you guys really that bitter that you could pin that on Brett. A High Throw? Ummmmmm most screen passes of that distance are high because even though the guy is close you have to lob it over the Defense. He couldn't have put it in his belly, Taylor's has to use his hands. Who catches with there belly in the pros anyhow? Unbelievable.


enuff with all this common sense and facts. Give the masses what they want. Tell them Favre blew it and played horribly. Tell them the Vikings really would be 1-6 without all their luck.

Yea, thats it.
Gravedigga  
#142 Posted : Tuesday, October 27, 2009 11:24:13 PM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post

UserPostedImage

You do NOT throw a 5 yard screen pass if a defender is between you and the potential receiver is facing you. The receiving player should be motioning away from you and the QB should lead the receiver down field or to open field.

In this case the ball should have been thrown outside to Taylors right arm and mid level, not high and there wasn't anyone around to throw it over. Vikings QB threw a bad pass, big deal. He's not perfect, get over it. Was the play his fault? Taylor SHOULD have caught the ball. Rule one in catching, if you can put your hands on it, you should catch it.

Watch the play by clicking HERE.

I'm not a registered official in any state or anything fancy, but I believe the cause of the Vikings losing the game is on Brad Childress. Not so much Taylor or Vikings QB. Vikings were within FG range and passing instead of running? I understand you play to win the game, but I just think that was bad. 51 passes. 18 rushes for Adrian?


Pretty solid analysis.. 2 of the biggest points you made that are spot on are, "Taylor SHOULD have caught the ball. Rule one in catching, if you can put your hands on it, you should catch it." And, "51 passes. 18 rushes".. Just don't call those plays with AP as your RB. It's not like the Vikings were playing from THAT much behind most of the game.


you guys act as if a pass that was 5 inches too high maybe is the end of the world. Get past it and get ready for your ass whoppin in 5 days on the unfozen tundra. I hope Favre brings a whole crew of people with "Thanks Ted" jerseys and i hope they old gray haired fool chokes after he gets fired on Monday.
Zero2Cool  
#143 Posted : Tuesday, October 27, 2009 11:26:35 PM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
To be honest, it looks like Z2C and DD80 are arguing the same point.. Damn it's confusing. lol


When I read his post after mine ... it gave me a headache. I was thinking the same thing. So I watched the video over and over and over ...

The problem is, dd80 doesn't see my entire post. He grabs one segment and runs with it. It's like reading a chapter of a book and thinking you know the whole story.

dd80 is probably too busy to be bothered with reading my inferior posts in entirety.
Zero2Cool  
#144 Posted : Tuesday, October 27, 2009 11:28:30 PM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
you guys act as if a pass that was 5 inches too high maybe is the end of the world. Get past it and get ready for your ass whoppin in 5 days on the unfozen tundra. I hope Favre brings a whole crew of people with "Thanks Ted" jerseys and i hope they old gray haired fool chokes after he gets fired on Monday.


Fail.

Quote:
I'm not a registered official in any state or anything fancy, but I believe the cause of the Vikings losing the game is on Brad Childress. Not so much Taylor or Vikings QB. Vikings were within FG range and passing instead of running? I understand you play to win the game, but I just think that was bad. 51 passes. 18 rushes for Adrian?
DGB454  
#145 Posted : Tuesday, October 27, 2009 11:57:53 PM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post

UserPostedImage

You do NOT throw a 5 yard screen pass if a defender is between you and the potential receiver is facing you. The receiving player should be motioning away from you and the QB should lead the receiver down field or to open field.

In this case the ball should have been thrown outside to Taylors right arm and mid level, not high and there wasn't anyone around to throw it over. Vikings QB threw a bad pass, big deal. He's not perfect, get over it. Was the play his fault? Taylor SHOULD have caught the ball. Rule one in catching, if you can put your hands on it, you should catch it.

Watch the play by clicking HERE.

I'm not a registered official in any state or anything fancy, but I believe the cause of the Vikings losing the game is on Brad Childress. Not so much Taylor or Vikings QB. Vikings were within FG range and passing instead of running? I understand you play to win the game, but I just think that was bad. 51 passes. 18 rushes for Adrian?


Pretty solid analysis.. 2 of the biggest points you made that are spot on are, "Taylor SHOULD have caught the ball. Rule one in catching, if you can put your hands on it, you should catch it." And, "51 passes. 18 rushes".. Just don't call those plays with AP as your RB. It's not like the Vikings were playing from THAT much behind most of the game.


you guys act as if a pass that was 5 inches too high maybe is the end of the world. Get past it and get ready for your ass whoppin in 5 days on the unfozen tundra. I hope Favre brings a whole crew of people with "Thanks Ted" jerseys and i hope they old gray haired fool chokes after he gets fired on Monday.


