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Offline longtimefan  
#31 Posted : Tuesday, October 13, 2009 12:21:29 PM(UTC)
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Pressure in this instance = BLITZES, and more than 3 D-L rushing him...

Pressure in this instance DOES NOT= media hype, revenge, needing to win
Offline djcubez  
#32 Posted : Tuesday, October 13, 2009 4:16:33 PM(UTC)
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Before I start I'll try and explain myself better, which is me admitting I'm wrong. Of course Favre deserves some credit, it's not like everyone can be a QB in the NFL and win big games. That said, I don't think he deserves the amount of credit he's getting.

Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post


You say "you guys" like you mean me, however I never made excuses for the game. We lost fair and square. All I'm saying is Brett didn't do shit. He made a pass when it counted but that's what's required for a game-managing QB. His team has a run game and good defense so there's relatively no pressure on Favre to force it in there. I mean do I deserve credit every day I go and do a job I'm paid to do without making mistakes? I agree, Favre played a good game but he doesn't deserve all this credit for the win. It's not like he was bombing them on us every play and making our secondary look like fools. The Vikings as a team made our defense look like shit, not all this Favreian stuff. Wait until Favre really has to put everything on his shoulders and win a game--I guarantee he won't pull anything out of his ass like against the 49ers.

Plus what's this about Cutler. The reason we beat him is our pressure forced him to make bad throws. We rarely put any pressure on Favre because we had a weak link at safety and we focused too much on All Day. And that's not called an "excuse" for losing, it's called a "reason" for losing.

I don't get it. He has no pressure? Did you even watch the game, this running game your talking about was stuffed. I don't have the stat but I bet Favre converted many 3rd and longs when the pressure is ALL on him because its a passing down and the Vikings defense is stting down.


The running game was stuffed because that was our gameplan. We were trying to force Favre to beat us with his arm. However, we didn't really do much to stop him when he did throw it. We didn't put any pressure on him and we allowed him to consistently hit his dump-off targets. The few deep balls he through took advantage of our inconsistent safety play and miscommunication.

Quote:
"Wait until Favre really has to put everything on his shoulders and win a game" - He already did, 80 yard drive with 90 seconds left, no time outs? I don't get it.

Did you see that play? Did you see that drive? "Greg Lewis leaped for a 32-yard touchdown catch with 2 seconds left." My point is that he's not gonna pull that out of his ass every time they need a win. He had one play left from the opposing 32-yard line, we are talking 4th-and-26 odds here. No way do they win that game if they tried it again.

Quote:
Plus there are people discounting Favre's passes because of YAC but do not do the same for Rodgers (i.e. Finleys TD), it works both ways. YAC are part of the game. Also the throwing over 5 yards issue - I did a quick search and I found 8 of Favre's 24 passes went for more than 15 yards. I don't know about the 5 yards. But I know of the touchdown with Berriman was 30 yards and there was maybe 2 YAC and the Harvin 45 yarder, which I would guess had 5 YAC. Plus his average yards per pass was 11.29. How do you respond to that?


You do know those 8 plays of 15 or more include YAC don't you? The Berrian TD was blown coverage by the safety (Al Harris f*cked up pretty royally too) although it was a well thrown ball. I also never said Rodgers' deserves more credit for his passes than Favre or that Rodgers' YAC is "worth more." Average yards per pass also doesn't say shit about how long he actually threw the ball, it takes all your total passing yards and divides them by the amount of completions. One long touchdown can render that stat almost completely irrelevant. I prefer something like average yards per attempt which was about 8.7. Also there yards per pass play were actually 8.5 (source).

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The Berriman touchdown is a perfect example. I don't get what that has to do with having "7 seconds per play". He snapped it, threw it between 1-2 seconds right into the hands of the receiver in stride.

It was a blown play? And it was a decent throw, but what QB in the NFL doesn't hit a wide open receiver lol.

Quote:
I don't even care about this because as Zero said he's not our concern. But I just don't get the position that he managed the game.


All I'm saying is Favre did what he was supposed to, sure he deserves credit for that but the game was never on the line for him, the Vikings were never down and the entire Packers defense was committed to stopping Adrian Peterson, not Favre. I'm sure if the Vikings were losing at some point and Favre was forced to make a play, we might have seen an entirely different game.
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Offline IronMan  
#33 Posted : Tuesday, October 13, 2009 4:22:40 PM(UTC)
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Favre carved up the Packers. No question about it. We dared him to beat us and he did just that. Anyone who says different is just bitter and is not being objective. Period.
Offline djcubez  
#34 Posted : Tuesday, October 13, 2009 4:25:55 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Favre carved up the Packers. No question about it. We dared him to beat us and he did just that. Anyone who says different is just bitter and is not being objective. Period.

Favre got handed this game. I want to see him forced to win a game against a playoff caliber team before I give him any credit. He snaked a win from the 49ers and the Packers are too busy shooting themselves in the foot to count as a playoff team right now. Otherwise wins against the Lions, Browns and Rams leave me unimpressed.
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Offline MassPackersFan  
#35 Posted : Tuesday, October 13, 2009 6:03:04 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Favre carved up the Packers. No question about it. We dared him to beat us and he did just that. Anyone who says different is just bitter and is not being objective. Period.


No doubt about it, he had one of those rare games where he's just locked in.
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Offline CDNRodgersfan  
#36 Posted : Tuesday, October 13, 2009 10:54:46 PM(UTC)
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Ya but I want to see him do it against a playoff team in Dec, trailing by 14, on the road, with AD out, WR's all injured, with 1 second to throw and playing with a broken ankle. Yep only then will I admit he's done anything.
Offline Zero2Cool  
#37 Posted : Tuesday, October 13, 2009 11:08:16 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Favre carved up the Packers. No question about it. We dared him to beat us and he did just that. Anyone who says different is just bitter and is not being objective. Period.


