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Offline nerdmann  
#1 Posted : Wednesday, February 5, 2014 2:52:46 PM(UTC)
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Darin Gantt wrote:
Packers safety Nick Collins had more than 140 characters worth of information on his possible comeback Wednesday, and how it could impact others in the same position. He followed up on a series of tweets by telling Jason Wilde of ESPNWisconsin.com that he was ready and willing to risk it to play again, after being...
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline Zero2Cool  
#2 Posted : Wednesday, February 5, 2014 6:15:45 PM(UTC)
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With what's being reported about Finley loving the idea of playing for Seahawks or Giants... I doubt he's back. He's thinking grass is greener already.
"I do not think there is any thrill that can go through the human heart like that felt by the inventor as he sees some creation of the brain unfolding to success... such emotions make a man forget food, sleep, friends, love, everything." - Nikola Tesla

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musccy on 2/5/2014(UTC)
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#3 Posted : Wednesday, February 5, 2014 6:27:32 PM(UTC)
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I really don't give a damn if Finley is back, especially for the money he is apparently expecting. Collins, however, assuming he could still be anything like he was before, would really be a welcome addition.

That brings us to the question: Is Nick Collins a blatant liar - saying that a lot of other teams' doctors cleared him, and the Packers doctor was basically the only one to reject him? OR Is the Packers doctor - and by proxy his bosses - Thompson and Murphy acting just plain stubbornly irrational? There really wouldn't seem to be any other possibilities, considering the certainty in Collins words.
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Offline nerdmann  
#4 Posted : Wednesday, February 5, 2014 6:53:17 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post
I really don't give a damn if Finley is back, especially for the money he is apparently expecting. Collins, however, assuming he could still be anything like he was before, would really be a welcome addition.

That brings us to the question: Is Nick Collins a blatant liar - saying that a lot of other teams' doctors cleared him, and the Packers doctor was basically the only one to reject him? OR Is the Packers doctor - and by proxy his bosses - Thompson and Murphy acting just plain stubbornly irrational? There really wouldn't seem to be any other possibilities, considering the certainty in Collins words.


McKenzie has always been uber-conservative like that.

He doesn't ever want to be the guy who let a player go back out on the field, who subsequently got paralyzed. Most other doctors probably don't want that happen to them, after a player has already been rejected by some other team's doctor.

What happened to Collins was a complete waste. imo.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline musccy  
#5 Posted : Wednesday, February 5, 2014 7:11:38 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool Go to Quoted Post
With what's being reported about Finley loving the idea of playing for Seahawks or Giants... I doubt he's back. He's thinking grass is greener already.



This was one of the comments from an NYG fan on profootballtalk today.


Quote:
nygf says:
Feb 4, 2014 8:46 PM
Great start. Once Jermichael is signed, all we gotta do is figure out who’s going to play TE for the other 8-9 games.


He's been the tease of all teases ever since the end of the '09 season.
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#6 Posted : Wednesday, February 5, 2014 7:56:42 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
McKenzie has always been uber-conservative like that.

He doesn't ever want to be the guy who let a player go back out on the field, who subsequently got paralyzed. Most other doctors probably don't want that happen to them, after a player has already been rejected by some other team's doctor.

What happened to Collins was a complete waste. imo.


So you believe Collins told the truth, and the good doctor is a stubborn ass?

Not to get political, but I really hate when the word "conservative" is used to mean ........ stupid.

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Offline DakotaT  
#7 Posted : Wednesday, February 5, 2014 8:12:27 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post


Not to get political, but I really hate when the word "conservative" is used to mean ........ stupid.



Ironic, how the new word for stupid is conservative - with a picture of the Mount Rushmore of stupidity for illustration: Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, Eric Cantor, and Paul Ryan.
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Offline play2win  
#8 Posted : Thursday, February 6, 2014 8:31:54 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: musccy Go to Quoted Post
This was one of the comments from an NYG fan on profootballtalk today.




He's been the tease of all teases ever since the end of the '09 season.


Quote:
nygf says:
Feb 4, 2014 8:46 PM
Great start. Once Jermichael is signed, all we gotta do is figure out who’s going to play TE for the other 8-9 games.