This hero worship thing some of you guys have is just embarrassing. I like Brett (His play. Not so much his personality.) but he now plays for the opponent. I don't see why that's so hard to get past and move on.
If you can't get passed it then what happens after Brett finally does retire? No more football ? Move on to another hero?

I guess I just don't understand.
Pack93z  
#146 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 12:14:41 AM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post

I am a registered official in Ohio and that was a garbage call. Just because you TRIP over someone in NO WAY means it is a trip. Dugan went low for a cut block and the guy tried to hurdle him and got his legs contacted with the legs of the blocker. Not intentional in ANY WAY. Terrible call. That type of thing could be called 10 times every game.


Whole heartily disagree, he clearly swung his legs out and used the entire length of his body in an attempt to make a block, in which he caught him with a whipping leg.. that is a penalty every day of the week. You can not use your legs to take out another persons legs..

Mark 35th second, his legs were what make contact, which is illegal. Penalty valid.. been that way since I was taught the game and played the game. And a leg whip is a 15 yard penalty, so the Vikes actually caught a break. IMO.

Was it his intent, no I think it was an attempt at a cut block, a poor out of position one.. but an possible attempt. Guilty no less.

[youtube]AqO53PSteaE[/youtube]
Formo  
#147 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 12:26:10 AM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post

I am a registered official in Ohio and that was a garbage call. Just because you TRIP over someone in NO WAY means it is a trip. Dugan went low for a cut block and the guy tried to hurdle him and got his legs contacted with the legs of the blocker. Not intentional in ANY WAY. Terrible call. That type of thing could be called 10 times every game.


Whole heartily disagree, he clearly swung his legs out and used the entire length of his body in an attempt to make a block, in which he caught him with a whipping leg.. that is a penalty every day of the week. You can not use your legs to take out another persons legs..

Mark 35th second, his legs were what make contact, which is illegal. Penalty valid.. been that way since I was taught the game and played the game. And a leg whip is a 15 yard penalty, so the Vikes actually caught a break. IMO.

Was it his intent, no I think it was an attempt at a cut block, a poor out of position one.. but an possible attempt. Guilty no less.

[youtube]AqO53PSteaE[/youtube]


Looks to me, 93z, that Dugan's backside/lower back made contact while the defender tried to avoid the contact and ended up diving over Dugan's backside/legs.

I also heard that it's called a 'rolling block' that's taught in training camp. But, I don't know how accurate that is.

I know you are big on the O-Line/trench stuff, but still doesn't look to be the right call. It looks like a tripping type block in normal speed from certain angles. In other angles, looks bad. I can see how it was called, even though my opinion thinks it's a bad one.
porky88  
#148 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 1:09:30 AM(UTC)
Couple of things

I'm not sure the Vikings are vastly superior to the Packers. Not how it's being made out by some people. I think the Vikings are better in a lot of areas. DE, LG, RB and DT to name a few, but they have a lot of holes as well. They're a team that relies on their elite talent to makeup for their lack of talent at some positions.

The Packers on the other hand don't have as many elite players, but they have a lot of solid or average football players. Both philosophies have worked in this league. I also think Childress is a terrible head coach. 51 passes by Favre is just ridiculous. The game was close all along and he's calling that many throws? Even if Minnesota wins the division and gets a bye in the playoffs, Childress might be the downfall of this team. I'd be real concerned about that and watch it not only against the Pack, but going forward too. For what it's worth, Childress called a great game against the Packers the first time around. Mixed it up real nice.

As for the penalty, I thought it was a garbage call. I don't think the refs make that call through all four quarters, but they did there. That obviously stands out, but so did the kick return.

Anyone else think the hit on the ref on the kick return by Harvin was a cheap shot and and purposely done?

I believe so. There is no way that player has to do that to the ref. He was looking for him. I think that player (Jeff Dugan I believe) should be suspended.
Formo  
#149 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 1:25:05 AM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post


Anyone else think the hit on the ref on the kick return by Harvin was a cheap shot and and purposely done?

I believe so. There is no way that player has to do that to the ref. He was looking for him. I think that player (Jeff Dugan I believe) should be suspended.


I agree. lol
Cheesey  
#150 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 4:07:05 AM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post

UserPostedImage

You do NOT throw a 5 yard screen pass if a defender is between you and the potential receiver is facing you. The receiving player should be motioning away from you and the QB should lead the receiver down field or to open field.

In this case the ball should have been thrown outside to Taylors right arm and mid level, not high and there wasn't anyone around to throw it over. Vikings QB threw a bad pass, big deal. He's not perfect, get over it. Was the play his fault? Taylor SHOULD have caught the ball. Rule one in catching, if you can put your hands on it, you should catch it.

Watch the play by clicking HERE.

