Change is Coming PACKERSHOME is going to be 10 years old later this season and for us to have another 10 years, things will have to change. Read Change is Coming for current issues that will be resolved.
Green Bay Packers Forum

Welcome to your Green Bay Packers Online Community!

Since 2006, PackersHome has been providing a unique experience for fans.
Your participation is greatly anticipated!
Login or Register.
4 Pages<1234>
Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
Offline Zero2Cool  
#11 Posted : Tuesday, December 22, 2009 12:37:05 AM(UTC)
Rank: Premier Member

Yahoo! NCAA March Madness - Gold: 2015Yahoo! Fantasy Football - Gold: 2009FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Silver: 2010Yahoo! NCAA March Madness - Silver: 2011ESPN NCAA March Madness - Bronze: 2010Yahoo! NCAA March Madness - Bronze: 2013

United States
Joined: 10/13/2006(UTC)
Location: Green Bay, WI
Applause Given: 2,247
Applause Received: 3,300
" said: Go to Quoted Post
I am unimpressed.
We know. Trust me, we know.
Offline zombieslayer  
#12 Posted : Tuesday, December 22, 2009 3:03:48 AM(UTC)
Rank: Registered

Joined: 8/7/2008(UTC)
Location: San Francisco
Applause Given: 778
Applause Received: 495
Rock gets a +1 for this post.

I'm so pissed right now I want to leave a bag of flaming poo on Dom Caper's front porch then ding dong doorbell ditch his ass.

His conservative playcalling cost us the game.
Offline all_about_da_packers  
#13 Posted : Tuesday, December 22, 2009 6:02:40 AM(UTC)
Rank: Senior Member

Joined: 8/7/2008(UTC)
Applause Given: 23
Applause Received: 142
Um, let's settle down a bit.

Firstly, I have to disagree with Rock in his analysis; way too subjective and to be blunt he got it wrong. I guessed yesterday that Bell was at fault, and Leroy Butler confirmed that he was in his 5 Questions series.

Quote:
Theres no way that Bell should be inside of that receiver. He should be outside that receiver so he can push him toward Atari Bigby.

Link

Bigby, Collins, and Woodson are playing 3 deep safety. The whole emphasis of the play should be to force your guys inside, towards help. You have two of the better ball hawks in the league in Woodson and Collins , free to roam, and then you have Bigby as help, too. You force your guy inside, towards the help, and force Ben to throw into a crowd.

So in the end, Atari was doing fine, but Bell not so much so.

Bell made a mental blip, which should not be surprising considering he has had less than a month to digest Capers heavy playbook.



Capers is not at fault, IMO. People are unbelievably mad at him... which I can understand, but you can't blame Capers for having to use a 4th CB that is young and inexperienced, and also hasn't had a lot of time to understand his assignments.
Offline all_about_da_packers  
#14 Posted : Tuesday, December 22, 2009 6:28:41 AM(UTC)
Rank: Senior Member

Joined: 8/7/2008(UTC)
Applause Given: 23
Applause Received: 142
" said: Go to Quoted Post

How many ways does this coaching staff have to recognize/have it beat into their friggin' heads that the prevent has not and will not friggin' work against a good quarterback?

Dom gave that game away.

Better wake up quick, Dom. Stubborn stupid shit, imo



You know, with all due respect, this post is downright idiotic. I can understand the anger of losing that game, of how we should have won and everything... But you honestly shouldn't take a series alone in and of itself to come to conclusions.

Before the final drive, Big Ben carved our defense. Even saying that is an understatement.

Hell, first play of the game, Bush gets beat. Straight man coverage, 4 rushing, and we got burned. You don't think Capers is aware of this when deciding to go to Prevent?

As a DC, you put your players in position to make plays. How many times on the final drive were our players in position to make plays? A heck of a lot.

Chillar commits a penalty, wipes out an INT. Woodson can't hold on to an INT. Jenkins tries to tackle Roethlisberger high, and he can't bring him down. Tramon has a chance to INT a pass for Holmes, he drops it. That's four right there. For what it's worth, Bob McGinn lists the number of times the Packers missed ending the game on the final Steelers drive at 6. Out of 15 plays, then, McGinn counts the Packers as having been in position to close out the game 6 times.


