MontanaBob
12 years ago
Aside from JoePa and his croonies problems, enlighten me about this double standard. College nicknames that are thought to be derogatory in nature to some people, are fine with the Pros and some other colleges. Case in point, and DakotaT if you read this maybe you can enlighten us somewhat.

The University of North Dakota is being punished by the NCAA and it's future entrance into the Big Sky Conference is in jeopardy because of its' teams nickname....The Fighting Sioux. They have to change it before next year or else....says the NCAA. My good friend, James RunningWater (really) says it's all a bunch of shit started by the ACLU. He and most of his tribe (The Flathead Indians) could care less and are actually proud when teams have Indian nicknames.

So.......Why can Illinois keep its' Fighting Illini name (Indian Tribe) and Marquette had to change from Warriors to the Eagles? How about Florida State Seminoles? Stanford had to change its' nickname, so went from the Indians to the Cardinal. Cardinal????? That's a frigging tree.

And the pros. What about the Atlanta Braves; the Washington Redskins; the Golden State Warriors; the Cleveland Indians; They all kept their names. There are probably many more to list, but you get the point.

So I'm protesting a few nicknames and am going to write my senators and see if I can get a few names changed. Like the Dallas Cowboys....every cowboy in the world should be up in arms that such a crappy team has that nickname. Or the Pittsburgh Pirates? When's the last time you saw a Pirate ship cruising down the Ohio or Allegheny or Monongahela Rivers in downtown Pittsburgh?

Anyway, why the big hoopla about nicknames? I don't care if a teams calls itself The Slipperyrock Stinky Turds. If they can stand it so could I.
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Zero2Cool
12 years ago
Redskins and Braves teams have been targeted for years about their team name.

Personally, I don't see the problem with it. I'm not Indian so maybe that's why I don't have an issue? Then again, if the we had a team called the Tennessee Crackers, I wouldn't be bothered by that either, or the Wisconsin Hillbillies.

I just feel these groups who target team names simply lack something important to do in their lives.
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DakotaT
12 years ago
The funny thing about UND is that there was a wealthy contributor named Ralph Englestad that put up the finances for a state of the art hockey facility for the college with the stipulation that the UND Fighting Sioux logo was always in place. If they lost the name, then they would lose the building too. Every seat, hell every brick has the Sioux logo on it.

I don't think the local tribes give a rats ass, they're too busy counting their casino and oil royalties.
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wpr
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12 years ago
Here is the deal-
The NCCA has a wild hair up their @ss. That can't do sh!t about pro teams. Like Zero says there have been a lot of complaints about it not the protesters (a group with fewer supporters than PETA no doubt.) Add Cleveland and Chief Wahoo to the list.

Colleges-
Illinois is not named for the Indian tribe. So says the officials at the university. It is thus named for the war veterans from the state. They pulled out proof that they had stashed away (They must have seen this coming years ago.) That shows newspapers first called vets of the CIVIL WAR who played college sports the Fighting Illini! I think they were prepared because of all the complaints about Chief Illiniwek being racist. Illinois had to give up the indian head logo on the basketball court, uniforms and souvenirs along with the chief but managed to keep the name. I am sure that ticked of the NCAA. The chief's original clothing was bought from a Sioux tribe back in the 1920's. He had to learn and do a Sioux dance routine and give presentations about the Indian tribes to local groups.

As you mentioned other schools lost their name. Hawaii is fighting them (Rainbow Warriors) because so many of the students are native Hawaiians. There is a couple of other schools that fall into this category and have a large percent of the school as Native Americans.

Skunky Florida bought of one of the Seminole groups. They pay them a stipend every year and they get to have someone (not always Native Am nor Seminole) ride a horse and throw a flaming spear into the ground at their football games. That is tacky compared to the Illinois Chief. Illinois can't get the same deal because the Illini tribe was all killed off by whites and other Indian groups. that and they married into other tribes.

My biggest complaint besides the Florida team is why stop at indian names? pirates, irish and spartans and other team names can be construed as being offensive by someone.

EDIT- I read this past week that a tribe of Sioux were going to sue the NCAA to allow UND to keep the name. We shall see how that works out.
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Nonstopdrivel
12 years ago
I was actually contemplating creating a thread about this after watching a Michigan State game the other day. Why can they have a team called the Spartans, when Indians is somehow offensive? For that matter, why does no one protest Trojans or Vikings?