I'm not a registered official in any state or anything fancy, but I believe the cause of the Vikings losing the game is on Brad Childress. Not so much Taylor or Vikings QB. Vikings were within FG range and passing instead of running? I understand you play to win the game, but I just think that was bad. 51 passes. 18 rushes for Adrian?


Pretty solid analysis.. 2 of the biggest points you made that are spot on are, "Taylor SHOULD have caught the ball. Rule one in catching, if you can put your hands on it, you should catch it." And, "51 passes. 18 rushes".. Just don't call those plays with AP as your RB. It's not like the Vikings were playing from THAT much behind most of the game.

i hope they old gray haired fool chokes after he gets fired on Monday.

Favre is getting fired on Monday????
IronMan  
#151 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 4:07:28 AM(UTC)
Just thought of something. And I will be called a Vikings apologist but I don't care. I am the furthest thing from that.

What would you say if a Bears fan said , "The Packers were lucky. If it wasn't for a blown coverage on Jennings we would have won the opener."

That would be pretty weak wouldn't it?

The bottom line is every play counts. I don't do the excuse game, that includes blaming the officials. The officials make bad calls on both sides.

Anyway, that's my rant. I just hate it when fellow Packers fans play the excuse game, when they would rip Vikings fans for doing the exact same thing. Practice what you preach.
Cheesey  
#152 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 4:14:28 AM(UTC)
Missed FG's by other teams that would beat you, i'd say that was lucky.
But fact is, sometimes the bounces go your way, sometimes they don't. The Vikings had a streak of "lucky" bounces. Just like we did a couple years ago when every muffed punt or whatever seemed to go our way.
I'm honest enough to say we got lucky that year, MANY times.
It will probably even out in the end.
When you blow out an opponent in all areas, thats different. But luck DOES play in MANY games.
Zero2Cool  
#153 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 8:23:26 AM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
Just thought of something. And I will be called a Vikings apologist but I don't care. I am the furthest thing from that.

What would you say if a Bears fan said , "The Packers were lucky. If it wasn't for a blown coverage on Jennings we would have won the opener."

That would be pretty weak wouldn't it?

The bottom line is every play counts. I don't do the excuse game, that includes blaming the officials. The officials make bad calls on both sides.

Anyway, that's my rant. I just hate it when fellow Packers fans play the excuse game, when they would rip Vikings fans for doing the exact same thing. Practice what you preach.

Tillman stumbled and that's how Greg got his separation. There's no question we won the game because of that. It's sad that with 4 INT's it came to a CB stumbling to get us the win. Yes, good throw an catch, but if Tillman doesn't stumble, we probably lose that game.

And who's making excuses? I've said over and over the flags on the Packers are on the players and specifically McCarthy for not coaching them past them. And as for the Vikings loss. Vikings QB did throw a less than good throw which I say is bad, Taylor SHOULD have caught it, but the real reason they loss, in my opinion is because Mrs Childress was passing the ball over 50 times and only gave Adrian 18 rushes. I think you need 30 carries between Adrian and Taylor. Especially when you're in FG range to tie the freaking game.
Gravedigga  
#154 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 9:46:39 AM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post

UserPostedImage

You do NOT throw a 5 yard screen pass if a defender is between you and the potential receiver is facing you. The receiving player should be motioning away from you and the QB should lead the receiver down field or to open field.

In this case the ball should have been thrown outside to Taylors right arm and mid level, not high and there wasn't anyone around to throw it over. Vikings QB threw a bad pass, big deal. He's not perfect, get over it. Was the play his fault? Taylor SHOULD have caught the ball. Rule one in catching, if you can put your hands on it, you should catch it.

Watch the play by clicking HERE.

I'm not a registered official in any state or anything fancy, but I believe the cause of the Vikings losing the game is on Brad Childress. Not so much Taylor or Vikings QB. Vikings were within FG range and passing instead of running? I understand you play to win the game, but I just think that was bad. 51 passes. 18 rushes for Adrian?


Pretty solid analysis.. 2 of the biggest points you made that are spot on are, "Taylor SHOULD have caught the ball. Rule one in catching, if you can put your hands on it, you should catch it." And, "51 passes. 18 rushes".. Just don't call those plays with AP as your RB. It's not like the Vikings were playing from THAT much behind most of the game.


you guys act as if a pass that was 5 inches too high maybe is the end of the world. Get past it and get ready for your ass whoppin in 5 days on the unfozen tundra. I hope Favre brings a whole crew of people with "Thanks Ted" jerseys and i hope they old gray haired fool chokes after he gets fired on Monday.


This hero worship thing some of you guys have is just embarrassing. I like Brett (His play. Not so much his personality.) but he now plays for the opponent. I don't see why that's so hard to get past and move on.
If you can't get passed it then what happens after Brett finally does retire? No more football ? Move on to another hero?

I guess I just don't understand.


