wpr
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11 years ago

If I remember correctly, the cupboards were bare under Sherman coach/GM. We were in salary cap hell and very few young and talented players to replace aging veterans. Sherman ran the Packers as if they were one player away from the Super Bowl every year and never thinking about the future.

What I'd like to see Ted Thompson do is shore up weaknesses with 2nd tier free agents instead of relying on rookies. Very few rookies are impact players.

Originally Posted by: DakotaT 



yeah I have been yelled at by many on the board for daring to suggest GB actually pick up some talent via the free agent market. It doesn't have to be the break the bank and or over the hill players. There are many decent 2nd tier players out there. Uncle Teddy doesn't even have to go that route every single year. Year in and year out having one of the youngest teams does not win championships. They need to have quality seasoned veterans along with young and developing players.

It is as if Ted goes out of his way to "prove" his way is the only way. Out of a 52 man roster there is nothing wrong with having 10 players come in via the free agent route.
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texaspackerbacker
11 years ago

There's a big difference between complaining about someone and demanding he be replaced. The latter is the wrong course of action simply because he's proven he can do the job. Complaining I feel is something we all can do regardless.



I'm thoroughly surprised you have to ask, but read above for some clarity.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



This is NOT some problem that just came up now with the Rodgers injury, and it certainly isn't limited to the defense - if anything, the O Line is qualitatively worse than the defense.

Granted, there is a difference between complaining and demanding replacement, but aside from the fact that all the "demanding .... " by anybody here or other forums isn't gonna do shit to make it happen anyway, you have this: "complaining" implies "ho hum, he ain't perfect, but it's no big deal whether he continues doing it his way or not". In light of the total EXPOSURE of the job Ted Thompson has done with this team over the past few games, do you think "complaining" is enough? I never said I wanted Ted Thompson to drop dead or anything, I just wish he'd go off to a nice retirement - or as somebody said, going to (ruining) some other team.

I'm pretty sure it ain't gonna happen - I won't get my wish, and those ignoramuses "demanding" getting rid of Capers won't get their wish either, and we will just go back to having Aaron Rodgers mask all problems and winning games - which ain't too bad. It could be/could have been better, though.
Expressing the Good Normal Views of Good Normal Americans.
If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
DarkaneRules
11 years ago
I like the spirited debate here. Overall, I think we can agree that this shines the biggest light on Ted Thompson or at least I hope we can. The personnel and those who coach are ultimately his responsibility.

I can say that I disagree about which is worse. There are more players and total plays on the defensive side than the offensive side that are the problem but the space between them was much lower on Thursday that it has been in recent memory.

It will provide a much brighter light on the off season evaluation process that is one thing we know for certain.
Circular Arguments: They are a heck of an annoyance
play2win
11 years ago
Fact is, we have not replaced the services lost to our defense when Jenkins left in FA, Collins was injured and Woodson went down and was not re-signed. 2011 season. 2012 season. Now 2013 season.

Add to that, the play of AJ Hawk has diminished greatly, and while his contract was negotiated down, we all now realize we need improved play there. Gaping hole next to him, two years after the loss of Bishop to injury?

Pass rush opposite Matthews. Where is that? When available, Perry has looked good. But, here we go now, player availability… when does that issue get addressed? We have gone almost 4 seasons now as one of the most injured teams in the NFL, and with ZERO accountability. ZERO. No changes to the way they do things in fitness and conditioning. Unbelievable.

This entire front office and coaching staff needs to look in the mirror.
DoddPower
11 years ago
Packers fans, and every other team with an elite QB with a 100 million dollar contract, is just going to have to get used to the fact that there are always going to be a few positions of weakness on their team. It's the reality of today's NFL. Teams like the Seahawks and 49'ers aren't having to deal with that yet. They are benefiting from years of high draft picks, and most of the star players playing under their "cheap" rookie contracts. That will change soon, especially for the Seahawks. I still think Kaepernick is average overall at best, but will have moments of greatness. Plus they seem to stay really damn healthy, relatively speaking, although their luck has been changing a little this season.

