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Yerko  
#1 Posted : Thursday, February 7, 2013 9:58:25 AM(UTC)

Trying to follow the format of QCHuskerfans posts, but mine might be a tad bit *unrealistic*. It is the offseason so sometimes my thoughts get the best of me.

Depth Chart for 2013:
1. ?- Starting position is up for grabs.
2. DuJuan Harris- Showed some spark late last season, quite like Starks in 2010. I don't believe it was enough of a sample though to mark him in as the #1.
3. Alex Green- Coming off an ACL injury the previous season and not fully ready this past season, we didn't see much of Green. I think he is a good 3rd down back though.

Cut:
James Starks- Great late season in 2010. Has done nothing but been injured since.
Cedric Benson- With last season's major injury, I don't think Ced will be the same runningback.
Brandon Saine- Again, injuries.

Draft:
There are some great options in the draft. While it isn't always wise to count on a rookie in any starting position, I think there are a few names that can come into the pros and immediately make an impact.

Eddie Lacy
-If Lacy is still on the board at 26, the Packers *should* draft him. Yes, the Packers offensive line needs some help but a runningback like Lacy can strike some fear into a defense and open up A LOT of the passing game. He will most likely make an average offensive line look better than they are.
Montee Ball
- Ball has experience running in a ZBS offense. Another hard runner that can probably make an instant impact in more than just the run game.
Le'Veon Bell
- Biggest of all 3 backs and certainly doesn't run like he is almost 250 pounds. Bell would be another option for the Packers. He adds a similar element as Ball.

I think Ball and Bell can easily fall to the late 2nd round, maybe even early 3rd. I can never tell anymore with the way some teams draft. Maybe cutting a guy like Starks is a bit too much but for the past two seasons, his injuries have kept him off the field. He doesn't help the team on the sidelines every season.
yooperfan  
#2 Posted : Thursday, February 7, 2013 10:46:17 AM(UTC)

Starks has a significant injury history and can't be counted on. I can see him being released.
Bensons injury can be career ending. I don't see him coming back.
Saine probably gets another shot.

I like Bell but MSU ran him to death so his career might be short, much like John Brockington.
QCHuskerFan  
#3 Posted : Thursday, February 7, 2013 11:08:47 AM(UTC)

Was going to try to get to offense, but am happier that you did. Thank you!

Agree with you about depth chart.

Really agree with Starks. Hasta la vista, baby.

Benson- well it comes down to contract to me. If it costs much to keep him to Training Camp, would cut him. But if he doesn't have a Roster Bonus, might keep him into camp. He would need to be a clear #1 coming out of camp for me to keep though.

Ball- I am not a believer. He has over 600 carries already under his belt in college. In my warped mind, I look at RB's as having a finite # of carries. I would rather have a one year wonder like Lacy than a back that has had a long college career. He has used some of that lifetime allotment of carries up already. There are a number of exceptions to this, like AP. But there is a reason that RB's don't last long in the NFL. Ball is also not much of a threat in the passing game.

Lacey- Low # of carries and much more involved in the passing game at AL. I would be happier with him.

Bell- Again, a high number of carries coming out of college. Much more of a threat in the passing game than Ball.

Philosophically, I would not like to see a RB drafted until our late 3rd Rd pick. Personally, I see too many other bigger needs for the higher picks.
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nerdmann  
#4 Posted : Thursday, February 7, 2013 11:13:40 AM(UTC)

Starks comes back, Saine gets a shot.

I do think they'll pick someone up though.
Yerko  
#5 Posted : Thursday, February 7, 2013 12:57:23 PM(UTC)

Not that mock drafts have any value to them (I read them to see what the "experts" think the teams need), but Kiper has Lacy coming to the Packers at 26. It is totally a reach but I bring this up because of something he says in his description.

Kiper says:
Quote:
Lacy could fill a need, allowing them to do more than simply "show" the run, but to gain some legitimate value out of it.


A lot of people think DuJuan Harris can be the starter. I personally think DuJuan Harris is a runningback that just shows the run. I am with you QCHusker as I don't believe a runningback should be taken in the first, especially with all the other needs (mainly defensive and offensive line) but with a guy like Lacy being available there I'd say BPA comes into play, imo.

I think a lot of the better DT/DE are coming off the board early. In terms of offensive line and this is getting a bit off subject for this thread, I think C and LT are the biggest needs. Like DT/DE's, great LTs will be off the board early and a good C.

