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Offline longtimefan  
#46 Posted : Thursday, September 25, 2008 7:16:10 PM(UTC)

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And yes, I ignored Rodgers' rushing TDs because that has more to do with McCarthy's goal-line strategy than Rodgers' QB performance.


I agree with your post except for this last bit. Rodgers' ability and willingness to run the QB sneak is a significant weapon for our offense. Favre either did not want to run sneaks or McCarthy didn't want to risk getting him injured, and I believe that's part of the reason why the Packer offense was at or near the bottom of the league in short yardage situations last year.

Edit: Ah, I knew this thread was destined for the Brett Favre ghetto.


1st and goal pass for a td or a 1st and goal q/b sneak WTF is the difference damn

Point is the q/b had to make it happen, and it is points HE helped to create
Offline Zero2Cool  
#47 Posted : Thursday, September 25, 2008 7:18:56 PM(UTC)

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If we are talking about a pass for a TD on the 1 vs a QB sneak. I think there's a large difference.

QB's like to have a little room for their targets to roam a bit. With being on the one yard line there's 20 so plus guys running around in a 50 yard by 11 yard space. or 11 by 50.. whatever you get the point.

With a QB sneak its about attitude and will and who wants it more. Will your OL push harder than the DL? Will you (the QB) find the hole and risk your ass and shove yourself in?
Offline WhiskeySam  
#48 Posted : Thursday, September 25, 2008 7:42:56 PM(UTC)

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" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
And yes, I ignored Rodgers' rushing TDs because that has more to do with McCarthy's goal-line strategy than Rodgers' QB performance.


I agree with your post except for this last bit. Rodgers' ability and willingness to run the QB sneak is a significant weapon for our offense. Favre either did not want to run sneaks or McCarthy didn't want to risk getting him injured, and I believe that's part of the reason why the Packer offense was at or near the bottom of the league in short yardage situations last year.

Edit: Ah, I knew this thread was destined for the Brett Favre ghetto.


Yeah, took me a minute to find this again. Anyway, QB sneaks at the goal line says more about the coach's strategy or his lack of confidence in his running backs than a QB's ability. If Rodgers had scrambled for a TD, I'd count those because that speaks to his ability to create plays from nothing. Goal line sneaks says to me either the coach thinks he can surprise the D with a quick push or he has no healthy running backs so he's willing to risk his QB taking a shot.
Offline longtimefan  
#49 Posted : Thursday, September 25, 2008 8:11:10 PM(UTC)

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" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
And yes, I ignored Rodgers' rushing TDs because that has more to do with McCarthy's goal-line strategy than Rodgers' QB performance.


I agree with your post except for this last bit. Rodgers' ability and willingness to run the QB sneak is a significant weapon for our offense. Favre either did not want to run sneaks or McCarthy didn't want to risk getting him injured, and I believe that's part of the reason why the Packer offense was at or near the bottom of the league in short yardage situations last year.

Edit: Ah, I knew this thread was destined for the Brett Favre ghetto.


Yeah, took me a minute to find this again. Anyway, QB sneaks at the goal line says more about the coach's strategy or his lack of confidence in his running backs than a QB's ability. If Rodgers had scrambled for a TD, I'd count those because that speaks to his ability to create plays from nothing. Goal line sneaks says to me either the coach thinks he can surprise the D with a quick push or he has no healthy running backs so he's willing to risk his QB taking a shot.


Okay I see your point now..

but it brings up this point...

Grant or any rb gets a one yard or even a half yard td, can we use same argument and NOT include those in his final numbers?
Offline WhiskeySam  
#50 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2008 1:38:50 AM(UTC)

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" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
And yes, I ignored Rodgers' rushing TDs because that has more to do with McCarthy's goal-line strategy than Rodgers' QB performance.


I agree with your post except for this last bit. Rodgers' ability and willingness to run the QB sneak is a significant weapon for our offense. Favre either did not want to run sneaks or McCarthy didn't want to risk getting him injured, and I believe that's part of the reason why the Packer offense was at or near the bottom of the league in short yardage situations last year.

Edit: Ah, I knew this thread was destined for the Brett Favre ghetto.




Yeah, took me a minute to find this again. Anyway, QB sneaks at the goal line says more about the coach's strategy or his lack of confidence in his running backs than a QB's ability. If Rodgers had scrambled for a TD, I'd count those because that speaks to his ability to create plays from nothing. Goal line sneaks says to me either the coach thinks he can surprise the D with a quick push or he has no healthy running backs so he's willing to risk his QB taking a shot.


Okay I see your point now..

but it brings up this point...

Grant or any rb gets a one yard or even a half yard td, can we use same argument and NOT include those in his final numbers?


Grant's job is to pound the ball and grind out tough yards. That's not Rodgers' job. The fact we're relying on Rodgers at the goal line says we're either trying to take the defense by surprise, or the coach doesn't think Grant or any other running back can get the job done. This is where I like to see a TJ Duckett or Brandon Jacobs style runner just pound it in rather than see our QB sneaking and potentially taking unnecessary hits, but that's just my personal preference.
Offline longtimefan  
#51 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2008 2:23:36 AM(UTC)

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" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
And yes, I ignored Rodgers' rushing TDs because that has more to do with McCarthy's goal-line strategy than Rodgers' QB performance.


I agree with your post except for this last bit. Rodgers' ability and willingness to run the QB sneak is a significant weapon for our offense. Favre either did not want to run sneaks or McCarthy didn't want to risk getting him injured, and I believe that's part of the reason why the Packer offense was at or near the bottom of the league in short yardage situations last year.