Obviously the above is no excuse to have a shitty team, but it's going to be very difficult and close to impossible to have a "complete" team. Especially once one factors in contracts like CM3, etc., into the picture. Teams in this situation just have to hope that their strengths can overcome their weaknesses. Generally speaking, I think the Packers do just that.

I think the Packers are almost as talented as any team in the league when relatively healthy, and would be a contender every year. If Rodgers is out, that changes everything, but that's the way these teams will be built most the time. How well would the Saints function without Brees? The Broncos without Manning? Patriots without Brady? I know they went 10-6 when he missed most of the season, but the reality is they still missed the playoffs. Also, an exception doesn't define the norm. Although to be fair, Mallet is probably a pretty damn good backup. Regardless, the Patriots still have some huge weaknesses, as well. Look at the Giants and Falcons this season. I remember many were predicting both of them as Super Bowl contenders at the the beginning of the season.

There are possibly better general managers than Ted Thompson out there, but there are ABSOLUTELY many worse. I truly think a lot of the problem with the Packers comes back to coaching, even with Rodgers healthy. Yes, the coaches failure ultimately comes back on Thompson, but I have seen McCarthy and Capers just be utterly EMBARRASSED and out coached many times. I also think, with the talent the Packers have, there are coaches out there that could get more out of their players.
texaspackerbacker
11 years ago

Fact is, we have not replaced the services lost to our defense when Jenkins left in FA, Collins was injured and Woodson went down and was not re-signed. 2011 season. 2012 season. Now 2013 season.

Add to that, the play of AJ Hawk has diminished greatly, and while his contract was negotiated down, we all now realize we need improved play there. Gaping hole next to him, two years after the loss of Bishop to injury?

Pass rush opposite Matthews. Where is that? When available, Perry has looked good. But, here we go now, player availability… when does that issue get addressed? We have gone almost 4 seasons now as one of the most injured teams in the NFL, and with ZERO accountability. ZERO. No changes to the way they do things in fitness and conditioning. Unbelievable.

This entire front office and coaching staff needs to look in the mirror.

Originally Posted by: play2win 



I sense more and more people are coming around.

I agree with a lot of what you say, but Hawk's play diminished? I tend to think he was always mediocre, and he improved - just a little bit anyway - this year (except for yesterday hahahaha)

I don't know what to think about the injury thing. There has been a LOT of that all around the league, but you're probably right about us getting hit worse than almost anyone else. Blame it purely on bad luck? Or explain it with some kind of story about inadequate fitness or whatever? I tend to go with the luck ...... but who knows.

I am also conflicted on Nick Perry. He certainly ain't flashy like Clay Matthews, but when he plays, good things seem to happen - so who knows there too.

A word to you Capers haters/Thompson defenders: In keeping with play2win's last line, I'll trade you the one for the other - get rid of Capers and get rid of Thompson too ......... but fuck it, who are we kidding? We all know, nobody is gonna get fired because we probably end up winning the division at 9-6-1 and who knows from there.


Expressing the Good Normal Views of Good Normal Americans.
If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
Mucky Tundra
11 years ago

Packers fans, and every other team with an elite QB with a 100 million dollar contract, is just going to have to get used to the fact that there are always going to be a few positions of weakness on their team. It's the reality of today's NFL. Teams like the Seahawks and 49'ers aren't having to deal with that yet. They are benefiting from years of high draft picks, and most of the star players playing under their "cheap" rookie contracts. That will change soon, especially for the Seahawks. I still think Kaepernick is average overall at best, but will have moments of greatness. Plus they seem to stay really damn healthy, relatively speaking, although their luck has been changing a little this season.