No real question about that one. The Vikings QB carved up the Packers ... how many days ago was this now? ... and the Packers did dare him to beat them. One of our DL even said they were going to force Vikings QB to beat the Packers by stopping Adrian. They slowed Adrian down, but in the mean time gave Vikings QB all the time in the world to throw balls left, right, up, down, and every other direction he felt necessary.

Vikings QB > Packers Defense ... no doubt. I would have liked seeing what happened if the Packers didn't have to worry about Adrian. Buts, ifs, blahs. It was more than a week ago and its about time to talk Lions. (I've said about a dozen times after I rambled about the subject, lol)

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Offline Gravedigga  
#38 Posted : Wednesday, October 14, 2009 1:22:41 AM(UTC)
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Bottom line is this. A good coaching staff might dare you to beat them in the first quarter or so. But if a strategy isn't working, you make adjustments. I wasn't paying attention but i seriously doubt McCarthy was playing to stop the run on 3rd and long the whole game. Or on all 1st & 10's for that matter. If he was, then he's an idiot and deserves to be fired. Coaching is about adjustments and what you guys are trying to convince us "Favre Lovers" of is that either McCarthy & co are too stupid to make proper adjustments rather than Favre is a good QB who picked apart that Packer defense. Your argument makes no sense. A team tries to stop the other team. They dont try and stop Peterson from getting 100 yards. The goal is to win.

I dont know but i hardly believe that Ted Thompson and MM's strategy coming in to the game was to shut down AP and let Favre go wild all over their team. Something about that just doesnt make sense. Give him (Favre/Vikings QB) credit where credit is due.
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Offline Gravedigga  
#39 Posted : Wednesday, October 14, 2009 1:26:05 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Favre carved up the Packers. No question about it. We dared him to beat us and he did just that. Anyone who says different is just bitter and is not being objective. Period.

Favre got handed this game. I want to see him forced to win a game against a playoff caliber team before I give him any credit. He snaked a win from the 49ers and the Packers are too busy shooting themselves in the foot to count as a playoff team right now. Otherwise wins against the Lions, Browns and Rams leave me unimpressed.


Handed this game? Did Harris & Woodson play off the receivers to pad Favres stats? Did Chillar decide not to intercept the 1st TD so to be nice to Favre? Did Harris let Berrian blow past him out of pity? Give me a break. Favre put the Packers, Mike McCarthy & Ted Thompson over his kneee and gave them a spanking. Enough with the sour grapes. Plenty of time for that in a few weeks.
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Offline MassPackersFan  
#40 Posted : Wednesday, October 14, 2009 12:37:05 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Enough with the sour grapes. Plenty of time for that in a few weeks.


More prognostication skills. You should stop posting here and go to Vegas.
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Offline djcubez  
#41 Posted : Wednesday, October 14, 2009 1:15:46 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
Favre carved up the Packers. No question about it. We dared him to beat us and he did just that. Anyone who says different is just bitter and is not being objective. Period.

Favre got handed this game. I want to see him forced to win a game against a playoff caliber team before I give him any credit. He snaked a win from the 49ers and the Packers are too busy shooting themselves in the foot to count as a playoff team right now. Otherwise wins against the Lions, Browns and Rams leave me unimpressed.


Handed this game? Did Harris & Woodson play off the receivers to pad Favres stats? Did Chillar decide not to intercept the 1st TD so to be nice to Favre? Did Harris let Berrian blow past him out of pity? Give me a break. Favre put the Packers, Mike McCarthy & Ted Thompson over his kneee and gave them a spanking. Enough with the sour grapes. Plenty of time for that in a few weeks.


This is ridiculous, obviously were not going to agree so I'm going to be a bit more honest and less biased.

Yes, Favre made good throws and played a good game. Yes, he does deserve credit for the win. However, he was put in a lot of favorable positions for most of the game (Vikings were never losing, AP took the most of the defensive pressure leaving the passing game open, he played at home), while the Packers were playing from behind and shooting themselves in the foot with stupid mistakes (penalties, turnovers, dropped passes, blown coverages, no pass rush). All I'm saying is, before everyone starts annointing Favre to elite status again he should actually carry the load against a playoff caliber team, which we obviously were not when we played them.
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Offline Cheesey  
#42 Posted : Wednesday, October 14, 2009 1:56:15 PM(UTC)
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He played well.
But who here cares? He's a Viking now. I can't WAIT to see the "bad Brett" show up for a few games. I want to see how the Viking fans treat him then.

Yes, he's still a decent QB. How will he do against a good team? Only time will tell. He's had an easy run so far.
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Offline Cheesey  
#43 Posted : Wednesday, October 14, 2009 1:56:28 PM(UTC)
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I don't care about the QB of other teams. I only care about the Packers.
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Offline MassPackersFan  
#44 Posted : Wednesday, October 14, 2009 2:02:03 PM(UTC)
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The two decent teams they've played have been home games. This 3 week stretch they have coming up will be very revealing.
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Offline djcubez  
#45 Posted : Wednesday, October 14, 2009 2:08:46 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: " Go to Quoted Post
The two decent teams they've played have been home games. This 3 week stretch they have coming up will be very revealing.

Exactly, we'll know the true face of the Vikings after this Baltimore game.
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