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Mucky Tundra  
#1 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 9:00:33 AM(UTC)
Mike Florio said:
So how did the Browns end up signing a guy with a torn ACL from the Packers' practice squad? The guy in question, receiver Charles Johnson, had a torn ACL that no one knew about. When a player is signed from another team's practice squad, a physical isn't given before the player joins the team. ...


Well, that might explain why he never really got going. Another feather in the cap for the Green Bay Packers medical team.
wpr  
#2 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 9:03:47 AM(UTC)
ouch. That is rather shocking.
Dulak  
#3 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 9:07:57 AM(UTC)
wpr said: Go to Quoted Post
ouch. That is rather shocking.


damn ya - so he is signed byt he browns and has a partially torn acl - and this is the same thing bulaga had and he decided to get surgery huh ...

funny enough - our Oline isnt as bad off as we thought this year ...

Zero2Cool  
#4 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 9:17:58 AM(UTC)
Dulak said: Go to Quoted Post
damn ya - so he is signed byt he browns and has a partially torn acl - and this is the same thing bulaga had and he decided to get surgery huh ...

funny enough - our Oline isnt as bad off as we thought this year ...



He's been sacked 14 times in five games. That's on pace for 44 sacks for the season.

Although, the run blocking I think has done a good job. Pass blocking, not so much.
Pack93z  
#5 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 9:18:18 AM(UTC)
Well... as bad as the miss looks for us... for the team as a whole it probably assists us.

Johnson should be returned to us.. while we pick up the surgery costs and place him on IR.. we also would retain his rights moving forward. Gives us a second look at him if we want next season.
beast  
#6 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 10:06:10 AM(UTC)
Pack93z said: Go to Quoted Post
Well... as bad as the miss looks for us... for the team as a whole it probably assists us.

Johnson should be returned to us.. while we pick up the surgery costs and place him on IR.. we also would retain his rights moving forward. Gives us a second look at him if we want next season.


I know you said "should be", but I'm checking about what is going to happen...

Are the Packers going to get his rights back? Or the Browns going to keep his rights?

I thought the Browns got to keep his rights, since they signed him.
nerdmann  
#7 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 11:47:02 AM(UTC)
beast said: Go to Quoted Post
I know you said "should be", but I'm checking about what is going to happen...

Are the Packers going to get his rights back? Or the Browns going to keep his rights?

I thought the Browns got to keep his rights, since they signed him.


If he failed his physical, he should revert back.

But I agree, you gotta wonder, wtf. smh

This is the same group that forced Nick Collins to retire after a completely unnecessary surgery.
steveishere  
#8 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 11:55:12 AM(UTC)
nerdmann said: Go to Quoted Post
If he failed his physical, he should revert back.

But I agree, you gotta wonder, wtf. smh

This is the same group that forced Nick Collins to retire after a completely unnecessary surgery.


The Browns already signed him to a contract so they will probably IR him. He's theirs.

Nick Collins hasn't been forced to retire he's free to play for any team in the league.
nerdmann  
#9 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 12:17:08 PM(UTC)
steveishere said: Go to Quoted Post
The Browns already signed him to a contract so they will probably IR him. He's theirs.

Nick Collins hasn't been forced to retire he's free to play for any team in the league.


The contract should be contingent upon passing the physical. That's what's happened in the past when there've been trades and whatnot, iirc.

Then again the Packers might not even want him.
steveishere  
#10 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 12:52:24 PM(UTC)
nerdmann said: Go to Quoted Post
The contract should be contingent upon passing the physical. That's what's happened in the past when there've been trades and whatnot, iirc.

Then again the Packers might not even want him.


I don't think it is, the contract is contingent on him signing his name to it. Trades are contingent on a player passing a physical but when you sign a player off somebody's practice squad you have to sign them to your team for at least 2 weeks so they already gave him a contract. This wasn't a trade or anything where another team is getting compensation it's not really any different from signing any FA.
Pack93z  
#11 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 1:08:57 PM(UTC)
steveishere said: Go to Quoted Post
I don't think it is, the contract is contingent on him signing his name to it. Trades are contingent on a player passing a physical but when you sign a player off somebody's practice squad you have to sign them to your team for at least 2 weeks so they already gave him a contract. This wasn't a trade or anything where another team is getting compensation it's not really any different from signing any FA.


But it is more like a waiver wire pick up but with the minimum roster requirement.. they caught this on the introductory physical to join practices. If you waive a player injured, the player is protected as they have to be put on the IR and waived injured with financial compensation. It also protects the next team in signing damaged goods.

I fail to see how the contract would not be voided.. unless it is a loophole in the rules.. otherwise why not expose more injured players to the practice squad to circumvent the IR rules.. they can be called up at any time. Once teams start stashing injured players on the PS, it will really make an opposing team pluck someone off your PS.

And once the player is healthy.. they can be called up at a moments notice.
yooperfan  
#12 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 1:23:31 PM(UTC)
nerdmann said: Go to Quoted Post
The contract should be contingent upon passing the physical. That's what's happened in the past when there've been trades and whatnot, iirc.

Then again the Packers might not even want him.