Perhaps we should read what Capers has to say, about going to prevent.

Quote:
"Obviously, you get influenced when on the first play of the game they threw the ball over the top of us for a touchdown ... You don't want to let them go the distance in one play, you want to make them have to work and make a play."


Insider article link


Look, you want to be mad at Capers for underestimating the inexperience his DBs had... fine. You want to blame Capers, who has coached DBs himself, for not making sure his young players knew what to do, be my guest.


To start attacking Capers for irrationally running Prevent on the final drive is to come off as engaging in nonsensical rambling.

Which, to be quite frank, a few people seem to be doing in the wake of the loss.
Offline Packers_Finland  
#15 Posted : Tuesday, December 22, 2009 7:36:25 AM(UTC)
Rank: Registered

Joined: 8/11/2008(UTC)
Applause Given: 88
Applause Received: 45
Wouldn't know how to do without these pics and analysis Rock. +1 again.

Josh Bell should be our nickel back.
Offline rodgehodge  
#16 Posted : Tuesday, December 22, 2009 8:44:47 AM(UTC)
Rank: Registered

Joined: 9/24/2009(UTC)
another great post, +1
" said: Go to Quoted Post
Wouldn't know how to do without these pics and analysis Rock. +1 again.

Josh Bell should be our nickel back.


I have to agree with that. I know he gave up the touchdown, but I was actually pretty impressed with how well Bell played that down considering he's only a second year player and new to the team. Like other people have said, not a lot of corners are going to be able to make that play, and it looks like he should have had some help over the top (presumably Bigby judging from this post). Anyway, judging by what little I saw of Bell in this game I'd like to see him given a chance over Bush for sure.
Offline Rockmolder  
#17 Posted : Tuesday, December 22, 2009 11:25:06 AM(UTC)
Rank: Veteran Member

FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Bronze: 2010

Netherlands
Joined: 9/14/2008(UTC)
Applause Given: 202
Applause Received: 330
" said: Go to Quoted Post
Um, let's settle down a bit.

Firstly, I have to disagree with Rock in his analysis; way too subjective and to be blunt he got it wrong. I guessed yesterday that Bell was at fault, and Leroy Butler confirmed that he was in his 5 Questions series.

Quote:
Theres no way that Bell should be inside of that receiver. He should be outside that receiver so he can push him toward Atari Bigby.

Link

Bigby, Collins, and Woodson are playing 3 deep safety. The whole emphasis of the play should be to force your guys inside, towards help. You have two of the better ball hawks in the league in Woodson and Collins , free to roam, and then you have Bigby as help, too. You force your guy inside, towards the help, and force Ben to throw into a crowd.

So in the end, Atari was doing fine, but Bell not so much so.

Bell made a mental blip, which should not be surprising considering he has had less than a month to digest Capers heavy playbook.



Capers is not at fault, IMO. People are unbelievably mad at him... which I can understand, but you can't blame Capers for having to use a 4th CB that is young and inexperienced, and also hasn't had a lot of time to understand his assignments.


I agree with you. Like I stated, the call was actually quite nice, assuming it was a regular cover 3 man. There should be no way that you give up a huge TD in that case.

The only thing I put on Dom is the personnel on the field. Mainly who's rushing the passer.

But, anyway, Butler is right. Of course he is. Only problem I have is that, on the third pic, Bigby is just running into his own zone. He was defending somewhere as far back as the goalpost when that ball was thrown. What exactly was Bell supposed to lead him into? Open field? Bigby was way out of position. Had Bell done his assigned job, we'd be over here blaming Bigby for being out of position or Bell for being out of position.

Now whether Bell knew that he got not help from Bigby is a mistery. I'm guessing that he didn't, and that he just played it wrong, but for me, the blame in this one falls on Bigby. He's the one who wasn't where he should be. He's the one that forced Bell to go for the ball, anyway.
Offline dfosterf  
#18 Posted : Tuesday, December 22, 2009 11:53:42 AM(UTC)
Rank: Veteran Member

United States
Joined: 8/19/2008(UTC)
Applause Given: 228
Applause Received: 478
" said: Go to Quoted Post
" said: Go to Quoted Post

How many ways does this coaching staff have to recognize/have it beat into their friggin' heads that the prevent has not and will not friggin' work against a good quarterback?

