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Offline PackFanWithTwins  
#16 Posted : Monday, December 31, 2012 8:17:11 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
There continues to be guys wide open underneath, but Rodgers just won't get them the ball.


This is the NFL not a playground. He has progressions to go through. We may see a back some somebody uncovered, because we don't know where rodgers is in the progressions.

I believe this issue is more play design, than Rodgers whoring. If he was really worried about stats he would dump the ball off more because to raise his completion percentage.
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Offline wpr  
#17 Posted : Monday, December 31, 2012 8:54:55 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
Get the ball out, Aaron.

We're gonna need you to not fail.


Aaron Rodgers
Total yards #8 (with more than 4000)
Completion % #3 (250 or more attempts)
TDs #2
Fewest Ints #1 (400 or more attempts) #2 (300 or more attempts)
QB rating #1.

So what part of this is stat whoring?
What would GB's record be if Aaron Rodgers was not in the game? I am willing to say they would not even be a .500 team. Let the man do his job and get off his case.

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Offline PackerTraxx  
#18 Posted : Monday, December 31, 2012 12:04:16 PM(UTC)
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I too would like to see Aaron take the 5, 8 or whatever yards are there on first or second down. On third down is where buying time is important to get the needed yards. It keeps our D off the field and their D on the field.
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Offline doddpower  
#19 Posted : Monday, December 31, 2012 1:11:03 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: PackerTraxx Go to Quoted Post
I too would like to see Aaron take the 5, 8 or whatever yards are there on first or second down. On third down is where buying time is important to get the needed yards. It keeps our D off the field and their D on the field.


As others have mentioned, it has everything to do with play design and execution. I noticed multiple quick passes against the Vikings; several slants, and multiple hot routes directly to the area where the blitzer's vacated. It's no where near as simple as Aaron just "dumping it off," especially without a guy like Darren Sproles. I thought he did a good job of doing that on Sunday. If the dump-off or check down pass is third or forth in the progression, he's not always going to get to them, and they may not be open anyway (and if they are, it may not be enough for the first down).

Offline dfosterf  
#20 Posted : Monday, December 31, 2012 1:34:01 PM(UTC)
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Carefully and slowly step back from the crack-pipe.

Without Aaron Rodgers' magnificent skills, the Green Bay Packers would be in the absolute basement of the NFL.

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damn skippy I'm an owner. I currently own a full .00001924537805515393 % of the Green Bay Packers.



thanks Post received 1 applause.
rabidgopher04 on 1/1/2013(UTC)
Offline nerdmann  
#21 Posted : Monday, December 31, 2012 5:29:15 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: wpr Go to Quoted Post
you can't blame Aaron Rodgers for wanting to take a shot down field when they were down and needed to score points. They vikings secondary was in a shambles so the opportunity was there.


You might want to burn clock and keep their RB off the field, no? Keep our defense off the field, and prevent them from wearing down?

Move the chains. Score points. Dominate time of possession.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline nerdmann  
#22 Posted : Monday, December 31, 2012 5:30:05 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: dfosterf Go to Quoted Post
Carefully and slowly step back from the crack-pipe.

Without Aaron Rodgers' magnificent skills, the Green Bay Packers would be in the absolute basement of the NFL.



If Mike McCarthy would have stayed in San Francisco, Alex Smith would be as good as Aaron Rodgers is right now. Aaron Rodgers would likely have been a bust.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline Gaycandybacon  
#23 Posted : Monday, December 31, 2012 5:43:34 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
If Mike McCarthy would have stayed in San Francisco, Alex Smith would be as good as Aaron Rodgers is right now. Aaron Rodgers would likely have been a bust.


No. No. No. No. No. Not talking

Aaron Rodgers had and has a better skill set than Alex Smith. Sure blame the 6 or 7 Offensive Coordinators for him stinking up the niners for years, poor little Alex smith doesn't have anyone to hold his hand. No wonder he sucks. Sarcasm I say if you need someone to make you better. You aren't a great player.

Not even 2 years under a 'QB coach' in Jim Harbaugh, and Smith gets benched for a rookie..

I don't like when coaches get more credit for the player than the player. Which I think is never the case. I think, even know people inspire you and coach you or what ever. You have to make yourself a better player, not someone else.