I'd probably be the only person okay with the dude in my avatar being selected at 26. However, he can play LT, G, and C in the NFL and to me that is a valuable pick, especially for the Packers offensive line (saves this thought for offensive line talk).
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wpr  
#6 Posted : Thursday, February 7, 2013 2:31:52 PM(UTC)

well there you go, if Kiper says GB will take Lacy 26th it is a lock that they will not take any RB in the 1st round.
adding to your post Yerko, No C in the first round. They will get someone in the 3rd. Not another OT in the first unless they already know that Sherrod will not be back. Also I don't see them being upset with Sitton enough to take someone that high.

I can see them going for DL help in the first but not RB or OL.

BTW, I love the idea of getting Barrett Jones. I would like him better in the 2nd or betters still the 3rd. ;)
blueleopard  
#7 Posted : Thursday, February 7, 2013 11:28:45 PM(UTC)

If Barrett Jones isn't on the board, you go with Lacy easily. And I'm not just saying that because it's Alabama. The kid's a baller.

I wouldn't mind a safety either.
shield4life  
#8 Posted : Friday, February 8, 2013 7:25:23 AM(UTC)

Rather pick a FA on RB and concentrate on improving our lines on both sides of the ball in the draft!
flep  
#9 Posted : Saturday, February 9, 2013 3:57:47 AM(UTC)

Get Reggie Bush from the Dolphins.

Back ups Benson and Harris.

Kuhn when 2 back set up.

Oh and get a line!!!!
nerdmann  
#10 Posted : Saturday, February 9, 2013 8:56:26 AM(UTC)

flep said: Go to Quoted Post
Get Reggie Bush from the Dolphins.

Back ups Benson and Harris.

Kuhn when 2 back set up.

Oh and get a line!!!!


Benson and Kuhn are done.
Wade  
#11 Posted : Saturday, February 9, 2013 9:47:05 AM(UTC)

If the Packers use a first round pick on a RB this year, you better hold onto your computer. Because otherwise the vibration caused by my screaming "YOU STUPID A**HOLE, TED" will cause it to fall off your lap/desk.


If there were a Barry Sanders or a Jim Brown available, maybe. But nothing above a fourth rounder should be spent on a RB, and then only if the player is 3rd round value or better.

If there isn't first round quality OL/DL/LB available when GB on the clock, they should be trading down for an extra pick.

IMO.
nerdmann  
#12 Posted : Saturday, February 9, 2013 9:54:46 AM(UTC)

We've talked about how the NFL is a passing league, and how the pendulum is swing hard in the direction of highlight reels and big scoring plays.

But I don't know. I think the pendulum may be ready to swing back a notch or two. I mean this exaggerated passing phase may be getting played out. Be nice to be ahead of the curve a bit.

Still don't think RB is our biggest need though.
steveishere  
#13 Posted : Sunday, February 10, 2013 5:01:43 AM(UTC)

RB isn't the biggest need but we are weak enough at that position that if a RB is clearly the best player on the board I can see them taking him. Just because you select a player at one position in the 1st round it doesn't mean your other needs are screwed. We didn't pick a CB in the 1st round last year and I think that worked out pretty well. There are plenty of good players besides the first 32 that get picked.
Yerko  
#14 Posted : Monday, February 11, 2013 10:00:56 AM(UTC)

I think this is a very heavy OL/DL draft and there will be quality players sitting in the 2nd, 3rd and 4th rounds for the Packers to take then.

I believe if a runningback of Lacy's caliber is still sitting there at 26, you take him. Now before you go and chop my head off, note that I am not saying that Lacy is the same caliber runningback as THE Adrian Peterson...

Look at what Adrian Peterson does for that offense. If the Packers can have a runningback anywhere close to that, think about the possibilities this draws up for the offense through the air. Lacy will be a very good runningback in the league and could do wonders for this offense.

I am a huge advocate for drafting offensive and defensive lineman. At #26, I think there is bound to be a quality d-lineman available but not an o-lineman. The question becomes is that d-lineman BPA?
JustJeff  
#15 Posted : Monday, February 11, 2013 12:49:29 PM(UTC)

DuJuan Harris – I’m excited about Harris. He was our most productive back. He’s quick… plenty fast… good hands… solid blocker… good vision… very decisive… He’s everything Thompson hoped Brandon Jackson would be when he drafted him. His body of work is a small sample size, but he’s currently the default starter, and isn’t a bad option there.

Brandon Saine – the crazy speed makes him tempting.


Alex Green – speaking of B-Jax, Green must have trained with him in the offseason. Green has limited vision and even less patience. He got more carries than anyone and rewarded us with a team low 3.4 per carry. He seems to still think that he can outrun the defense to the edge. He did outrun some players, our O-linemen. I don’t even know if he understands how cutback lanes form in an outside zone run.

James Starks – When has he played an injury free season? He was hurt his final season in college and hasn’t been healthy a full season with us. He runs far too upright, so even when guys only get a hand on him, he gets spun and turned more than he would if he played with better pad level. I think he will always battle injuries.

