Victoria Soto...

Vic So'oto



Anyhoozle, my opinion, I don't trust a lot of media, wether they are BSing or being BS'd themselves.

But I honestly don't see any other logical angle other than what has been reported.

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This is real tough one for me because I realize the sensitive nature of life and death. I don't mean to suggest it definitely was a hoax, because I don't know that to be true as much as I don't know it to be true that it did happen. What both sides rely on is reporting. One side claims it happened but there is another claiming it didn't. So, I have two conflicting reports. Which one is true? Without being there, the best I could ever do is say I don't know...but, I believe...

Victoria Soto is one of the key figures the other side (hate to use term conspiracy theorists) has focused on as a major player in what they call a government created hoax. Is she dead? I don't have a clue.

Again, in the end, unless you witnessed this first hand, you don't know what is true or not. The best you can do is believe one way or the other. I find it strange so many would go out of their way to question someone's actual death...that is quite brazen. Why do they do it? Is it because they hate the govt. that much, or is it because they have found things that don't add up? That's where it gets hard...we're talking about a multideath event as reported and to say that didn't happen sounds so cruel. I believe that I will never know what actually happened there.

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It's quite simple. People find what they look for, period.

I've witnessed that most people who are pessimistic and believe the world is out to get them are often weak. They usually fail to be accountable for their own mistakes and pass responsibility onto someone else. I stress again, this is just what I have witnessed. It is not a blanket statement.

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Yes, you rely on reporting. It comes down to a matter of credibility. None of the Sandy Hook conspiracy stuff that I've seen comes off as even remotely credible or convincing. The problem is people already inclined toward believing it will jump right in without worrying about credibility.

http://mobile.wnd.com/2013/10/are-conspiracy-theorists-really-the-sane-ones/ 

----The university study cited showed the conspiracy crowd more well grounded.

In my experience, I've found that those who take everything they're told at face value to be the dupes this article speaks to. The strongest thing, from this piece, that I've witnessed is that those who believe mainstream stuff is that they go ostrich when presented with anything counter to what they basically need to believe. You can't really debate with a mainstream thinker...they will not go there it is too threatening of a place because their world is something other than it really is within their minds. Challenging them with new info is a thing they do not want.

Manipulation and control are two things that flow from the type who does not question. If you've ever walked in to buy a car you've experienced this before. The person who just takes it all as it comes is very easily influenced to do something another party wants. The person who is cynical will test what is said. There is a reason advertising is so effective. Most people are the mainstream type influenced very easily by the things they see and hear.

EDIT: BTW, I wouldn't call the Sandy Hook story either an optimistic or pessimistic type of a situation. If what I'm reading from you is correct, the optimists view is that yes, indeed, some crazy walked into an elementary school and killed teachers and kids. The pessimistic view would be that this actually didn't happen and was used by the government as a way to help further gun control issues. I would think that thinking nobody was killed would be the more optimistic of the two viewpoints, not that either viewpoint is really either or but if pressed this is what I would have to conclude.

There is a big difference between pessimism and optimism and believing what the mainstream tells you vs. questioning it. I'd day apples and oranges but the one is a vegetable and the other a fruit. I see no link between questioning things and pessimism at all. In fact, I find it wholly healthy to question things in life. I do agree that people find what they look for... some people don't look at all.

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Where is the connection between what you quoted and your response?

In my response, I won't offend you with being obtuse, rather, I will respond to what you have said as I have quoted you.

Those who fail to question are often dubbed gullible and most likely get taken advantage of. I believe it is our responsibility to ask questions instead of taking things "just as they are". However, there is a level of respect that has to be exhibited in certain situations. When it comes to the media, I question most everything. Then again, I have little respect for the media as I feel they are out to twist ant hills into mountains to get attention, to get ratings.

For me it is a personal conflict to assume that every media outlet is lying about certain people being dead. Is it possible? Yep. I tend to lean with it being true, and risk potentially being duped, rather than assume it is false and be an inconsiderate insensitive jerk.