Dom gave that game away.

Better wake up quick, Dom. Stubborn stupid shit, imo



You know, with all due respect, this post is downright idiotic. I can understand the anger of losing that game, of how we should have won and everything... But you honestly shouldn't take a series alone in and of itself to come to conclusions.

Before the final drive, Big Ben carved our defense. Even saying that is an understatement.

Hell, first play of the game, Bush gets beat. Straight man coverage, 4 rushing, and we got burned. You don't think Capers is aware of this when deciding to go to Prevent?

As a DC, you put your players in position to make plays. How many times on the final drive were our players in position to make plays? A heck of a lot.

Chillar commits a penalty, wipes out an INT. Woodson can't hold on to an INT. Jenkins tries to tackle Roethlisberger high, and he can't bring him down. Tramon has a chance to INT a pass for Holmes, he drops it. That's four right there. For what it's worth, Bob McGinn lists the number of times the Packers missed ending the game on the final Steelers drive at 6. Out of 15 plays, then, McGinn counts the Packers as having been in position to close out the game 6 times.


Perhaps we should read what Capers has to say, about going to prevent.

Quote:
"Obviously, you get influenced when on the first play of the game they threw the ball over the top of us for a touchdown ... You don't want to let them go the distance in one play, you want to make them have to work and make a play."


Insider article link


Look, you want to be mad at Capers for underestimating the inexperience his DBs had... fine. You want to blame Capers, who has coached DBs himself, for not making sure his young players knew what to do, be my guest.


To start attacking Capers for irrationally running Prevent on the final drive is to come off as engaging in nonsensical rambling.

Which, to be quite frank, a few people seem to be doing in the wake of the loss.


I was talking about the Green Bay vs. Pittsburgh game. You must have been watching a different one.

Not only did we have no pressure on Big Ben, we had no potential for one. I personally never mentioned the secondary, because without pass pressure, I don't expect anything but precisely what happened. 3 man rush...consisting of 3 worn-out Defensive linemen? Dom Capers can say (as can you) whatever they want, however irrational in the face of the obvious evidence. I know what I saw. Maybe at some point when we are all sitting on our couch in the off-season, someone will bother to go back and analyze just how effective our #2 on paper defense was when we rushed 3. I already know the answer.
Offline MassPackersFan  
#19 Posted : Tuesday, December 22, 2009 12:34:52 PM(UTC)
Rank: Member

Joined: 9/16/2007(UTC)
Applause Given: 1
Applause Received: 7
Great analysis and screen caps.

You should add another screen capture showing Jolly after he beat his blocker and was practically dragged down by his jersey from behind, trying to get to Ben.
Offline all_about_da_packers  
#20 Posted : Tuesday, December 22, 2009 1:21:06 PM(UTC)
Rank: Senior Member

Joined: 8/7/2008(UTC)
Applause Given: 23
Applause Received: 142
" said: Go to Quoted Post
But, anyway, Butler is right. Of course he is. Only problem I have is that, on the third pic, Bigby is just running into his own zone. He was defending somewhere as far back as the goalpost when that ball was thrown. What exactly was Bell supposed to lead him into? Open field? Bigby was way out of position.



Bigby being as far as the goalpost can't be right.... three deep safety calls for three safties on the goal line.


As for Bigby running into his zone, it's his job to read an react. It might be the case that once he saw Wallace heading towards the sideline, he decided to cheat by sliding over into Collins area.

You do raise an interesting point, and Bigby may very well have been out of position. But then again, he may have been out of position because he saw Bell forcing his guy outside, and so he decided to creep over to the side with that had more receivers emerging.
Rss Feed 
Users browsing this topic
Guest
4 Pages<1234>
Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Notification

