Mucky Tundra
2 years ago

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We have the Play of the Day, the Player of the Day, Jordan Love's Day and much more from Thursday at Green Bay Packers training camp.

Continue Reading @ Sports Illustrated 

Sports Illustrated wrote:



Was reading tweets from those at the practice earlier and they had nothing but praise for Love. Talking about how good he was throwing the ball, putting some balls on a rope, on target, etc compared to Day 1. Then I read the article and was surprised to see he did worse from a statistical standpoint (which can always be deceiving whether in training camp or a real game). Bummed to see Wicks already injured with a concussion (esp when he had some good blocking in the run game yesterday). Jaire looking like he's already in season form. That's also two days in a row were Musgrave has laid an egg in blocking, yesterday Devonte Wyatt blew by him no problem for a sack and today Smith manhandled him on a run play (can we get Marcedes Lewis in as a blocking coach?) Also, Jayden Reed had some nice plays: 




Love hits Watson for a TD, Sul missed it by a split second and took out his frustration on a trashcan


Under Construction!
buckeyepackfan
2 years ago
89 still available.
I read where ML has no problem bringing back Lewis.
Rookie TE's have the most thrown at them than any other position except QB.

Big Dog wants to play, Gute probably just doing some evaluation.

Year 18 in Green Bay is still onthe table.
I was addicted to The Hokey Pokey, but I turned myself around!
beast
2 years ago
​​I've heard some suggesting that Big B is going to be in trouble with the Packers for this, as supposedly they don't care if you film/post individual drills, but they don't want you filming/posting full team plays.

Wicks: That's what happens when a QB throws the ball over the middle against a real thumper, QB supposedly lead him into S Gaines which has the nickname "Thump" for a reason. And Wicks got a concussion for it.

​​​​​Musgrave is a very large WR, he's not a blocker, he can go through the motions and look like he has good techniques, but I've never actually seen him execute it smoothly in a game scenario. Also, lots of TEs will tell you, that since the spread offense took over college football, and coaches realized they can't coach everything with the time available, most college teams don't truly teach the TEs to block anymore, at least not at an NFL quality, it's all about the passing game.

TE Lewis: In the NFL it's all about the passing game too, just ask the RBs complaining that some WR3 are being paid more than RB1. And in the last 5 years, Lewis has 582 receiving yards, or about 116.4 yards per year. Yes Lewis' blocking at times is elite, but couldn't you put your #6 OL there is get about the same production? Maybe even better blocking. Also, I forget if it was run or pass blocking, but one of those, Ryan Taylor was scoring similar grades to Lewis on, but the other Lewis was clearly ahead of all Packers TEs on (but Taylor was closest). 

Vet FA: Packers have been saying the youngster need reps, but they're keeping their eye open for the right vet, right price, right time, etc etc. Most have been assuming this towards WR (which I believe it was Gute whom said at the Combine, they want a veteran mind in the locker room for guys to bounce mental idea off of, as sometimes players will go to a vet instead of a coach, and also maybe follow a vet in preparation, or not partying, etc etc. And a few have taken that towards K Crosby, and wondering if he might be back. But I wonder if that could apply to Lewis or not.

Currently Reed is looking like the clear #3 WR, though still early. 



Rookie TE's have the most thrown at them than any other position except QB.

Originally Posted by: buckeyepackfan 



On offense, absolutely.
But if defense is included, then I'd say Safeties have an argument to being #3 behind QBs, as they normally have to play mental chess with the QBs.

But yes, TEs have to learn it all, WR and OL work, and sometimes RB if they're used as an H-back. 

 
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Mucky Tundra
2 years ago

89 still available.
I read where Matt LaFleur has no problem bringing back Lewis.
Rookie TE's have the most thrown at them than any other position except QB.

Big Dog wants to play, Gute probably just doing some evaluation.

Year 18 in Green Bay is still onthe table.

Originally Posted by: buckeyepackfan 



No to Lewis as a player, yes as a blocking coach. Bringing him back at this point just siphons snaps from a younger guy.

​​I've heard some suggesting that Big B is going to be in trouble with the Packers for this, as supposedly they don't care if you film/post individual drills, but they don't want you filming/posting full team plays.

Wicks: That's what happens when a QB throws the ball over the middle against a real thumper, QB supposedly lead him into S Gaines which has the nickname "Thump" for a reason. And Wicks got a concussion for it.

​​​​​Musgrave is a very large WR, he's not a blocker, he can go through the motions and look like he has good techniques, but I've never actually seen him execute it smoothly in a game scenario. Also, lots of TEs will tell you, that since the spread offense took over college football, and coaches realized they can't coach everything with the time available, most college teams don't truly teach the TEs to block anymore, at least not at an NFL quality, it's all about the passing game.