Edit: Ah, I knew this thread was destined for the Brett Favre ghetto.




Yeah, took me a minute to find this again. Anyway, QB sneaks at the goal line says more about the coach's strategy or his lack of confidence in his running backs than a QB's ability. If Rodgers had scrambled for a TD, I'd count those because that speaks to his ability to create plays from nothing. Goal line sneaks says to me either the coach thinks he can surprise the D with a quick push or he has no healthy running backs so he's willing to risk his QB taking a shot.


Okay I see your point now..

but it brings up this point...

Grant or any rb gets a one yard or even a half yard td, can we use same argument and NOT include those in his final numbers?


Grant's job is to pound the ball and grind out tough yards. That's not Rodgers' job. The fact we're relying on Rodgers at the goal line says we're either trying to take the defense by surprise, or the coach doesn't think Grant or any other running back can get the job done. This is where I like to see a TJ Duckett or Brandon Jacobs style runner just pound it in rather than see our QB sneaking and potentially taking unnecessary hits, but that's just my personal preference.

Aaron Rodgers has 2 rushing tds in 3 games, maybe that will be part of HIS JOB too?
Offline longtimefan  
#52 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2008 2:26:08 AM(UTC)

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Not trying to be an aho;le..just triyng to understand your points
Offline WhiskeySam  
#53 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2008 1:01:38 PM(UTC)

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Not trying to be an aho;le..just triyng to understand your points


If our goal line offense all season is going to be Rodgers sneaking, we've got big problems in the running game.
Offline Zero2Cool  
#54 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2008 1:06:17 PM(UTC)

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" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
Not trying to be an aho;le..just triyng to understand your points


If our goal line offense all season is going to be Rodgers sneaking, we've got big problems in the running game.


If we are on the goal line, a QB sneak is the best way to score.

You're QB is one - two yards off the line, your RB is five - seven yards deep.

As long as your OL gets a lower pad level than the DL and pushes tough, your QB should easily sneak in there for a TD. Hopefully the QB isn't an idiot and tries to go over the top.

A QB sneak on the goal line is higher probability of scoring than handing off to a RB. The time it takes the RB to get to the line you will have a LB or two maybe a safety as well jumping over the top ready to smack his ass.
Offline zombieslayer  
#55 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2008 1:10:20 PM(UTC)

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" said: Go to Quoted Post

If our goal line offense all season is going to be Rodgers sneaking, we've got big problems in the running game.


That's what I'm thinking.

I also don't like the QB sneak. Aaron Rodgers took a shot in the back on one of his QB sneaks that I don't like to see happen again. Sure, he was unfazed, but still...

RBs are built to withstand pounding, QBs are not. Don't we have a RB that can pound the ball for a hard-earned yard? If not, Ted Thompson better get on the phone and make some calls.
Offline WhiskeySam  
#56 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2008 1:27:35 PM(UTC)

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" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post

If our goal line offense all season is going to be Rodgers sneaking, we've got big problems in the running game.


That's what I'm thinking.

I also don't like the QB sneak. Aaron Rodgers took a shot in the back on one of his QB sneaks that I don't like to see happen again. Sure, he was unfazed, but still...

RBs are built to withstand pounding, QBs are not. Don't we have a RB that can pound the ball for a hard-earned yard? If not, Ted Thompson better get on the phone and make some calls.


Agreed, and it's not only the body type, but QBs don't wear the pads RBs do.
Offline zombieslayer  
#57 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2008 3:30:52 PM(UTC)

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" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post

If our goal line offense all season is going to be Rodgers sneaking, we've got big problems in the running game.


That's what I'm thinking.

I also don't like the QB sneak. Aaron Rodgers took a shot in the back on one of his QB sneaks that I don't like to see happen again. Sure, he was unfazed, but still...

RBs are built to withstand pounding, QBs are not. Don't we have a RB that can pound the ball for a hard-earned yard? If not, Ted Thompson better get on the phone and make some calls.


Agreed, and it's not only the body type, but QBs don't wear the pads RBs do.


Didn't think of that.
Good call.
Offline Greg C.  
#58 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2008 6:59:20 PM(UTC)

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Gaining one yard is not something to be taken for granted, as the Packers proved over the past couple years, when Favre ran a total of one QB sneak and the team's short-yardage stats were abysmal. Many games are decided by a team's inability to gain one yard.

When you need a yard, you get that yard any way you can. QB's are in more danger while passing the ball than they are on QB sneaks anyway. Plus, even the threat of a QB sneak is bound to open up running lanes, as it forces the defense to cover another option.

I think that most QB's and their O-linemen love the QB sneak. It's quick, simple, and effective, and it gives the QB a chance to be a tough guy. Toward the end, Favre was being treated too much like a fragile piece of china.
Offline Zero2Cool  
#59 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2008 7:20:09 PM(UTC)

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WTF you pricks!

I added some insightful comment\s and you just ignore them to argue???

I hate you all and now I'm going to ban myself!!!


--- for those who took this seriously, i was kidding ---
Offline WhiskeySam  
#60 Posted : Friday, September 26, 2008 9:32:24 PM(UTC)

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" said: Go to Quoted Post
WTF you pricks!

I added some insightful comment\s and you just ignore them to argue???

I hate you all and now I'm going to ban myself!!!


--- for those who took this seriously, i was kidding ---


LOL sorry, I'm posting from airports while I travel today and missed your post. I agree with you to an extent, but if you have a bulldozer like Earl Campbell or Larry Csonka, you give them the ball every single time.
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