Icon
Error


Fan Shout
Zero2Cool: thank ya sir
uffda udfa: Best looking site out there!
Zero2Cool: You welcome!
Cheesey: THANK YOU again for all you do.
Cheesey: You do all the work, while some think they don't have to honor your few rules.
Cheesey: Kevin, you KNOW how much I appreciate this site.
uffda udfa: Nope. Too much pressure for them.
Zero2Cool: NFL MVP's don't seem to win the Super Bowl the same year, do they?
Zero2Cool: Panthers played uninspired and predictable, actually (and sadly) reminded me of the Packers. :(
Zero2Cool: Thanks 68md, good to know some notice and appreciate.
Zero2Cool: Holding a different or less than popular view is perfectly fine. You fail to understand this even though I repeatedly tell you. It's annoyin
uffda udfa: Good night, Smokey.
Smokey: good night uffda.
uffda udfa: Wonder how Colts fans feel, and Mr. Irsay?
uffda udfa: Today, anyway.
Smokey: DEFENSE DOES WIN CHAMPIONSHIPS TT !
uffda udfa: Carolina will never be back to a SB under Cam Newton.
uffda udfa: Denver D just dominated the current MVP and the former this year.
uffda udfa: Cam for LVP in the SB. No character.
uffda udfa: Newton is a wuss. MVP? LOL.
uffda udfa: #VonFire
uffda udfa: People who have passion and expectations aren't A words. Accepting less than the best doesn't make you not one either.
uffda udfa: Sorry, Kevin...maybe you called Dakota an A word and not me? Had to be one of us.
uffda udfa: Marshawn Lynch announced his retirement in a cool way via twitter. What could've been in Green Bay, Marshawn!
uffda udfa: It's okay... you called me the "A" word. All because I don't tickle the ears. I get it.
uffda udfa: So someone like Buck deserves privileges because he's a better fan than me due to his flattering opinions?
68md: wet blanket ? He works his ass off to keep the place going for you ?
Smokey: Zero, Why are you such a wet blanket host ? A real SB "Chat" should have been a priority for this site. Wet Blanket strikes again.
Zero2Cool: BTW, I'm not saying you're an asshole. I'm stating a fact, that's all.
Zero2Cool: You don't get it. You confuse right and privilege. Assholes don't deserve privileges. Get it, got it, good.
uffda udfa: Talib playing a Burfict half so far.
uffda udfa: You have an R rated section on a Packers board. I think moving the guys you really don't want rocking the boat to their own forum is a great
uffda udfa: I think the same was likely said at KFAN when it was suggested they have a Packers show. I believe they still have it. I used to produce it
Zero2Cool: Seriously think what you're asking and do so before asking. Unreal.
uffda udfa: Aaron walking gingerly in that SB MVP introduction thing.
Please sign in to use Fan Shout

Road To Super Bowl 50
Sunday, Sep 13 @ 12:00 PM
at Bears
Sunday, Sep 20 @ 7:30 PM
SEAHAWKS
Monday, Sep 28 @ 7:30 PM
CHIEFS
Sunday, Oct 4 @ 3:25 PM
at 49ers
Sunday, Oct 11 @ 12:00 PM
RAMS
Sunday, Oct 18 @ 3:25 PM
CHARGERS
Sunday, Oct 25 @ 12:00 AM
- BYE -
Sunday, Nov 1 @ 7:30 PM
at Broncos
Sunday, Nov 8 @ 12:00 PM
at Panthers
Sunday, Nov 15 @ 12:00 PM
LIONS
Sunday, Nov 22 @ 3:25 PM
at Vikings
Thursday, Nov 26 @ 7:30 PM
BEARS
Thursday, Dec 3 @ 7:25 PM
at Lions
Sunday, Dec 13 @ 3:25 PM
COWBOYS
Sunday, Dec 20 @ 3:05 PM
at Raiders
Sunday, Dec 27 @ 3:25 PM
at Cardinals
Sunday, Jan 3 @ 7:30 PM
VIKINGS

Think About It
Think About It

Recent Topics
29m / Announcements / 68md

1h / Green Bay Packers Talk / nerdmann

9h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

22h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

9-Feb / Green Bay Packers Talk / PackFanWithTwins

9-Feb / Green Bay Packers Talk / FLORIDA PACKER88

9-Feb / Green Bay Packers Talk / uffda udfa

8-Feb / Green Bay Packers Talk / PackFanWithTwins

7-Feb / Green Bay Packers Talk / uffda udfa

7-Feb / Green Bay Packers Talk / uffda udfa

7-Feb / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

7-Feb / Green Bay Packers Talk / uffda udfa

6-Feb / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

6-Feb / Green Bay Packers Talk / Cheesey

6-Feb / Green Bay Packers Talk / uffda udfa


Tweeter