Originally Posted by: DoddPower 



=d> =d> =d> =d> =d>

The NFL had been stacking the deck against winning teams previously with the salary cap and the scheduling based on division placement. But the new CBA tops both with the way rookie contracts are structured. Just compare Stafford and Bradfords rookie contracts vs Lucks. It's no longer a cap killer to draft in the top 10 2-3 years in a row. Now you get cheap, blue chip talent. And hell, when it's time to talk about a new contract, the first years of it probably aren't that bad.

Under Construction!
hardrocker950
11 years ago


There are possibly better general managers than Ted Thompson out there, but there are ABSOLUTELY many worse. I truly think a lot of the problem with the Packers comes back to coaching, even with Rodgers healthy. Yes, the coaches failure ultimately comes back on Thompson, but I have seen McCarthy and Capers just be utterly EMBARRASSED and out coached many times. I also think, with the talent the Packers have, there are coaches out there that could get more out of their players.

Originally Posted by: DoddPower 



More fans are starting to realize this reality. I agree with basically everything you said, but this part is the most disturbing.

I think mm is losing respect from the players (and fans) now that Aaron isn't there to make him look like an average/good coach.

I have been having doubts about Capers for a while now, but even the "casual" fans have taken notice. It is not often that the average fans are disappointed in a DC - which should say there is a problem.

And onward to TT. His stubborn ways have caught up with him finally, and many of us saw the train wreck coming. While the salary cap limits who you might be able to bring in- if you need a player, by all means make a move. I like that we have a team that is mostly home grown, but I see ZERO harm in bringing some veteran players aside from possible salary issues. If you need a RT, GO FUCKING GET ONE THAT YOU KNOW CAN PLAY! Need a safety - go get one! It takes too damn long to develop a full roster from draft picks - especially without that veteran leadership!
Mucky Tundra
11 years ago


I think Mike McCarthy is losing respect from the players (and fans) now that Aaron isn't there to make him look like an average/good coach.

Originally Posted by: hardrocker950 



You know I saw on another message board something similar to this. The poster pointed out no matter how bad the beating, McCarthy defends Capers and the scheme and blames the players. The poster wondered how long the players would allow McCarthy to dump on them in public while defending Capers and not holding him accountable in anyway beyond the "recurring issues" comment.
Under Construction!
hardrocker950
11 years ago

You know I saw on another message board something similar to this. The poster pointed out no matter how bad the beating, McCarthy defends Capers and the scheme and blames the players. The poster wondered how long the players would allow McCarthy to dump on them in public while defending Capers and not holding him accountable in anyway beyond the "recurring issues" comment.

Originally Posted by: Mucky Tundra 



I think there is truth in this. To continue to blame everything on the players is going to lose their respect. When you lose their respect, you will get less production from them - just like average Joe having a jerk boss who blames his employees for everything.

I liked Mike in the past, but I am starting to think differently of him after several games with playcalling that is nothing short of predictable. His meetings with the press post game are just as predictable after a loss - "recurring issues, good game plan, need to tackle, need to finish the game....yadda yadda..."

