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Offline Wade  
#46 Posted : Friday, July 26, 2013 6:02:03 PM(UTC)
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I dunno. If I were another of AR's "friends" right now, I'd be quietly re-assessing the quality of his friendship with me.

Ok, I get it. He feels betrayed. He's been lied to by a friend. Maybe their friendship has died. Maybe Braun is just another athlete scumbag.

But, as he said, everyone makes mistakes. And, sure as God made the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, Rodgers is not the first person who has been lied to by one of his friends. I've made a helluva lot bigger mistakes, mistakes that I might lie about to my friends, too, depending on the pressures on me.

And I'd sure as hell might lie about them to any "friend" I thought might abandon me if "the truth came out". Because if he's going to abandon me for a lie in protection of my livelihood, I'm pretty sure he's going to abandon me when he finds out about *my* real skeletons.

And as far as what the media might do or the public might think if Rodgers hadn't broadcast his sense of betrayal, well, I'm sorry. If it is/was a true friendship, it should matter more than what either of those *theys" might think. It should matter more than whether they might make an issue out of it.

If a bunch of sharks or vultures are circling around your badly bleeding friend, is it okay for you to add another wound so you can escape their feeding frenzy?

IMO, friends don't judge their friends in the court of public opinion. They just don't. They judge them in private. Preferably, they stand by their friends in public. But if they feel sufficiently offended or betrayed or hurt that they cannot do that, then they should remain silent. Let the rest of the world, those who aren't his friends and never have been do that. If you can't publicly defend the person, at least let him defend himself without adding to his wounds.

Sure it's hard. That's why real friendship is so dear. Not because it is easy and fun and a bunch of shared interests. Because to maintain it means doing hard stuff along the way.

It's easy to defend a friend before the evidence is all out. You're going to take your friend's side. The test of the friendship is what you do when the evidence is out and it falls against your friend.

There's a lot more people behind bars today whose "friends" have abandoned them than there are friends who will go to visit them in jail/prison. There are a lot more people who have been wrung out by public opinion for their moral shortcomings whose "friends" have taken the easy route by sharing public opinion than there are friends who continue to associate with them.

It's easy to be the kind of "friend" who, when the going gets tough, get going.

I understand feeling betrayed. And I understand if, feeling I have betrayed you, you abandon me.

But that doesn't mean I won't feel abandoned.

And when I see you abandon someone else you called friend? Well, I might still hang out with you, but you're not going to be a friend I'm going to trust with the deepest parts of me, good or bad.

Sorry.





None of the above. It wouldn't have been a wasted vote. Obama and Romney -- Those were the wasted votes.
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DakotaT on 7/26/2013(UTC)
Offline DoddPower  
#47 Posted : Saturday, July 27, 2013 2:11:11 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Wade Go to Quoted Post
I dunno. If I were another of AR's "friends" right now, I'd be quietly re-assessing the quality of his friendship with me.

Ok, I get it. He feels betrayed. He's been lied to by a friend. Maybe their friendship has died. Maybe Braun is just another athlete scumbag.

But, as he said, everyone makes mistakes. And, sure as God made the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, Rodgers is not the first person who has been lied to by one of his friends. I've made a helluva lot bigger mistakes, mistakes that I might lie about to my friends, too, depending on the pressures on me.

And I'd sure as hell might lie about them to any "friend" I thought might abandon me if "the truth came out". Because if he's going to abandon me for a lie in protection of my livelihood, I'm pretty sure he's going to abandon me when he finds out about *my* real skeletons.

And as far as what the media might do or the public might think if Rodgers hadn't broadcast his sense of betrayal, well, I'm sorry. If it is/was a true friendship, it should matter more than what either of those *theys" might think. It should matter more than whether they might make an issue out of it.

If a bunch of sharks or vultures are circling around your badly bleeding friend, is it okay for you to add another wound so you can escape their feeding frenzy?

IMO, friends don't judge their friends in the court of public opinion. They just don't. They judge them in private. Preferably, they stand by their friends in public. But if they feel sufficiently offended or betrayed or hurt that they cannot do that, then they should remain silent. Let the rest of the world, those who aren't his friends and never have been do that. If you can't publicly defend the person, at least let him defend himself without adding to his wounds.

