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Offline gakko  
#16 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 10:27:38 AM(UTC)
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I think it was a good call. It was not good because of what happened on that specific play but McCarthy tried to catch them off guard. If you pass on every 3rd and long you become very predictable as an offense, much like Mike Sherman's offense. You have got to try these things every now and then to mix up your playcalling and quite often when you run on 3rd and long you get good chunks of yardage, obviously that was not the case on this play. I would have prefered a draw play from the shotgun though.
Offline IronMan  
#17 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 10:37:26 AM(UTC)
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Come on Zombieslayer, back me up here!
Offline wpr  
#18 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 11:14:30 AM(UTC)
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IM, I understand where you are coming from. No need to defend yourself. I am not saying that you are wrong for wanting to see them make a real effort to get the 1st down.
I am saying that I understand why they didn't.
Offline obi1  
#19 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 11:37:11 AM(UTC)
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Iron Man,

I think your point is well taken. Howeer, i agree with the call. Colts I think would have done the same thing if they had been in the lead as well.

As the clock ticks off, there is more pressure put on the opposing team and thus they become mistake prone and throw INTs that put the game away... Sound familiar?

At the same time, at that juncture in the game, I wonder what McCarthy would have done had they ended up with 4th and 1 and not a 4th and long.
Now that would have been really interesting...
Offline tromadz  
#20 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 11:46:12 AM(UTC)
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McCarthy has huge balls when he sees it's 4th and 1. And with Ryan Grant no less!
Offline MassPackersFan  
#21 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 12:07:20 PM(UTC)
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If you watch enough football you see a draw called on 3rd and long all the time in the NFL. There are a lot of reasons. The defense will be looking pass, linebackers will be pass blitzing or dropping back into coverage, so you could catch them off guard for a 10+ yard gain, especially up the middle if you try to clear it out with your routes. You have a short field and not much space to work with vs. their pass defense, as well, and they are a defense that usually thrives off of turnover, so the chances of something bad happening are higher. The main reason though, is risk vs. benefit in that situation, up by 10 in the 2nd half. If there is absolutely nowhere to go, and Rodgers gets creamed after holding it a split second too long, or there is a pick 6, we're all freaking out.

I didn't necessarily agree with it, but I'm sure they know what they are doing, and saw something that said they should run it. This is doubly the case if there was a run/pass option and Rodgers also went with the draw play.
Offline longtimefan  
#22 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 12:07:36 PM(UTC)
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the onside kick was more of a huge call
Offline wils0646  
#23 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 12:09:31 PM(UTC)
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" said: Go to Quoted Post
the onside kick was more of a huge call


It would have worked too if Crosby didn't crush it. There were no white jerseys at all close to the ball.
Offline warhawk  
#24 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 12:15:11 PM(UTC)
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Bad things can happen throwing the ball over the middle down there and all the defenders will be ready for anything on the sidelines and are expecting that very throw.

The lesson isn't in the call made it's in the fact you don't ever want to be 3'rd and 10 down in that part of the field. The percentages of scoring a TD in that case is very low and that is why it is critical to not get in that position in the first place.

In otherwords I would be more focused on the failure of the first two downs than the call on third. The percentages of TD's scored in that situation is very low regardless of what play is called and I see nothing wrong in at least assuring points vs. a potential momentum changing turnover.
Offline Greg C.  
#25 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 12:44:42 PM(UTC)
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A couple of things:

1. Iron Man is right to question this call, and he did it in a respectful way. That's one of the great things about fan forums. We can discuss calls that don't make sense to us.

2. A couple of posters have referred to this call as a draw play. It wasn't. It was a typical handoff to the left side. I might've understood the call if we had a Reggie Bush or Warrick Dunn or someone like that to carry the ball. But Ryan Grant is not going to pick up 14 yards on that play. Mike McCarthy is a very good play caller, but that one seemed pretty odd to me.
Offline obi1  
#26 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 12:44:48 PM(UTC)
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" said: Go to Quoted Post
McCarthy has huge balls when he sees it's 4th and 1. And with Ryan Grant no less!


I tend to think he goes for it as well but you know the old addage, when you are down there, you must come away with points.

I thought the Packer receivers would have a HUGE day but didn't... Not that they needed to but, having so few BIG plays made the game a little monotonous...
Offline MassPackersFan  
#27 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 1:06:13 PM(UTC)
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" said: Go to Quoted Post
the onside kick was more of a huge call


I loved it. Just a bad bounce and the wind messing with the ball a bit, probably.
Offline wpr  
#28 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 1:07:47 PM(UTC)
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I will say this on Iron Man's behalf, No one can say that by running the ball GB was going to take the sure 3 they would get from a FG after Crosby missed the one before half time along with the one he missed earlier in the year.
But that missed FG could have played a part in MM's thinking. He could have said, "Let's get Crosby back out there and have him successfully make a FG before he is needed to kick a FG to win a game".
Offline Packnic  
#29 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 1:22:32 PM(UTC)
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" said: Go to Quoted Post
A couple of things:

1. Iron Man is right to question this call, and he did it in a respectful way. That's one of the great things about fan forums. We can discuss calls that don't make sense to us.

2. A couple of posters have referred to this call as a draw play. It wasn't. It was a typical handoff to the left side. I might've understood the call if we had a Reggie Bush or Warrick Dunn or someone like that to carry the ball. But Ryan Grant is not going to pick up 14 yards on that play. Mike McCarthy is a very good play caller, but that one seemed pretty odd to me.



I don't like to question individual play calls per say. A football game to me is a gigantic brutal chess match. and sometimes you make moves to do nothing else but set your opponent up. Up by 10, you can afford to take that gamble in order to get a safe 3 and set them up for the next trip in the red zone. Saying that, I definitely think you can question game plans and whole game play calling. But calling out individual plays in an entire game plan is like dumping a hot chick because she had a pimple on her shoulder.

I would also like to say that Ryan Grant busted a nice touchdown run in the same area. granted it was on first down, and it wasn't do or die, but Greg said RG was not gonna pick up 14 yards. But his TD run was in the red zone as well and racked up 11 yards. I'm just saying its very possible if executed well and catches them off guard.
Offline MassPackersFan  
#30 Posted : Wednesday, October 22, 2008 3:18:04 PM(UTC)
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" said: Go to Quoted Post

2. A couple of posters have referred to this call as a draw play. It wasn't. It was a typical handoff to the left side. I might've understood the call if we had a Reggie Bush or Warrick Dunn or someone like that to carry the ball. But Ryan Grant is not going to pick up 14 yards on that play. Mike McCarthy is a very good play caller, but that one seemed pretty odd to me.


Yeah sorry, I didn't feel like typing "hand-off" over and over again so I inaccurately used the shorter "draw", assuming people would know what I meant since I was referring to a play that already happened.
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