The whole thing is absurd.
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MontanaBob
12 years ago
Thanks for the replys. As nonstop said, the whole thing is absurd. The only case I'm familiar with where a name was changed because it was offensive was right here in Missoula. Not a team name, but a mountain peak. Just west of town about 5 miles is a mountain peak that used to be called Squaw Peak. It is very visible from Missoula as it is shaped like a volcano peak. Well, it seems that in the native language of some of the Northwest tribes, "Squaw" is a nasty term used to describe the female genitals. So, about 10 years ago Squaw Peak became "Sleeping Woman Peak." This change I can agree with, but who knew what the word meant long ago when Lewis and Clark cruised through here.

Years ago I was contemplating going to USC on a track scholarship, but I didn't want to be associated with a form of birth control. Grizzlies sounded a lot better than Trojans. I could just hear my little brother....."my big brother's going to USC. He's a condom."

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zombieslayer
12 years ago

Aside from JoePa and his croonies problems, enlighten me about this double standard. College nicknames that are thought to be derogatory in nature to some people, are fine with the Pros and some other colleges. Case in point, and DakotaT if you read this maybe you can enlighten us somewhat.

The University of North Dakota is being punished by the NCAA and it's future entrance into the Big Sky Conference is in jeopardy because of its' teams nickname....The Fighting Sioux. They have to change it before next year or else....says the NCAA. My good friend, James RunningWater (really) says it's all a bunch of shit started by the ACLU. He and most of his tribe (The Flathead Indians) could care less and are actually proud when teams have Indian nicknames.

So.......Why can Illinois keep its' Fighting Illini name (Indian Tribe) and Marquette had to change from Warriors to the Eagles? How about Florida State Seminoles? Stanford had to change its' nickname, so went from the Indians to the Cardinal. Cardinal????? That's a frigging tree.

And the pros. What about the Atlanta Braves; the Washington Redskins; the Golden State Warriors; the Cleveland Indians; They all kept their names. There are probably many more to list, but you get the point.

So I'm protesting a few nicknames and am going to write my senators and see if I can get a few names changed. Like the Dallas Cowboys....every cowboy in the world should be up in arms that such a crappy team has that nickname. Or the Pittsburgh Pirates? When's the last time you saw a Pirate ship cruising down the Ohio or Allegheny or Monongahela Rivers in downtown Pittsburgh?

Anyway, why the big hoopla about nicknames? I don't care if a teams calls itself The Slipperyrock Stinky Turds. If they can stand it so could I.

Originally Posted by: MontanaBob 



Bob - Totally depends on the word. Let's just say that instead of Indian (feather, not dot) names, they're Italian.

Braves would be equivalent of calling an Italian "Rocky Balboa." It's a compliment. It means something along the lines of elite warriors.

"Indians" would be like saying "The Cleveland Italians." It's a name. That's it.

Now "Redskin" is a derogatory word. I'd actually prefer Washington to rename their team name to something like the local tribes in the Wash D.C. area. That would be better. Redskin is equivalent to calling a team the Washington Wops. You go up to an Italian and call him a wop, you might just get punched.

Warriors once again is a compliment. Not as elite as Braves, but still, it's like calling someone a tough guy. So it would be like calling someone Rocky Balboa's trainer (forgot his name, not his drunk brother-in-law but the cool guy who died in Rocky II).
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Formo
12 years ago
The Fighting Illini and the Seminoles have the written permission of local tribes for their nicknames. I don't know about the Soo though (I'm a Gopher hockey fan, My hate for their team burns like many hot suns).
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zombieslayer
12 years ago

The Fighting Illini and the Seminoles have the written permission of local tribes for their nicknames. I don't know about the Soo though (I'm a Gopher hockey fan, My hate for their team burns like many hot suns).

Originally Posted by: Formo 



I know the Seminoles take it as a compliment and are proud of it.
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wpr
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12 years ago

The Fighting Illini and the Seminoles have the written permission of local tribes for their nicknames. I don't know about the Soo though (I'm a Gopher hockey fan, My hate for their team burns like many hot suns).

Originally Posted by: Formo 




wrong.

1. There is not an Illini Tribe any longer. There is no one to get written permission from.
2. "Fighting Illini" refers to the residents of the State (Non Indian) who were war veterans. The first newspaper reference was Civil War era. Same as Hoosiers are from the State of Indiana. Originally it was not meant to be college related although it is now.
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