Sure it's hard. That's why real friendship is so dear. Not because it is easy and fun and a bunch of shared interests. Because to maintain it means doing hard stuff along the way.

It's easy to defend a friend before the evidence is all out. You're going to take your friend's side. The test of the friendship is what you do when the evidence is out and it falls against your friend.

There's a lot more people behind bars today whose "friends" have abandoned them than there are friends who will go to visit them in jail/prison. There are a lot more people who have been wrung out by public opinion for their moral shortcomings whose "friends" have taken the easy route by sharing public opinion than there are friends who continue to associate with them.

It's easy to be the kind of "friend" who, when the going gets tough, get going.

I understand feeling betrayed. And I understand if, feeling I have betrayed you, you abandon me.

But that doesn't mean I won't feel abandoned.

And when I see you abandon someone else you called friend? Well, I might still hang out with you, but you're not going to be a friend I'm going to trust with the deepest parts of me, good or bad.

Sorry.







I don't quite view it as that extreme. If I deeply lie to a friend, and they defend my lie and it ends up biting them in the ass, I would pretty much expect them to be pissed off at me, and possibly end the friendship. At least for awhile. Sometimes things happen that can heal over time. But still, just because someone spoke out against another who might have seriously lied to them repeatedly, that's not going to make me question their friendship with others. Relationships are built on trust, and if that trust is completely broken down and destroyed, then the relationship may very well be over. At that point, a person is longer speaking about a "friend," but is just speaking about someone that lied to them, etc.

I don't expect people to stand by their friends even if the friend shits all over them. That generally just leads to getting shit on more. I've been there and done that myself. Some "friends" just continually take advantage of others. Some people continue to accept the lies and stay friends with them, and good for them, I guess. But it's not a standard I would hold anyone to. Some people have less tolerance than others. If you don't want to test those waters, don't repeatedly lie to said friend and break whatever trust may be established. It's not that hard. I have certainly put up with many lies from "friends" in the past, and not surprisingly, the lies continued and snow-balled. When I see a similar pattern developing now, I'm much less tolerant. I don't hang out with anyone to be lied to and pulled around. If they're going to do that, I'd rather just let them go about their way and play with my dog. I don't have time for that type of drama.
Offline Zero2Cool  
#48 Posted : Saturday, July 27, 2013 3:50:07 PM(UTC)
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Zack Greinke wrote:
The main thing is, yeah, he lied to us. He forced us to lie for him, threw people under the bus in order to help himself out and didn’t care, blamed others for his mistakes and it’s just a lot of things you don’t expect from people.

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dhpackr on 8/7/2013(UTC)
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#49 Posted : Sunday, July 28, 2013 2:08:33 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Pack93z Go to Quoted Post
Here is my question for those that say he should not have said Braun lied..

What direction do you suppose the media types are going to run with that? ... At least a few will start to ask the questions of "Was Rodgers involved in it?"

There is no way with the amount of tree climbing on thin vines of speculation that the media types are doing in this case.. that someone wouldn't or still may not take that angle.

By making this strong statement.. it is Rodgers word that he is among the rest of the world which wanted to believe Braun but was left disappointed that his words now appear ever so hollow.

I think one has to at the very least create a level of distance from Braun publicly.. stating the truth (if that is the case) is probably the best policy at the moment. IMO.


Aside from the fact that Rodgers (and more so Greinke) could have and probably should have just shut up or if asked, said "no comment", Rodgers should have said "If " he lied ......., as absolute proof still has not been provided, and by the terms of the plea deal, probably won't be provided that Braun lied - unless Braun was stupid enough to actually TELL Rodgers and/or Greinke that he lied to them. If THAT happened, it would have been idiotic for Braun, and Rodgers and/or Greinke would risk being called to testify in any investigation.

The whole thing is overblown. What's done is done. Let OUR superstar serve his time and get back to helping the team win in 2014. THAT is what is important - What was it that Ol' Vince used to say .......?

Here as in SO SO many things, sports and otherwise, I blame the God damned news media for stirring up trouble.

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Offline Pack93z  
#50 Posted : Monday, July 29, 2013 8:51:22 AM(UTC)
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Mark Attanasio is a smart business man... very smart; but that doesn't change the fact that it is a classy classy move by the Brewers.