What a great, great find musccy!!!!! Holy crap! Those are my feelings on the subject of Finley to a T.
Offline PackFanWithTwins  
#9 Posted : Thursday, February 6, 2014 8:41:18 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post
That brings us to the question: Is Nick Collins a blatant liar - saying that a lot of other teams' doctors cleared him, and the Packers doctor was basically the only one to reject him? OR Is the Packers doctor - and by proxy his bosses - Thompson and Murphy acting just plain stubbornly irrational? There really wouldn't seem to be any other possibilities, considering the certainty in Collins words.


I would have to say, Collins is misremembering. If his claim that the Packers doctor was the only one that wouldn't clear him, than why was is he not playing anywhere else? The Packers released him, which means he was free to go to any of those other teams and let those doctors clear him to play.

While I am not a doctor nor did I sleep at a Holiday Inn Express, I would apprehensive to bring a player back with a neck injury like that, especially at a position where hitting is so much a part of the job.
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Offline nerdmann  
#10 Posted : Thursday, February 6, 2014 8:54:56 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post
So you believe Collins told the truth, and the good doctor is a stubborn ass?

Not to get political, but I really hate when the word "conservative" is used to mean ........ stupid.



No, I believe the surgery was unnecessary.

It also seemed to me at the time that the doctor was less than forthright about the surgery.

Although I also recall hearing that the surgeon who actually operated, cleared him.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
Offline pokethebear  
#11 Posted : Thursday, February 6, 2014 9:02:57 AM(UTC)
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PFWT, that is exactly how I feel about Collins. If there were any way at all for him to continue playing the Packers would never have let him walk. It was a damned shame, but it just wasn't to be.

As far as Finley is concerned, I feel that he never lived up to all the hype. For every big play he made he had just as many drops. And that was when he could get on the field. The potential is still there, but the cost will prove to be to great to bear.

I say use the money to resign Jones and keep our WR corp intact. This will be beneficial to any TE whether it is Quarless, Bostic or someone that is drafted this year. Imagine if we have a rash of injuries to the receivers again next year.

Go Packers!
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#12 Posted : Thursday, February 6, 2014 1:10:32 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: PackFanWithTwins Go to Quoted Post
I would have to say, Collins is misremembering. If his claim that the Packers doctor was the only one that wouldn't clear him, than why was is he not playing anywhere else? The Packers released him, which means he was free to go to any of those other teams and let those doctors clear him to play.

While I am not a doctor nor did I sleep at a Holiday Inn Express, I would apprehensive to bring a player back with a neck injury like that, especially at a position where hitting is so much a part of the job.


I'm pretty sure he is not talking about several years ago, but clearing or rejecting in the present, so I doubt he is misremembering.

Why would you be apprehensive - from the TEAM point of view - if the LAWYERS (f--- the doctors) say the team is protected?

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Offline Dulak  
#13 Posted : Sunday, February 9, 2014 7:49:01 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: pokethebear Go to Quoted Post
PFWT, that is exactly how I feel about Collins. If there were any way at all for him to continue playing the Packers would never have let him walk. It was a damned shame, but it just wasn't to be.

As far as Finley is concerned, I feel that he never lived up to all the hype. For every big play he made he had just as many drops. And that was when he could get on the field. The potential is still there, but the cost will prove to be to great to bear.

I say use the money to resign Jones and keep our WR corp intact. This will be beneficial to any TE whether it is Quarless, Bostic or someone that is drafted this year. Imagine if we have a rash of injuries to the receivers again next year.

Go Packers!


Whats sad is - I saw a big change in finley this year - he bulked up; and looked much better on the field. I started to think he might turn out to be a vernon davis type ...
and then the injury.

I dont know if the packers should try to keep him or not. Its one thing having a neck injury and another neck surgery ... btw how is the surgery supposed to help the injury? - did it help to correct the problem? did it help with the underlying cause? ... same with collins.

GL to finley - if he 'clears' our 'doctor' I hope he is on our team (at the right price).

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pokethebear on 2/9/2014(UTC)
Offline play2win  
#14 Posted : Sunday, February 9, 2014 9:24:39 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Dulak Go to Quoted Post
Whats sad is - I saw a big change in finley this year - he bulked up; and looked much better on the field. I started to think he might turn out to be a vernon davis type ...
and then the injury.

I dont know if the packers should try to keep him or not. Its one thing having a neck injury and another neck surgery ... btw how is the surgery supposed to help the injury? - did it help to correct the problem? did it help with the underlying cause? ... same with collins.