And there's is no one better than Aaron Rodgers at it. imo.
Offline nerdmann  
#24 Posted : Monday, December 31, 2012 7:05:35 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Gaycandybacon Go to Quoted Post
No. No. No. No. No. Not talking

Aaron Rodgers had and has a better skill set than Alex Smith. Sure blame the 6 or 7 Offensive Coordinators for him stinking up the niners for years, poor little Alex smith doesn't have anyone to hold his hand. No wonder he sucks. Sarcasm I say if you need someone to make you better. You aren't a great player.

Not even 2 years under a 'QB coach' in Jim Harbaugh, and Smith gets benched for a rookie..

I don't like when coaches get more credit for the player than the player. Which I think is never the case. I think, even know people inspire you and coach you or what ever. You have to make yourself a better player, not someone else.

And there's is no one better than Aaron Rodgers at it. imo.


You remember how Aaron looked in games, pre-McCarthy?

FACT: McCarthy picked Alex Smith over Aaron Rodgers.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline Gaycandybacon  
#25 Posted : Tuesday, January 1, 2013 2:43:20 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
You remember how Aaron looked in games, pre-McCarthy?

FACT: McCarthy picked Alex Smith over Aaron Rodgers.


OH YA I forgot!

he was on the bench....

and it was his rookie year.

I'm pretty sure it's not McCarthy who made him who is today. Sure it helped sitting behind a Great QB and that QB school. But that accuracy, that arm, his athleticism, and all of his preparation and intelligence week to week.
You can't teach none of that.

Listen to the guy on his radio show. Pretty remarkable the way he breaks down plays sometimes. He remembers everything that's going on the field. And I believe he is the best scanner of a field in the NFL.

You know why he's not looking for stuff underneath? 1. we're trying to win. 2. Well have you been introduced to this WR core? , and the difference between the talent of the WRs and RBs on our team? This is an attacking offense. Not some game manager offense.

I saw nothing wrong with Rodgers performance sunday. He put us in a situation to win. Our defense just couldn't do it's job.

Message modified by user Tuesday, January 1, 2013 2:57:14 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline wpr  
#26 Posted : Tuesday, January 1, 2013 6:56:40 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
You might want to burn clock and keep their RB off the field, no? Keep our defense off the field, and prevent them from wearing down?

Move the chains. Score points. Dominate time of possession.


You are arguing two different issues.
1. You said Rodgers is a stat whore because he throws the deep ball when a player is open because he wants to get a lot of yardage into his stats.
2. Now you are saying he doesn't run the clock effectively.

They are two separate issues.

1. It makes no sense at all to check down to a short pass if you can see a receiver coming open further down field. It is stupid football to ignore him and throw a short pass for the sake of the clock. Why take 10 plays to move the ball the same number of yards against a struggling secondary that you can get in 3? The goal is to score not to see who can consume the most time. When you trail in a game the goal is to score as quick as you can. ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU ARE DOWN BY 2 OR MORE SCORES.
Taking 10 plays instead of 3 allows for more mistakes to occur. (Incompletions, interceptions, not getting the required yards for a first down and having the clock run out on you before you score.) Ultimately you move the ball the same number of yards. Nothing changes in Rodgers stats very much. He ends up with more attempts and completions. Maybe his completion percent is higher. Nothing you suggest makes him a stat whore. He ended up the year 8th in total yards. Not much of a stat whore.

2. Time of possession. It is the OC or HC that gives the QB the plays. Aaron Rodgers just works with what he has. If Mike was more concerned with the clock than scoring he would call more running plays. They could use up 2 min and not even get 10 yards. Big deal. He wants the ball in the endzone. Thus they pass the ball instead of running it. Sure Rodgers can audible to a run but MN secondary is weak. They had players come out of the game making them more susceptible to the pass. Why change to a run and burn clock when you can move 30 yards down field in a single play?

Ultimately Aaron is working with whatever the defense is giving him. If they put 8 men in the box he doesn't run he passes. If they go cover 2 with deep safeties he runs or throws short. If they pull the safeties up and have single coverage outside he is looking deep. Until you have studied film for hundreds of hours on the other team's tendencies and then stand behind the center and see what the defense doing you can't say jack. Watching the tv does not give you the whole story.