Bravo.


Quote:

Brewers announce 'Fans First' promotion amid dismal season, Braun scandal

Brewers principal owner Mark Attanasio promised last week that the team would find ways to "give back" to fans in light of the team's dismal season and the Ryan Braun suspension, and the first initiative was announced Monday.

Attanasio announced that all fans attending any of the 12 Brewers home games in August will receive a $10 voucher for free concessions, merchandise and game tickets at Miller Park.

“This has been a challenging season for all of us, but the one thing that has never wavered has been the tremendous support we have received from fans who love the Brewers,” Attanasio said. “We wanted to do something meaningful to show our appreciation, and we will strive to provide the best fan experience possible.”

Every ticketed fan coming through the turnstiles in August will receive a voucher good for $10 that can be used for food, beverage, merchandise and tickets sold at nearly every outlet (excluding Friday’s Front Row, portable merchandise stands, Miller Park Suites, the Johnson Controls Stadium Club and All-Inclusive entertaining areas).

Vouchers may be combined (meaning that fans attending with friends and family members, or those attending multiple games, can combine the vouchers for larger purchases) and used at any remaining 2013 home game. The vouchers can also be used toward the purchase of game tickets this season.

With attendance expected to average over 30,000 per game in August, the Brewers expect to distribute more than $3.6 million worth of vouchers. Coincidentally, Braun is forfeiting about $3.1 million in pay while suspended. So, the Brewers are giving that savings back to their fans, it would appear.
I think when there's enough will and aggression, there's no shortage of talent either.

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Offline wpr  
#51 Posted : Monday, July 29, 2013 8:53:56 AM(UTC)
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awesome. That is a fantastic move on the part of the Brewers. Not too many teams would do that.


Out of curiosity I checked on the Tuesday nite Cardinals game on Aug 20th. I won't be able to make it because I have too many other things going on in August where I will miss work or leave early.

I checked "Best Available" tickets. They have at least 2 seats right behind home plate in row 4. I have sat in that section when I was given company seats about 7-8 years ago. I am stunned that the Brewers didn't have all of those seats sold to corporate sponsors. There are enough businesses in south east WI that it should not be a problem to get prime seats like this sold.

Edited by user Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:28:42 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

"You don't hurt 'em if you don't hit 'em." Chesty Puller



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Offline Pack93z  
#52 Posted : Thursday, August 1, 2013 11:58:51 AM(UTC)
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An article from 2009... Ryan Braun on A-Rod (the other A-Rod).

Fast forward to today.. I wonder if anyone will step into the same realm on behalf of Braun?


MLB wrote:
While expressing regret for what he called Rodriguez's "mistakes," Braun refused to denounce the fallen Yankees star.

"Everybody makes mistakes, and I'm not the type of person that's going to change my opinion about who he is just because he made a mistake," Braun said. "I wouldn't just disassociate myself with somebody just because he made a mistake. I don't think anybody is perfect, and I don't think he's ever pretended to be perfect."

Braun first met Rodriguez on a recruiting trip to the University of Miami in 2001, the same year that Rodriguez, according to his first interview on the subject, began taking banned substances. The story that Rodriguez allegedly tested positive for steroids broke via SI.com on Feb. 7, but New York reporters did not get their first opportunity to grill Rodriguez on the subject until Tuesday.

Because Brewers hitters took the field at 11:30 a.m. MT for batting and fielding work, just as Rodriguez stepped behind the microphone, Braun would have to wait to see the exchange in replay.

"It doesn't do me much good to say anything bad about anybody," Braun said earlier in the morning. "It will be interesting to see what he has to say. I will say that I think he's done everything that he should have done [since the story broke] and the best thing he can do is come out, admit to everything and be completely honest. The situation will die a lot faster if he tells the whole truth."

Was he surprised by events of the past two weeks?

"I don't know if I would say I was surprised," Braun said. "I feel like it was so rampant, so prevalent in baseball during that time period that not much surprises me anymore. If anything, I was surprised he got caught, that it came out this long after he supposedly did it."

I think when there's enough will and aggression, there's no shortage of talent either.

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