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Zero2Cool  
#1 Posted : Tuesday, October 9, 2012 9:53:35 AM(UTC)
Previously I said they had two drives under 30 seconds. I was penalizing them for a drive incorrectly.

Here are four of the three and outs they had.

Code:

0:21	GB 43	3	6	Punt
0:50	GB 32	3	1	Punt
0:52	GB 20	3	-1	Punt
0:58	GB 20	3	-8	Punt


Four drives that ate up just over 3 minutes!!

:50 drive
1-10-GB 32 (10:20) (Shotgun) 20-A.Green left tackle to GB 33 for 1 yard (93-D.Freeney).
2-9-GB 33 (9:49) (Shotgun) 12-A.Rodgers pass incomplete short right to 80-D.Driver.
3-9-GB 33 (9:42) (Shotgun) 12-A.Rodgers pass incomplete short left to 87-J.Nelson.


:21 drive
1-10-GB 43 (1:17) (Shotgun) 12-A.Rodgers pass short right to 30-J.Kuhn pushed ob at GB 49 for 6 yards (50-J.Freeman).
2-4-GB 49 (1:12) (Shotgun) 12-A.Rodgers pass incomplete short right to 87-J.Nelson.
3-4-GB 49 (1:07) (Shotgun) 12-A.Rodgers pass incomplete short right to 88-J.Finley (38-S.Brown).


:58 drive
1-10-GB 20 (11:06) 12-A.Rodgers pass incomplete short left to 89-Ja.Jones.
2-10-GB 20 (11:03) (Shotgun) 12-A.Rodgers sacked at GB 15 for -5 yards (90-C.Redding).
3-15-GB 15 (10:28) (Shotgun) 12-A.Rodgers scrambles left end to GB 17 for 2 yards. 12-A.Rodgers pass incomplete short left to 88-J.Finley. PENALTY on GB-12-A.Rodgers, Illegal Forward Pass, 5 yards, enforced at GB 17.


:52 drive
1-10-GB 20 (:18) (Shotgun) 12-A.Rodgers pass incomplete short left to 18-R.Cobb. PENALTY on IND-32-C.Vaughn, Defensive Holding, 5 yards, enforced at GB 20 - No Play.
1-10-GB 25 (:15) (Shotgun) 20-A.Green up the middle to GB 23 for -2 yards (55-J.Hickman).
END QUARTER 3
2-12-GB 23 (15:00) (Shotgun) 12-A.Rodgers pass incomplete deep middle to 84-D.Williams.
3-12-GB 23 (14:57) (Shotgun) 12-A.Rodgers sacked at GB 19 for -4 yards (93-D.Freeney).






Got Shotgun anyone?
play2win  
#2 Posted : Tuesday, October 9, 2012 10:02:46 AM(UTC)
12 pass plays to 2 run plays in 4, uh, drives... only 3 minutes??? Wow. This Packers offense OWES their defense. Big time.

Balance. We are completely out of balance. Keep this up and Rodgers will get injured. We'll then have to use Graham Harrell, and you know what? We'll win, because we were forced to run the frickin' football.
Zero2Cool  
#3 Posted : Tuesday, October 9, 2012 10:03:42 AM(UTC)
On the :21 drive, Nelson and Finley were both credited with drops.
play2win  
#4 Posted : Tuesday, October 9, 2012 10:08:23 AM(UTC)
Both Finley and Nelson are tied for 5th in the NFL for drops with 4 each.

http://hosted.stats.com/...p;range=NFL&rank=232
nerdmann  
#5 Posted : Tuesday, October 9, 2012 10:24:36 AM(UTC)
Time of possession is a WCO concept.

Apparently it's a matter of complete indifference in the Run and Shoot.
Wade  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, October 9, 2012 2:34:56 PM(UTC)
IMO, the problem isn't the pass/run ratio. It's the shotgun/non-shotgun ratio.

macbob  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, October 9, 2012 5:11:50 PM(UTC)
Wade said: Go to Quoted Post
IMO, the problem isn't the pass/run ratio. It's the shotgun/non-shotgun ratio.



Wade, I agree a lot with the shotguns being a problem. Using ESPN for the play-by-play, in the Colts game, Mike McCarthy mixed it up pretty well in the first quarter, with 8 plays from the running formation and 6 from the shotgun.

That changed dramatically beginning in the second quarter: 17 of the 19 plays run were from the shotgun. 3rd qtr: 12 of 17 plays run from the shotgun. 4th qtr: 11 of the 15 plays were from the shotgun.