Cedric Benson – He had 71 carries for us (a 3.5 per carry average) and might have run three stretch plays. He doesn’t have the speed to threaten the front side on a stretch, so we ran him a steady diet of inside zone plays. When the defense knows you’re going to run between the tackles, they’re going to be waiting for you. He was done before the lisfranc injury. Now he’s well-done.

Ryan Grant – I’m a huge Grant fan. He had the second highest ypc on the team, making the most of limited opportunities. He would be a better option than Benson, but sadly, he’s done too.

John Kuhn – you gotta love the guy… just not $2.5 million worth. We run TEs in the backfield. Kuhn represents replaceable production. He’s a fan favorite, but I can give you 1.75 million reasons to kill the final year of his deal.

Mike Shanahan - whom I don't care for at all - has a knack for finding backs. I'll let you in on his secret… the rollover in his backfield. He brings in about seven new backs a year. A few stick, rarely more than a year, but when you get an extended look at 20 backs in three years, you find a back like Alfred Morris.

Running back value in the draft…
Lacy looks like Ingram lite to me. I wouldn’t spend a first on him.

Giovani Bernard (UNC) would be intriguing if he lasted till our second round pick.

I think the value at RB shows up around the fourth round… where guys like Bell, Stepfan Taylor of Stanford, Mike Gillislee of and Kenjon Barner of Oregon are likely to be in-play.

As for the accompanying O-line discussion, my first round wishlist is primarily on the defensive side of the ball. There’s only one player on the offensive side of the ball with a chance of being there at #26 that I would take. Sorry Barrett Jones fans. Jones is versatile. He could bail you out of a game at tackle, but he’s no more a tackle than TJ Lang. I think Jones is more guard than center. He wouldn’t be an awful pick, but I would be disappointed. I think Jones will be solid player/starter for years. My concern is that he’s an AJ Hawk type, in that he wouldn’t disappoint, but always has you wishing there was more to him. I just don’t see the upside.
QCHuskerFan  
#16 Posted : Monday, February 11, 2013 12:56:06 PM(UTC)

My reasoning for not taking a RB in the first round is you can't afford to miss in the 1st and your pick not to be a long term asset. RB's have a short shelf life. Odds are most will never see the end of their first contract and a 1st rd pick has a big contract.

Most Packer fans believe this season might have ended differently if the Packers had another stud OLineman and DLineman. Well, we did have them on the Salary schedule. Their names were Harrell and Sherrod. They ate over 2M of CAP and didn't play a down. Ted Thompson drafted exactly what we needed. Just not who we needed. Imagine if they had become the players they were picked to be?

The draft is enough of a crap shoot. Let's not waste a high pick on a player that has a short expectancy.

Just my 1.3 cents.
wpr  
#17 Posted : Monday, February 11, 2013 1:04:24 PM(UTC)

QCHuskerFan said: Go to Quoted Post
My reasoning for not taking a RB in the first round is you can't afford to miss in the 1st and your pick not to be a long term asset. RB's have a short shelf life. Odds are most will never see the end of their first contract and a 1st rd pick has a big contract.

Most Packer fans believe this season might have ended differently if the Packers had another stud OLineman and DLineman. Well, we did have them on the Salary schedule. Their names were Harrell and Sherrod. They ate over 2M of CAP and didn't play a down. Ted Thompson drafted exactly what we needed. Just not who we needed. Imagine if they had become the players they were picked to be?

The draft is enough of a crap shoot. Let's not waste a high pick on a player that has a short expectancy.

Just my 1.3 cents.


yep. couple that with this year's draft being a relatively weak one. (according so some "experts".) you want to make the most of the picks.
JustJeff  
#18 Posted : Monday, February 11, 2013 1:21:57 PM(UTC)

QCHuskerFan said: Go to Quoted Post

Most Packer fans believe this season might have ended differently if the Packers had another stud OLineman and DLineman. Well, we did have them on the Salary schedule. Their names were Harrell and Sherrod.

Sherrod was $1.5 million (and thankfully still on the roster), but we settled the books on Harrell in 2011.

Nick Collins was $2.3 million of dead cap in 2012. The other dead money hits were small (Pro-rated modest signing bonuses for guys like Datko, Coleman, Smithson and Guy). They totaled out around $100k
steveishere  
#19 Posted : Monday, February 11, 2013 1:42:10 PM(UTC)

QCHuskerFan said: Go to Quoted Post
My reasoning for not taking a RB in the first round is you can't afford to miss in the 1st and your pick not to be a long term asset. RB's have a short shelf life. Odds are most will never see the end of their first contract and a 1st rd pick has a big contract.