It is apparent that this team needs some fresh blood on their staff.
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Zero2Cool (3h) : Woo-hoo
TheKanataThrilla (3h) : NFL Network is broadcasting the game tonight, but not in Canada. Not sure why as no local television is showing the game.
beast (23h) : But the Return from IR designations had to be applied by the 53 man cutdown.
beast (23h) : It's a new rule, so it's not clear, but my understanding was that they could be IR'd at any time
Mucky Tundra (8-Aug) : *had to be IRed at 53
Mucky Tundra (8-Aug) : beast, I thought the designate return from IR players had to be IR at cutdowns to 53, not before
beast (8-Aug) : It's a brand new rule, either last season or this season, prior, all pre-season IRs were done for the season
beast (8-Aug) : But the Packers would have to use one for their return from IR spots on him, when they cut down to 53.
beast (8-Aug) : I think the NFL recently changed the IR rules, so maybe the season might not be over for OL Glover.
Zero2Cool (8-Aug) : Packers star Howton, first NFLPA prez, dies at 95 😔
dfosterf (8-Aug) : Apparently it is too complicated for several to follow your simple instructions, but I digress
dfosterf (8-Aug) : Zero- Did you see what I posted about Voice of Reason and his wife? She posted over at fleaflicker that they are both "In"
Zero2Cool (7-Aug) : Well, not crazy, it makes sense. Crazy I didn't notice/find it earlier
Zero2Cool (7-Aug) : it's crazy how one stored procedure to get data bogged everything down for speed here
dfosterf (7-Aug) : to herd cats or goldfish without a bowl. They reminded me of the annual assembly of our fantasy league
dfosterf (7-Aug) : out on a field trip, outfitting them with little yellow smocks. Most of the little folk were well behaved, but several were like trying
dfosterf (7-Aug) : Yesterday my wife and I spent the afternoon on the waterfront here in Alexandria, Va. A daycare company took about 15 three/four year olds
wpr (7-Aug) : seems faster. yay
dfosterf (7-Aug) : Wife of reason posted on the in/out thread on fleaflicker that both she and vor are in
Zero2Cool (7-Aug) : This page was generated in 0.135 seconds.
Mucky Tundra (7-Aug) : Tbh, I can never tell the difference in speed unless it's completely shitting the bed
Zero2Cool (7-Aug) : Sure does feel like site is more snappy
Zero2Cool (6-Aug) : I thought that was the Lions OL
Mucky Tundra (6-Aug) : Travis Glover placed on IR; seasons over for him
Zero2Cool (6-Aug) : found bad sql in database, maybe site faster now?
dfosterf (5-Aug) : I'm going to call that a good move.
Zero2Cool (4-Aug) : Packers sign CB Corey Ballentine
Zero2Cool (4-Aug) : I'm not sure how to kill the draft order just yet so it's not so confusing.
Mucky Tundra (4-Aug) : *to be able
Mucky Tundra (4-Aug) : and because it's not a dynasty league (which makes a lot more sense to be ability to trade picks)
Mucky Tundra (4-Aug) : Oh I know; I was just exploring and it blew my mind that you could trade picks because of the whole reordering thing
Mucky Tundra (4-Aug) : Zero, I think I preferred my offer: your 1st for my 15th rounder
Zero2Cool (4-Aug) : Keep in mind, we do a draft reorder once all members locked in
Zero2Cool (4-Aug) : You can have my 12th Rd for your 2nd round
Mucky Tundra (4-Aug) : Hey i didn't know we could trade picks in fantasy
Mucky Tundra (3-Aug) : Update: Rock has tried a cheese curd, promises it's not his last
Zero2Cool (3-Aug) : watch it!! lol
Mucky Tundra (3-Aug) : you're right, we never did leave, the site just went down :P
Mucky Tundra (3-Aug) : Rock claims to have never eaten a cheese curd
Zero2Cool (3-Aug) : We did not leave.
Mucky Tundra (3-Aug) : Family Night! WE ARE SO BACK!
Mucky Tundra (2-Aug) : To this day, I'm still miffed about his 4 TD game against Dallas on Thanksgiving going to waste
Martha Careful (2-Aug) : Congratulations Sterling Sharpe. He was terrific and I loved watching him play.
beast (2-Aug) : I believe it's technically against the CBA rules, but Jerry just calls it a simple unofficial chat... and somehow gets away with it.
beast (2-Aug) : Jerry Jones is infamous for ̶n̶e̶g̶o̶t̶i̶a̶t̶i̶n̶g̶ chatting with players one on one... and going around the agent.
Mucky Tundra (1-Aug) : Oo just saw a blurb saying that Dallas negotiated directly with Parsons and not through his agent
Mucky Tundra (1-Aug) : I assumed that both guys will get paid, just a matter of when or how we get there
Zero2Cool (1-Aug) : McLaurin nor Micah going anywhere. They will get money
Mucky Tundra (1-Aug) : the Synder years or do they take care of one of their own?
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