GL to finley - if he 'clears' our 'doctor' I hope he is on our team (at the right price).



I saw the change for the positive last season with Finley too, but I can't help but think "too little, too late." He will be wanting the moon in terms of salary, and even bargained down, I think giving him a contract is too great a risk. I'd rather give the cash to a guy like Jones as was mentioned earlier by pokethebear.
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pokethebear on 2/11/2014(UTC)
Offline nerdmann  
#15 Posted : Sunday, February 9, 2014 9:38:26 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: play2win Go to Quoted Post
I saw the change for the positive last season with Finley too, but I can't help but think "too little, too late." He will be wanting the moon in terms of salary, and even bargained down, I think giving him a contract is too great a risk. I'd rather give the cash to a guy like Jones as was mentioned earlier by pokethebear.


Ever since Aaron started meeting with him the night before games to go over the game plan with him, he's gotten more with the program. He's shut his pie hole too.

But he still thinks he's better than he is and will still demand more money than he's worth.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
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pokethebear on 2/11/2014(UTC)
Offline DakotaT  
#16 Posted : Sunday, February 9, 2014 11:34:08 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
Ever since Aaron started meeting with him the night before games to go over the game plan with him, he's gotten more with the program. He's shut his pie hole too.

But he still thinks he's better than he is and will still demand more money than he's worth.


Which is why I don't think he's in a Packers uniform next season. I'd rather draft a big wide receiver, resign Jones, and go with Quarless and Bostic at TE. The first responsibility of a tight end is blocking, and with our improved running game, Finley is just not a good fit. Quarless on the other hand is.
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pokethebear on 2/11/2014(UTC)
Offline play2win  
#17 Posted : Sunday, February 9, 2014 11:42:45 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: DakotaT Go to Quoted Post
Which is why I don't think he's in a Packers uniform next season. I'd rather draft a big wide receiver, resign Jones, and go with Quarless and Bostic at TE. The first responsibility of a tight end is blocking, and with our improved running game, Finley is just not a good fit. Quarless on the other hand is.


I couldn't agree more with this. Yeah, Finley always thought he was better than he actually played. Sure, he is a matchup problem for other defenses, but he wasn't what you would consider to be a sure, reliable receiving TE like some of the others around the league. And, wish suspect blocking, he doesn't seem worth half of his last contract… now, add the neck injury. Forget it. He ought to be done in GB.
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pokethebear on 2/11/2014(UTC)
Offline play2win  
#18 Posted : Sunday, February 9, 2014 11:43:53 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
Ever since Aaron started meeting with him the night before games to go over the game plan with him, he's gotten more with the program. He's shut his pie hole too.

But he still thinks he's better than he is and will still demand more money than he's worth.


That blew my mind that the guy needed all of this special attention and counsel the night before games. Wow. Get with the program already...
Offline Mucky Tundra  
#19 Posted : Sunday, February 9, 2014 11:45:12 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
Ever since Aaron started meeting with him the night before games to go over the game plan with him, he's gotten more with the program. He's shut his pie hole too.

But he still thinks he's better than he is and will still demand more money than he's worth.


Isn't that the same crap that happened with Romo in Dallas with TO because he thought Romo was ignoring him to throw to Witten?
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nerdmann on 2/9/2014(UTC)
Offline nerdmann  
#20 Posted : Sunday, February 9, 2014 6:44:50 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: play2win Go to Quoted Post
That blew my mind that the guy needed all of this special attention and counsel the night before games. Wow. Get with the program already...


Yeah, show up for and pay attention in, the team meetings like a goddamn normal person. This IS your job after all. lol

FACT: Finley KNOWS McKenzie is too conservative to allow him back on the field. His ONLY HOPE is to avoid that examination altogether and go to a different team. If I'm Jmike, my agent is scouting out which teams have the most liberal team physicians.
“Winning is not a sometime thing, it is an all the time thing. You don't do things right once in a while…you do them right all the time.”
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Dulak on 2/10/2014(UTC)
Offline Zero2Cool  
#21 Posted : Monday, February 10, 2014 6:29:14 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
Yeah, show up for and pay attention in, the team meetings like a goddamn normal person. This IS your job after all. lol

FACT: Finley KNOWS McKenzie is too conservative to allow him back on the field. His ONLY HOPE is to avoid that examination altogether and go to a different team. If I'm Jmike, my agent is scouting out which teams have the most liberal team physicians.