Most Packer fans believe this season might have ended differently if the Packers had another stud OLineman and DLineman. Well, we did have them on the Salary schedule. Their names were Harrell and Sherrod. They ate over 2M of CAP and didn't play a down. Ted Thompson drafted exactly what we needed. Just not who we needed. Imagine if they had become the players they were picked to be?

The draft is enough of a crap shoot. Let's not waste a high pick on a player that has a short expectancy.

Just my 1.3 cents.


The shelf life thing doesn't really mean much to me. It seems that most good RB start declining around 30 which say you draft a guy around 22 or so gives you about 8 years with him which is well beyond the first contract. If they don't see the end of their 1st contract it's usually because they aren't a good player not because they wore out or something. The 1st round contracts aren't really a big deal anymore either since the rookie wage scale.

A similarly skilled lineman or DB will no doubt take priority over a RB but it isn't a waste to take a RB in the 1st round if he's the best guy on the board and can help the team win.
wpr  
#20 Posted : Monday, February 11, 2013 2:15:02 PM(UTC)

JustJeff said: Go to Quoted Post
DuJuan Harris – I’m excited about Harris. He was our most productive back. He’s quick… plenty fast… good hands… solid blocker… good vision… very decisive… He’s everything Thompson hoped Brandon Jackson would be when he drafted him. His body of work is a small sample size, but he’s currently the default starter, and isn’t a bad option there.

Brandon Saine – the crazy speed makes him tempting.


Alex Green – speaking of B-Jax, Green must have trained with him in the offseason. Green has limited vision and even less patience. He got more carries than anyone and rewarded us with a team low 3.4 per carry. He seems to still think that he can outrun the defense to the edge. He did outrun some players, our O-linemen. I don’t even know if he understands how cutback lanes form in an outside zone run.

James Starks – When has he played an injury free season? He was hurt his final season in college and hasn’t been healthy a full season with us. He runs far too upright, so even when guys only get a hand on him, he gets spun and turned more than he would if he played with better pad level. I think he will always battle injuries.

Cedric Benson – He had 71 carries for us (a 3.5 per carry average) and might have run three stretch plays. He doesn’t have the speed to threaten the front side on a stretch, so we ran him a steady diet of inside zone plays. When the defense knows you’re going to run between the tackles, they’re going to be waiting for you. He was done before the lisfranc injury. Now he’s well-done.

Ryan Grant – I’m a huge Grant fan. He had the second highest ypc on the team, making the most of limited opportunities. He would be a better option than Benson, but sadly, he’s done too.

John Kuhn – you gotta love the guy… just not $2.5 million worth. We run TEs in the backfield. Kuhn represents replaceable production. He’s a fan favorite, but I can give you 1.75 million reasons to kill the final year of his deal.

Mike Shanahan - whom I don't care for at all - has a knack for finding backs. I'll let you in on his secret… the rollover in his backfield. He brings in about seven new backs a year. A few stick, rarely more than a year, but when you get an extended look at 20 backs in three years, you find a back like Alfred Morris.

Running back value in the draft…
Lacy looks like Ingram lite to me. I wouldn’t spend a first on him.

Giovani Bernard (UNC) would be intriguing if he lasted till our second round pick.

I think the value at RB shows up around the fourth round… where guys like Bell, Stepfan Taylor of Stanford, Mike Gillislee of and Kenjon Barner of Oregon are likely to be in-play.

As for the accompanying O-line discussion, my first round wishlist is primarily on the defensive side of the ball. There’s only one player on the offensive side of the ball with a chance of being there at #26 that I would take. Sorry Barrett Jones fans. Jones is versatile. He could bail you out of a game at tackle, but he’s no more a tackle than TJ Lang. I think Jones is more guard than center. He wouldn’t be an awful pick, but I would be disappointed. I think Jones will be solid player/starter for years. My concern is that he’s an AJ Hawk type, in that he wouldn’t disappoint, but always has you wishing there was more to him. I just don’t see the upside.


Harris- I am not totally sold on him yet. Too small of a sample size to feel comfortable. He may be all of that and then some but I have not seen enough yet.

Saine- speed is not everything in a running back. It is a lot but not everything. Saine sort of reminds me of a cartoon I saw years ago. The cartoonist had the running back streaking across the page. He was just a blur. His run ended when he ran right into the mid section to the LB who was just standing there with his hands on his hips unaffected by the collision.

Green and Starks should be able to do more than what they have shown so far. maybe this year we will see them bloom. If not relegate them to the bottom of the depth chart to fill in when injuries occur.

Benson, Grant- gone.

KUHHHHHN- makes one more return. He has been a reliable. Does a little of everything including ST. I think he has been more effective as a lead blocker than the TEs.

I do like Jones but only as a C (back up at G) and only in the 2-3 rounds or later.
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