The first Min/GB game set a record for highest rated cable program ever. Theres a reason for it. It doesnt happen if Sage Rosenfels of T Jackson starts.

Also, you call it hero worship, it's not that. It's defending the player. People want to say Favre cost them the game because he held on to the ball too long on the fumble or the "high pass" on the screen. So these idiots want to put the loss on Favre. He had 3 seconds and the defender was there on the fumble and the pass, while slightly high, was certainly catchable and either way, was just another lucky play. The Vikings dominated the Steelers for the most part and were on there way to win the game despite the bad calls(tripping in particular), the "GREAT VIKINGS RUNNING GAME" inability to punch in the TD when Favre drove them to the 3 yard line, the unfortunate defensive td returns.

Anyone who gathered the Steelers are a better team than the Vikings be smokin something nice. Anyway, 7-1 with a bye coming isn't too bad.
Pack93z  
#155 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 9:53:06 AM(UTC)
The loss doesn't fall on his (Favre's) shoulders alone.. they win and lose as a team. That there is the difference in statements in views.

The holding the ball comment was more of a joke for those that wanted to pin all the sack problems on Rodgers.

Simply put.. Steelers and Vikings match up 10 times.. it probably is a close to even split on wins.
Gravedigga  
#156 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 9:55:32 AM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post

UserPostedImage

You do NOT throw a 5 yard screen pass if a defender is between you and the potential receiver is facing you. The receiving player should be motioning away from you and the QB should lead the receiver down field or to open field.

In this case the ball should have been thrown outside to Taylors right arm and mid level, not high and there wasn't anyone around to throw it over. Vikings QB threw a bad pass, big deal. He's not perfect, get over it. Was the play his fault? Taylor SHOULD have caught the ball. Rule one in catching, if you can put your hands on it, you should catch it.

Watch the play by clicking HERE.

I'm not a registered official in any state or anything fancy, but I believe the cause of the Vikings losing the game is on Brad Childress. Not so much Taylor or Vikings QB. Vikings were within FG range and passing instead of running? I understand you play to win the game, but I just think that was bad. 51 passes. 18 rushes for Adrian?


Pretty solid analysis.. 2 of the biggest points you made that are spot on are, "Taylor SHOULD have caught the ball. Rule one in catching, if you can put your hands on it, you should catch it." And, "51 passes. 18 rushes".. Just don't call those plays with AP as your RB. It's not like the Vikings were playing from THAT much behind most of the game.

i hope they old gray haired fool chokes after he gets fired on Monday.

Favre is getting fired on Monday????


Thats not the one I was talking about. He's gonna be too busy picking Packers out of his teeth on Monday to get fired.
Pack93z  
#157 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 9:59:08 AM(UTC)
" said: Go to Quoted Post


Looks to me, 93z, that Dugan's backside/lower back made contact while the defender tried to avoid the contact and ended up diving over Dugan's backside/legs.

I also heard that it's called a 'rolling block' that's taught in training camp. But, I don't know how accurate that is.

I know you are big on the O-Line/trench stuff, but still doesn't look to be the right call. It looks like a tripping type block in normal speed from certain angles. In other angles, looks bad. I can see how it was called, even though my opinion thinks it's a bad one.


I don't believe it to be a garbage call, I believe it to be a poorly executed block, where he whiffed on the initial contact and then used the last thing he had left to block him.. his legs.

If Harrison doesn't leave the ground on that play, the risk to injury is much higher.. like it or not, he caught him with his legs in a whipping fashion.

If I seen a Packer player in the position.. I call it a penalty just the same..

For those that say it happens weekly.. find me some plays that are called.

Do they consistently call it, they should, you can't use your feet nor legs to cut down a defender. Simply put.
Zero2Cool  
#158 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 10:13:21 AM(UTC)
When it comes to line play, I'll take Shawn's word for it.
dd80forever  
#159 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 11:29:44 AM(UTC)
Again you might see a leg "whip" but it's hard to execute a "whipping" motion as your in the air falling to the ground. If he was already laying on the ground, and "whipped" then 100% it's a penalty. When you are falling to the ground and your legs are wailing around I can't see that as being a trip.

Tripping someone from the side by sliding your leg into theirs is done when you have a base to whip your leg. With no base it's pretty hard to trip or "whip" anything let alone an upside down whip like this was. Show me the rule that says when you fall down you have to keep your legs in a certain manor. He was falling, to the ground, being hurdled and his legs contacted the Defenders. Happens all the time. It was a selective call at a selective time given to a team who 1 week earlier was given a first down when they were clearly short by 6 inches on 4th down. The Steelers have gotten a bunch of bogus calls the last few years so it doesn't surprise me.
Zero2Cool  
#160 Posted : Wednesday, October 28, 2009 11:36:54 AM(UTC)
I try having a discussion and you fling things left and right, I respond and you go on to a different subject all together?

:ahole:
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