You feel another team will skip the physical and pay him in excess of $6 million per year? I'm going to clue you in on a little somfin somfin. Every team has a medical staff. Every player goes through a physical. True, some GM's will force the medical staff to "clear" the player.


FACT: No one knows if McKenzie will clear Finley.


Sean Richardson was cleared. How do their injuries differ or how are they similar?
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Offline play2win  
#22 Posted : Monday, February 10, 2014 7:31:45 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool Go to Quoted Post
You feel another team will skip the physical and pay him in excess of $6 million per year? I'm going to clue you in on a little somfin somfin. Every team has a medical staff. Every player goes through a physical. True, some GM's will force the medical staff to "clear" the player.


FACT: No one knows if McKenzie will clear Finley.


Sean Richardson was cleared. How do their injuries differ or how are they similar?


Off the top of my head, I believe Finley's was a C3-4, where Richardson's was a C5-6. I could be wrong. There is greater risk for serious re-injury at 3-4 vs. 5-6.

Quote:
Finley's season ended on a huge hit by Browns safety Tashaun Gipson. He suffered a neck injury and spent some time in the intensive care unit. Then he had surgery to fuse together his C3 and C4 vertebrae. Despite how scary that sounds for a player who makes his living catching passes in the middle of the field, he wants to play tight end again.
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/jermichael-finley-excited-play-again-spinal-fusion-surgery-171659287--nfl.html

Quote:
Many players have resumed their careers after single-level fusion surgery, most notably Denver quarterback Peyton Manning. The Packers would not clear Collins, who suffered the injury at C-3 and C-4, after fusion surgery.

Hsu said renowned spine surgeon Robert Watkins has advised NFL players who had the fusion at C-3, C-4 not to return because C-1, C-2 could bear the brunt of another forceful compression. Some other surgeons will allow a return. The Packers have consulted with Watkins on a number of players, including Richardson.



Read more from Journal Sentinel: http://www.jsonline.com/...80141.html#ixzz2sviOhbxn
Follow us: @JournalSentinel on Twitter


Quote:
Since Collins’ injury, two other Packers players have sustained similar injuries. Tight end Jermichael Finley and safety Sean Richardson both had fusion surgeries. Richardson, who was cleared to return late last season, had his C-5 and C-6 vertebra fused. It is considered safer at that spot because it is lower on the spine and farther away from the base of the skull.
http://espn.go.com/blog/green-bay-packers/tag/_/name/sean-richardson
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Offline nerdmann  
#23 Posted : Monday, February 10, 2014 9:59:16 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool Go to Quoted Post
You feel another team will skip the physical and pay him in excess of $6 million per year? I'm going to clue you in on a little somfin somfin. Every team has a medical staff. Every player goes through a physical. True, some GM's will force the medical staff to "clear" the player.


FACT: No one knows if McKenzie will clear Finley.


Sean Richardson was cleared. How do their injuries differ or how are they similar?


If Finley gets examined by our team doctor, he will NEVER PLAY AGAIN. He knows that, and his agent knows that.

His only chance is to get examined by someone else, who will clear him to play.
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DoddPower on 2/10/2014(UTC)
Offline mi_keys  
#24 Posted : Monday, February 10, 2014 11:31:45 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: nerdmann Go to Quoted Post
If Finley gets examined by our team doctor, he will NEVER PLAY AGAIN. He knows that, and his agent knows that.

His only chance is to get examined by someone else, who will clear him to play.


What an absurd assertion. If Dr. McKenzie was so influential that his word determined the fate of a player regardless of the opinions of any other doctors then all 32 teams would seek his opinion every time there was a major injury. A player wouldn't have a choice to avoid McKenzie's examination if his opinion were that influential.
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Offline nerdmann  
#25 Posted : Monday, February 10, 2014 11:43:44 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: mi_keys Go to Quoted Post
What an absurd assertion. If Dr. McKenzie was so influential that his word determined the fate of a player regardless of the opinions of any other doctors then all 32 teams would seek his opinion every time there was a major injury. A player wouldn't have a choice to avoid McKenzie's examination if his opinion were that influential.


No doctor wants to be the guy who let a player get injured, after someone else said they shouldn't play.
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