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DoddPower on 1/1/2013(UTC)
Offline mi_keys  
#27 Posted : Tuesday, January 1, 2013 12:03:34 PM(UTC)
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Nerd, I could pick apart some of your spasticated statements bit by bit as others have already done. Instead I'll just remind you that we scored 34 points. 34. That should be enough to win any game. The offense wasn't the problem last Sunday. End of.
Born and bred a cheesehead
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zombieslayer on 1/1/2013(UTC)
Offline zombieslayer  
#28 Posted : Tuesday, January 1, 2013 12:11:59 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: mi_keys Go to Quoted Post
Nerd, I could pick apart some of your spasticated statements bit by bit as others have already done. Instead I'll just remind you that we scored 34 points. 34. That should be enough to win any game. The offense wasn't the problem last Sunday. End of.


This.

You score 34 points and you lose, the problem is the D didn't do enough. This alone should have won the game:
Quote:
Rodgers 28 40 365 70.0 9.1 4 0 131.8


Aaron Rodgers doesn't deserve a fail. He deserves a medal.

The D gets the fail. The numbers don't lie. They made Christian Ponder look like Peyton Manning.
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Offline nerdmann  
#29 Posted : Tuesday, January 1, 2013 12:55:52 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: zombieslayer Go to Quoted Post
This.

You score 34 points and you lose, the problem is the D didn't do enough. This alone should have won the game:


Aaron Rodgers doesn't deserve a fail. He deserves a medal.

The D gets the fail. The numbers don't lie. They made Christian Ponder look like Peyton Manning.


I'm not saying the D is free from shit suckage. Tramon Williams completely shit himself. I posted on that too.

This issue goes beyond this one game. It is an ongoing issue.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline nerdmann  
#30 Posted : Tuesday, January 1, 2013 12:58:10 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: wpr Go to Quoted Post
You are arguing two different issues.
1. You said Rodgers is a stat whore because he throws the deep ball when a player is open because he wants to get a lot of yardage into his stats.
2. Now you are saying he doesn't run the clock effectively.

They are two separate issues.

1. It makes no sense at all to check down to a short pass if you can see a receiver coming open further down field. It is stupid football to ignore him and throw a short pass for the sake of the clock. Why take 10 plays to move the ball the same number of yards against a struggling secondary that you can get in 3? The goal is to score not to see who can consume the most time. When you trail in a game the goal is to score as quick as you can. ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU ARE DOWN BY 2 OR MORE SCORES.
Taking 10 plays instead of 3 allows for more mistakes to occur. (Incompletions, interceptions, not getting the required yards for a first down and having the clock run out on you before you score.) Ultimately you move the ball the same number of yards. Nothing changes in Rodgers stats very much. He ends up with more attempts and completions. Maybe his completion percent is higher. Nothing you suggest makes him a stat whore. He ended up the year 8th in total yards. Not much of a stat whore.

2. Time of possession. It is the OC or HC that gives the QB the plays. Aaron Rodgers just works with what he has. If Mike was more concerned with the clock than scoring he would call more running plays. They could use up 2 min and not even get 10 yards. Big deal. He wants the ball in the endzone. Thus they pass the ball instead of running it. Sure Rodgers can audible to a run but MN secondary is weak. They had players come out of the game making them more susceptible to the pass. Why change to a run and burn clock when you can move 30 yards down field in a single play?

Ultimately Aaron is working with whatever the defense is giving him. If they put 8 men in the box he doesn't run he passes. If they go cover 2 with deep safeties he runs or throws short. If they pull the safeties up and have single coverage outside he is looking deep. Until you have studied film for hundreds of hours on the other team's tendencies and then stand behind the center and see what the defense doing you can't say jack. Watching the tv does not give you the whole story.


If the person downfield was in fact, already open, then there would be no need to wait the extra 7 seconds to get the ball out, no?

And this is not Aaron's obsession alone. But Aaron and Mike are obsessed with obliterating Favre from the record books. THAT is why they abandon the run. THAT is why they throw deep constantly.

They know that Aaron is unlikely to play as long as Favre, so they need to break his records in a shorter amount of time.

“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
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