So, after the first quarter only 11 of our 51 plays were from a running formation, the other 40 were from the shotgun.

But I would argue it's really both. You have to run it enough to make the LBs, etc respect your play action fakes, which slows down the pass rush and freezes the LBs--helping your receivers get open by opening up the middle of the field.

Houston in the Mon night game gave a clinic on running the ball from under center, then running a play-action pass. I just hope Mike McCarthy is taking notes during the film study for this week's opponent.

Wade  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, October 9, 2012 5:44:02 PM(UTC)
macbob said: Go to Quoted Post
Wade, I agree a lot with the shotguns being a problem. Using ESPN for the play-by-play, in the Colts game, Mike McCarthy mixed it up pretty well in the first quarter, with 8 plays from the running formation and 6 from the shotgun.

That changed dramatically beginning in the second quarter: 17 of the 19 plays run were from the shotgun. 3rd qtr: 12 of 17 plays run from the shotgun. 4th qtr: 11 of the 15 plays were from the shotgun.

So, after the first quarter only 11 of our 51 plays were from a running formation, the other 40 were from the shotgun.

But I would argue it's really both. You have to run it enough to make the LBs, etc respect your play action fakes, which slows down the pass rush and freezes the LBs--helping your receivers get open by opening up the middle of the field.

Houston in the Mon night game gave a clinic on running the ball from under center, then running a play-action pass. I just hope Mike McCarthy is taking notes during the film study for this week's opponent.



Good detail here, macbob. I'm glad people like you and Kevin are willing to go back and look things up so lazy, shoot-from-the-hipsters like me can continue to lazily shoot from the hip.

[grin1]
gbguy20  
#9 Posted : Tuesday, October 9, 2012 10:16:55 PM(UTC)
Mccarthy essentially gave up on the run the minute Cedric went down. Granted, Alex Green was fucking terrible on all but 1 play so during the game I didn't hold it against him too much.

I was going to end it with "but damn those numbers," but when u look at Alex Green's number before his long run....you just want to say "damn those numbers" about those too.

IDK, I can't hold it against him THIS WEEK.
macbob  
#10 Posted : Wednesday, October 10, 2012 5:06:05 PM(UTC)
gbguy20 said: Go to Quoted Post
Mccarthy essentially gave up on the run the minute Cedric went down. Granted, Alex Green was fucking terrible on all but 1 play so during the game I didn't hold it against him too much.

I was going to end it with "but damn those numbers," but when u look at Alex Green's number before his long run....you just want to say "damn those numbers" about those too.

IDK, I can't hold it against him THIS WEEK.


What about Kuhn? There were other options besides Green than the one Mike McCarthy chose (abandon the run). Kuhn's not going to break a 40 yarder, but he can pound it inside and can be a good lead-in to a play-action pass.

For someone who says he wants to run the ball, Mike McCarthy abandons the run incredibly quickly (and in the case of the Seattle game before the first play was run).
gbguy20  
#11 Posted : Wednesday, October 10, 2012 8:39:32 PM(UTC)
macbob said: Go to Quoted Post
What about Kuhn? There were other options besides Green than the one Mike McCarthy chose (abandon the run). Kuhn's not going to break a 40 yarder, but he can pound it inside and can be a good lead-in to a play-action pass.

For someone who says he wants to run the ball, Mike McCarthy abandons the run incredibly quickly (and in the case of the Seattle game before the first play was run).


I disagree that Kuhn is the guy to make the defenses respect the play fake. I fully agree with your second statement.
zombieslayer  
#12 Posted : Wednesday, October 10, 2012 9:13:55 PM(UTC)
I'd second bringing in Kuhn. Yes, he'll not break the big one, but at least he'll make the defenders sore after the game.
nerdmann  
#13 Posted : Wednesday, October 10, 2012 9:40:19 PM(UTC)
zombieslayer said: Go to Quoted Post
I'd second bringing in Kuhn. Yes, he'll not break the big one, but at least he'll make the defenders sore after the game.


Green deserves a shot.

Remember, he led the nation in per carry average at Hawaii.

Dude also paid his dues on ST, which cost him his rookie year after an ugly knee injury. He deserves it.

Maybe Mike McCarthy will start calling some screens...

(I think Green would look really good running those "Randall Cobb/Percy Harvin/Darrin Sproles/Reggie Bush" type plays out of the backfield.)
Porforis  
#14 Posted : Wednesday, October 10, 2012 9:58:38 PM(UTC)
Wade said: Go to Quoted Post
IMO, the problem isn't the pass/run ratio. It's the shotgun/non-shotgun ratio.