This wasn't a trade.
Too bad for Cleveland.
My question is: why did the Packers medical crew not know this and allow him to practice with the taxi squad, or did they?

steveishere  
#13 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 1:31:23 PM(UTC)
yooperfan said: Go to Quoted Post
This wasn't a trade.
Too bad for Cleveland.
My question is: why did the Packers medical crew not know this and allow him to practice with the taxi squad, or did they?



He probably didn't say anything about it and they didn't know.
yooperfan  
#14 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 1:53:38 PM(UTC)
steveishere said: Go to Quoted Post
He probably didn't say anything about it and they didn't know.


I have to think that in the NFL today, that any teams medical crew would be more on top of things than just taking a players word.
Perhaps that's why the Packers are so beset with serious injuries.

wpr  
#15 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 1:57:39 PM(UTC)
Pack93z said: Go to Quoted Post
But it is more like a waiver wire pick up but with the minimum roster requirement.. they caught this on the introductory physical to join practices. If you waive a player injured, the player is protected as they have to be put on the IR and waived injured with financial compensation. It also protects the next team in signing damaged goods.

I fail to see how the contract would not be voided.. unless it is a loophole in the rules.. otherwise why not expose more injured players to the practice squad to circumvent the IR rules.. they can be called up at any time. Once teams start stashing injured players on the PS, it will really make an opposing team pluck someone off your PS.

And once the player is healthy.. they can be called up at a moments notice.


I can't imagine the loophole being in the players favor even with union negotiators.
steveishere  
#16 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 2:02:54 PM(UTC)
yooperfan said: Go to Quoted Post
I have to think that in the NFL today, that any teams medical crew would be more on top of things than just taking a players word.
Perhaps that's why the Packers are so beset with serious injuries.



What like make them take a lie detector before practice and ask if they are injured?
sschind  
#17 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 4:54:38 PM(UTC)
From what i understand they signed him so he is theirs. He has to stay on the 53 man roster for 2 more weeks (its 3 weeks but he signed before their last game so that counts as 1) then they can put him on IR and replace him.

Whether the contact should be voided or should be contingent upon passing a physical (it isn't) is open for debate but mostly it sounds like Packers fans arguing for it because they want him back to stash him on their own IR.
beast  
#18 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 7:23:27 PM(UTC)
sschind said: Go to Quoted Post
From what i understand they signed him so he is theirs. He has to stay on the 53 man roster for 2 more weeks (its 3 weeks but he signed before their last game so that counts as 1) then they can put him on IR and replace him.
Whether the contact should be voided or should be contingent upon passing a physical (it isn't) is open for debate but mostly it sounds like Packers fans arguing for it because they want him back to stash him on their own IR.


I agree with this. I don't think the NFL will do anything, and therefor the Browns will be able to keep him. (not saying it's right nor proper according to the rules, but I think NFL will turn a blind eye to this)
Pack93z said: Go to Quoted Post
But it is more like a waiver wire pick up but with the minimum roster requirement.. they caught this on the introductory physical to join practices. If you waive a player injured, the player is protected as they have to be put on the IR and waived injured with financial compensation. It also protects the next team in signing damaged goods.


Yes... and no. When it's known the player is injured, you're totally right. But this is more like when it's unknown.

I agree with your augrement. But I'm also thinking the NFL is going to avoid this one and nothing is going to happen (unless someone is able to complain enough, but since he's now on the 53 man roster IR, I don't sure why the player, agent, NFLPA would complain. I don't think the Browns are going to complain, and the Packers are the ones that screwed up, so they might not complain either.)

Pack93z said: Go to Quoted Post
I fail to see how the contract would not be voided..


Simple, NFL wants to avoid admitting one of their teams made a mistake and if the Browns, Packers, player, agent and NFLPA don't complain then the issue is going away as fast as it popped up.

If forced to come up with an arguement for doing nothing, I think the NFL would just say, as a practice squad players, he was a FA (yes avoiding that he might of been hurt before being released by the Packers) and point out that being put on the 53 man roster gets him more money than he would of on the practice squad. But NFL normally avoids the direct issue when explaining things and put to the parts that agree with them.


nerdmann  
#19 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 8:02:51 PM(UTC)
Ted will hash it out with their GM.
sschind  
#20 Posted : Thursday, October 17, 2013 8:15:21 PM(UTC)
beast said: Go to Quoted Post
I agree with this. I don't think the NFL will do anything, and therefor the Browns will be able to keep him. (not saying it's right nor proper according to the rules, but I think NFL will turn a blind eye to this)




Its not that they won't do anything, they can't do anything because there is nothing to do. I don't know what you mean about it being right and proper because it is right and proper. The Browns signed a guy off the practice squad and put him on their 53 man roster. That is all they had to do according to the rules. People are trying to read way more into this than there is. Packers fans seem to want to think that the Browns did something wrong, or are doing something wrong. They did not and they are not.

If the Browns wanted to void the contract they might be able to claim that someone was hiding something but since the Packers did not benefit anything from it they (the Browns) would be hard pressed to prove any deception on the part of the Packers. They may be able to claim Johnson knew and hid it but again, how can they prove it. Unless there is a doctor visit somewhere on record that says he had the injury before the signing there is really nothing they can prove. Besides, it doesn't sound like they want to contest it (if that is what you want to call it) anyway.

Face it Packers fans, Johnson got away and there is nothing anyone can do about it.

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