As for the actual topic here. I believe the reported deceased are in fact deceased. Would I be surprised to learn the government placed semi-automatic rifles so they could they use the incident as leverage for infringing our 2nd amendment rights? No, sadly I would not be surprised.

I also believe this quote to be accurate. "When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."

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The connection is that you gave your view of your personal experience. I quoted it and gave mine and spoke to pessimism vs. optimism which I found had no intersection with this story.

I'm with you on most of what you typed save for the idea that questioning a tragedy makes someone insensitive. Wouldn't, by definition, the best way to quell speculation is to put people into a place where they'd be labeled as such if they did? Lyerla found that out the hard way.

If I came here and told you about some personal tragedy and you were skeptical I wouldn't find that insensitive. How are you to know that what I'm telling you is accurate? You don't know me and you wouldn't have witnessed any of it. If i got all bent out of shape that would be my issue not yours. However, I fully understand what you're getting at...as I said, who wants to go around questioning people's grief and loss?

Did Sandy Hook happen as reported? I don't know and will never know. What do I believe? I believe that some of the questions raised are fair questions to ask despite the issues with sensitivity. I believe calling someone a liar is wrong but to be skeptical is completely in bounds.

Control is achieved when the masses don't question. I think everything should be questioned. The media is not your friend is often a tool for an agenda. If that could be stipulated to I don't see how questioning Sandy Hook is really all that awful of a thing. I never really gave this one all that much thought. Like the masses, I tuned in that AM to horror and shock on my TV. I was off that day. I cry when I see things like this. Something about schools and violence really gets to me. I never really thought to question anything about it. One night my wife was watching "conspiracy" videos and one happened to be about Sandy Hook. I watched it and thought it raised some compelling questions. I've since read the debunking of some of these items. Some of the debunking I found to be solid and some not so much.

One of the things I find interesting about people, in general, is that they speak like they know things they don't know at all. It is a human flaw I guess to want to come across as authoritative or knowledgeable. So many in this world are, at this very moment, speaking about subjects they are completely clueless about, but they were told or read something so it becomes truth to them. It can get a little crazy when you really apply what I'm speaking to within your own life, but you literally don't know when you sit on a chair if it'll break, you don't know the bridge you're driving over won't collapse, but you do know that is probably isn't very likely...yet, it does happen. So, I've tried to live my life with that in mind that I know next to nothing, believe a lot of things, and question most everything. If I hold Sandy Hook up to that looking back on it, it puts me in a spot where I realize I don't know what happened there and to speak like I do is pure folly. That would not stop many people though from telling you that you're this or that for asking questions. Those people don't know any more than you do but they've fully persuaded themselves that they do. I find that dangerous and not a very good way to go through life.

I feel for Colt Lyerla that he expressed a viewpoint and was censored as he was. This county is completely out of control with taking offense to things. If Colt Lyerla thinks this was a giant ruse, how does that affect you? How? Does what a young college kid who happened to play TE that comes from a troubled background bring any more grief to anyone? I know this much, if I lost one of my kids, nothing anyone could say could ever begin to touch the grief the loss would bring me. Would it potentially annoy me or anger me? Maybe.

Here's a question...for those who are convinced this happened as it was reported by the major networks have you ever looked at anything counter to what you believe? Have you found nothing that makes you question? Or... have you chosen not to look? Not necessarily for this board, but I believe the masses never cared to look. I like looking at all the sides. No preconceived notions that anything is the truth and go from there.

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A group of fire fighters and volunteers have been building playgrounds for every student who passed away. Many around my area and some all across the US. They were all built in an area that held special value to each student. These same people who believe it was a hoax, are going around destroying these playgrounds.

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Now, that is just sad. This must mean that there are those right there in the community who don't believe it really happened, right? Even if you thought it was a hoax, how could you destroy something of value that may have special meaning to someone?

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