 

Originally Posted by: beast 



Regrading Big B:

😬

I was being 75% hyperbolical/25% serious with Musgrave+his blocking. I know he's going to be a catch first, block second TE but with how much they're planning on trying to run the ball this season, it may lead to some ugly moments this year. From what I put together on the Wyatt play, Musgrave was barely out of his stance when Wyatt was already by him. I'm not even sure it'd qualify for an "ole!" block. 
Under Construction!
beast
2 years ago

No to Lewis as a player, yes as a blocking coach. Bringing him back at this point just siphons snaps from a younger guy.

Originally Posted by: Mucky Tundra 



I think Lewis want to break the record for most years played for a TE, and if he can do it, then he deserves it. But I'm not sure how interested teams are in him, especially at whatever among he wants to play at.



Regrading Big B:


😬

Originally Posted by: Mucky Tundra 



I assume he's just making fun of the situation, and they haven't actually done anything yet (if they going to do anything). But the way some were talking, I was wondering if they might try to ban him from the property for the rest of training camp or something. Or maybe if this becomes a repeated issue.


I was being 75% hyperbolical/25% serious with Musgrave+his blocking. I know he's going to be a catch first, block second TE but with how much they're planning on trying to run the ball this season, it may lead to some ugly moments this year. From what I put together on the Wyatt play, Musgrave was barely out of his stance when Wyatt was already by him. I'm not even sure it'd qualify for an "ole!" block. 

Originally Posted by: Mucky Tundra 


I haven't seen Musgrave block much, but that absolutely sounds like one attempted block I saw on college tape. Musgrave was too focused on getting low, and as he did, he totally telegraph it, and as Musgrave got super low, he simply whiffed the block as the defender was no longer in front of him, he moved to the sod eto avoid the block. And the defender wasn't that quick... Wyatt is extremely quick.l, so I'm sure he could make a telegraphed slow block look horrible.
UserPostedImage
2 years ago
If Musgrave can’t/won’t block, it was a bad pick.  They should have traded up for Mayer.  
Go Packers!!!!
beast
2 years ago

If Musgrave can’t/won’t block, it was a bad pick.  They should have traded up for Mayer.  

Originally Posted by: Martha Careful 



​​​​​Most of the TEs that are considered the best, are receiving TEs, not blocking TEs. Musgrave is a speed and receiving TE and will be judged a lot more on that.

Packers got TE Kraft to be the more well rounded one.

​​​​​​
UserPostedImage
2 years ago
Beast said 

Most of the TEs that are considered the best, are receiving TEs, not blocking TEs. 

Kelsey and Kittle are the best and do both well.
Go Packers!!!!
beast
2 years ago

Beast said Kelsey and Kittle are the best and do both well.

Originally Posted by: Martha Careful 



Kittle is a rare exception, but most other TEs do not do both well, and Kittle either has his worst year ever or worst year since his rookie year in terms of blocking last year.

TE Kelce is rarely asked to pass block, and he's CLEARLY below average run blocker. Maybe he seems good because he's running routes over 70% of the time. But he certainly isn't a good blocker.
​​

From PFF here are the TEs that scored 65 or above in both run and pass blocking last year (and I lowered my normal bar of looking for 70s for this, just to get some names). Name is followed by their overall grade and how many offensive snaps they had last year.

1) Mark Andrews 80.7 847
2) Cole Kmet 67.6 970
3) Dawson Knox 66.5 934
4) Josh Oliver 72.3 561
5) Colby Parkinson 68.1 486
6) Marcedes Lewis 65.6 451
7) Ko Kieft 62.7 271
8) Trevon Wesco 66.7 181


If you want to narrow it down further to which of these TEs in 2022 got a score of 65 in Run blocking, Pass blocking AND Receiving, it's just

1) Mark Andrews 80.7 847
2) Cole Kmet 67.6 970 26
3) Colby Parkinson 68.1 486

This is the first year Kmet has had any of those numbers at 65 and he barely got them over. And the Bills drafted a receiving TE in the 1st round to improve over him.

Parkinson is #3 TE in terms of snap count on his own team.


This idea that you got well rounded TEs in the NFL right now, that can good at all three of the following run block, pass block and receiving, is simply is not true.

You got Kittle and Andrews. All other TEs struggle at one of those three aspects. And NFL teams normally look for and pay the receiving ones.


Edit: Though I will add that I expect to see your suggested pick of TE Michael Mayer on this list in the coming.years, as he's supposed to be the most well rounded TE in a very very long time from the draft. Though some questioned his upside. And he unexpectedly dropped to the 2nd round, so teams didn't like him as much as fans did, and Lions even took receiving TE Sam LaPorta over Mayer. Also a trade up would of cost us the DE Wooden pick or TE Kraft pick.



 
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