Personally, I think it's an issue with the points scored/points allowed ratio.
RajiRoar  
#15 Posted : Wednesday, October 10, 2012 10:46:46 PM(UTC)
i'm not sold on Green.. but he may be our best option at this point.

Hawaii has a very non-NFL style offense. so really it's up how how well he's been coached since then.

we know what we have with Starks which is "meh"..


(i'd personally like to see him bulk up that 6'2 frame because he looked like a WR in our SB run.)
Gaycandybacon  
#16 Posted : Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:10:52 PM(UTC)
RajiRoar said: Go to Quoted Post
i'm not sold on Green.. but he may be our best option at this point.
an
Hawaii has a very non-NFL style offense. so really it's up how how well he's been coached since then.

we know what we have with Starks which is "meh"..


(i'd personally like to see him bulk up that 6'2 frame because he looked like a WR in our SB run.)


At least we know we have 2 Backs with Speed, catching ablity and potential. In Green and Saine. Green reminds me of Benson so much. The body, the running style, the explosiveness (may be even more explosive then Benson) The thing we will miss most from Benson is Pass Protection. Which Green needs to improve on.
Wade  
#17 Posted : Thursday, October 11, 2012 6:14:45 AM(UTC)
How about this?

The Packers hire a "head coach's assistant". Pay him $1K/game and pay his plane flights and hotel bills.

He has two jobs.

1. Stand on the sideline and say, "Coach, you're calling too many pass plays again."
2. Stand on the sideline and say, "Mike, you dumb fuck, you just called four straight plays from the shotgun again."

Bet the team pays far more than that for motivational speakers, consultants, and whatnot.

Zero2Cool  
#18 Posted : Thursday, October 11, 2012 7:09:45 AM(UTC)
4 drives, 3 minutes.

40 second play clock right? We'll use 35 seconds per play to round it down a bit.

15:00 - 1st and 10 - run for zero yards
14:25 - 2nd and 10 - run for zero yards
13:50 - 3rd and 10 - run for zero yards
13:15 - 4th and 10 - punt

Figure 1 minutes, 45 seconds for 1 drive.
Figure 3 minutes, 30 seconds for 2 drives.
Figure 5 minutes, 15 seconds for 3 drives.
Figure 7 minutes, 00 seconds for 4 drives.


12 runs for 0 yards over four drives eats up 7 minutes. Whereas the Packers chewed up 3 minutes previously. We can't go back an change the outcome, but I wonder what would have happened if the Colts had 4 less minutes to play with.
macbob  
#19 Posted : Thursday, October 11, 2012 2:52:11 PM(UTC)
Zero2Cool said: Go to Quoted Post
4 drives, 3 minutes.

40 second play clock right? We'll use 35 seconds per play to round it down a bit.

15:00 - 1st and 10 - run for zero yards
14:25 - 2nd and 10 - run for zero yards
13:50 - 3rd and 10 - run for zero yards
13:15 - 4th and 10 - punt

Figure 1 minutes, 45 seconds for 1 drive.
Figure 3 minutes, 30 seconds for 2 drives.
Figure 5 minutes, 15 seconds for 3 drives.
Figure 7 minutes, 00 seconds for 4 drives.


12 runs for 0 yards over four drives eats up 7 minutes. Whereas the Packers chewed up 3 minutes previously. We can't go back an change the outcome, but I wonder what would have happened if the Colts had 4 less minutes to play with.


I'll just say that I find it highly unusual for a team up by 18 and getting the ball to start the 2nd half to call the first seven plays pass plays, with 6 out of the shotgun, resulting in two 3 & outs (one became a 4 & out because a penalty was called on one of the pass plays). With a lead like that I would have expected SOME attempt at running some time off the clock.
Gaycandybacon  
#20 Posted : Thursday, October 11, 2012 2:59:50 PM(UTC)
macbob said: Go to Quoted Post
I'll just say that I find it highly unusual for a team up by 18 and getting the ball to start the 2nd half to call the first seven plays pass plays, with 6 out of the shotgun, resulting in two 3 & outs (one became a 4 & out because a penalty was called on one of the pass plays). With a lead like that I would have expected SOME attempt at running some time off the clock.


I have no earthly idea why they went to a sorta shootout/desparate gameplan in the 2nd half. I hope it doesn't continue. That opening half INT and quick score cause that apporach. Very uncharacteristic by this offense.
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