D.J. Smith outplayed A.J. Hawk last season· Page 4

Dexter_Sinister
Registered

11 years ago

Perhaps it won't bother Bishop. That makes him unique in comparisons to every single person out there. This is their profession. I never met somebody that is cool with their co-worker working under them, but making more money in the process.

Regardless, think of the leverage this gives Bishop or D.J. Smith in future contract negotiations. The Packers paid Hawk X amount of money to sit the bench. How much should a starter that leads the team in tackles earn? It’s not how Bishop feels toward Hawk. I don't think he'd feel anything negative toward him. Anybody in Hawk's position would take the money, not to mention the Packers did the contract. It's their fault. However, that doesn't mean Hawk's contract and the decision Green Bay makes with him wouldn't play into future business.

For the record, I'd take Francois over Hawk based on last season. Hawk could have a hell of a camp, though. That would solve many problems, but it's not as simple as keeping the five or six best ILBs. There's a business side to this as well and a ton of variables go into that.

Originally Posted by: porky88

I would still start Hawk over Bishop.

I want to go out like my Grandpa did. Peacefully in his sleep.
Not screaming in terror like his passengers.

Dexter_Sinister
Registered

11 years ago

#32

This has been a great conversation. But I am tired. I will pick this up tomorrow. Thanks and happy fathers day.

I want to go out like my Grandpa did. Peacefully in his sleep.
Not screaming in terror like his passengers.

Zero2Cool
Elite Member Topic Starter

11 years ago

#33

Seems each time the drops in that game are referenced, it goes up. Watching the game, it was six and now we're up to eight lol.

Dexter_Sinister
Registered

11 years ago

#34

Seems each time the drops in that game are referenced, it goes up. Watching the game, it was six and now we're up to eight lol.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool

When I first heard the number it was 8. I guess a couple could be debatable. I have also heard 7.

How do we decide?

I want to go out like my Grandpa did. Peacefully in his sleep.
Not screaming in terror like his passengers.

Zero2Cool
Elite Member Topic Starter

11 years ago

#35

When I first heard the number it was 8. I guess a couple could be debatable. I have also heard 7.

How do we decide?

Originally Posted by: Dexter_Sinister

lol no clue man, I just find it funny. I honestly don't know the amount of drops.

zombieslayer
Registered

11 years ago

#36

When we discuss it amongst ourselves, it's 7 or 8. When we discuss it with Giants fans, it's 12. "We would have slaughtered you guys if it wasn't for our 12 drops."

My man Donald Driver

(thanks to Pack93z for the pic)
2010 will be seen as the beginning of the new Packers dynasty. 🇹🇹 🇲🇲 🇦🇷

reachbryanh
Registered

11 years ago

#37

Sounds like you guys are looking for some coverage data. I admit, it probably should have been in the story as well.

2011 Coverage grades: Hawk +1.7, Bishop -2.1 and Smith -0.4 For Bishop and Hawk, that's good for 14th and 32nd respectively among top 50 ILB and MLBs in snaps.
2010 Coverage grades: Hawk +5.6, Bishop +4.7

On a game by game basis, our grades show Hawk was up and down in coverage. Good games (@CHI, STL, DET) and poor (NO, @SD, @KC and against NYG in playoffs)
Bishop had 2 poor games (CHI, @ATL) and no particularily good games. Smith was pretty bad @NYG and really good against OAK.

More 2011 stats:
Hawk 64.3 comp %, 1 TD, 0 INT, 4 PD, 90.6 NFL rating
Smith 76.2 comp %, 0 TD, 1 INT, 0 PD, 75.5 NFL rating
Bishop 78.7 comp %, 2 TD, 0 INT, 3 PD, 117.2 NFL rating

PFF signature stats for coverage.
Coverage snaps/target = Hawk 9.6 (13th), Smith 5.3, Bishop 7.2 (38th)
Coverage snaps/reception allowed = Hawk 15.1 (7th), Smith 6.9, Bishop 8.7 (46th)
Yards allowed per coverage snap = Hawk 0.67 (4th), Smith 1.35, Bishop 1.38 (48th)

What these signature stats don't take into account, is how a player is used in the scheme. For example, when the Packers were caught with out enough DBs to cover the slot, it was Bishop who moved out on either the tight end or even WR which likely meant longer pass routes. The large disparity in coverage snaps per reception allowed could be explained by the fact that just because Hawk was dropping into coverage, didn't mean he had a pass route to cover (i.e. in man defense, if the RB stays into pass block) so that would reduce the number targets. The signature stats can help give you a picture of things, but coverage grades give the best idea of actual performance in coverage.

Bryan Hall - Pro Football Focus

buckeyepackfan
Veteran Member

11 years ago

#38

Damn, can the season just get here, THE ONLY STAT THAT MATTERS IS THAT W-L STAT.

Packers were pretty good in 2011.

I know everyone is starved for football, and it's real easy playing Monday morning GM.

Bottom line is until some of you realize that THIS IS A TEAM GAME, you will continue to over-analyze every game, every play, every player.

The one thing I have never understood is how some of you root AGAINST certain players on YOUR team.

I know everyone has their favorites, but to blatantly rip on a guy just because, IN YOUR OPINION, isn't playing up to his draft position, or isn't earning his contract is total bullshit.

Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy decide who is or isn't going to be on the team, I say it every year, this year I'm gonna say it a little early.

Whoever ends up on the final roster, I would hope you as a Packer fan will back those players.

I know I'm just talking to myself here, but I gotta try.

I was addicted to The Hokey Pokey, but I turned myself around!

DoddPower
Veteran Member

11 years ago

#39

Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy decide who is or isn't going to be on the team, I say it every year, this year I'm gonna say it a little early.

Originally Posted by: buckeyepackfan

Ahhhh, so THAT'S how it works!! I'm glad you cleared that up for me because for a second, I thought we here at Packer's Home decided who makes the Packer's roster. DAMMIT! Now I'm bummed.

Also, I guess there's no reason to discuss anything then, since you know, we aren't making roster decisions anymore. I must ask, though, what is the purpose of NFL Forums if not to discuss such things (among many other topics)? 😞 😞

buckeyepackfan
Veteran Member

11 years ago

#40

Originally Posted by: doddpower

It's not the discussions that bother me,you can discuss till your blue in the face, it's the BLATANT hating some of you have against cetain players.

Players that have been deemed by Ted Thompsaon and Mike McCarthy as good enough to play for The Packers.

Over analyze all you want.

I was addicted to The Hokey Pokey, but I turned myself around!

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