DakotaT
13 years ago

How do Chad Clifton and Donald Driver get mentioned when I brought up core players such as Aaron Rodgers, Greg Jennings and Clay Matthews III? Clifton and Driver need their contracts reworked, especially Driver if he makes the final cut.

I understand Cameron Wake is more valuable to the Packers than a 2nd round pick, potentially, but what about the salary he's going to take? You can't spend your dollars twice, which means you sign Cameron Wake instead of ... ??? I think the only of those three mentioned the Packers could get by with out is Greg Jennings.

Again, you cannot spend the salary cap twice. Once you spend 100 million, you don't get to spend another 100 million. Last time I had to explain this was to my ex girlfriend after she wrote out the rent check, then went on a spending spree because "well honey the money was there... i dunno".

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Do you understand the concept of wasting valuable cap money on aging, declining veterans? We don't owe those guys shit. If we cut them, we could use their money to give Wake a contract and have young bookends for our 3-4. After one season nobody will give a fly f@(# about Clifton and Driver. Drives me absolutely up a wall the amount of people that allow themselves to be attached to players in this business.


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zombieslayer
13 years ago

I don't think I said an elite TE is more valuable than an elite pass rushing specialist. Not sure if you were implying that or not, either way, it's clear now.

As the comment above says, Aaron Rodgers can make lesser TE better. I wouldn't object to the proposed trade of a 2nd rounder for Cameron Wake. I'm saying it won't happen because of money. However, trading Finley for Wake is much more likely because you get some cap relief in trading Finley, right? I'm assuming he's on the books for about $7 million when I'm saying this, lol.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



No. You didn't say that and I wasn't implying you did. I was speaking in general. D > O and an elite pass rusher > an elite TE. And yes, we already agree on this so I'm preaching to the choir.

Play2Win - you bring up a great idea. I think your idea is wonderful. I just don't think anyone of the other 31 teams will get rid of a good pass rusher.
My man Donald Driver
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nerdmann
13 years ago
No way Ted deals for someone over the age of 29. Just don't see it happening.
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Zero2Cool
13 years ago

Do you understand the concept of wasting valuable cap money on aging, declining veterans? We don't owe those guys shit. If we cut them, we could use their money to give Wake a contract and have young bookends for our 3-4. After one season nobody will give a fly f@(# about Clifton and Driver. Drives me absolutely up a wall the amount of people that allow themselves to be attached to players in this business.

Originally Posted by: DakotaT 



Again, YOU bring them up, not me and yet you again try to lecture me on their lack of usefulness? I said and will say it again for the slow ... Aaron Rodgers, Clay Matthews III, Greg Jennings are the core I'm referring to, plus B.J. Raji. All need to be extended and trading a 2nd round pick for a guy who's gonna want say, $5+ million per year I just don't see happening. You can't spend the salary cap money twice.

Aaron Rodgers - 2015
Clay Matthews III - 2014
B.J. Raji - 2014
Greg Jennings - 2013

Looks like the only pressing need is Greg Jennings.


To your comment on cutting Donald Driver and Chad Clifton to afford Cameron Wake, you are absolutely correct. I think Chad Clifton is gonna get something like $5.5 million this season... my only concern with cutting him is, do they have a equal or better replacement? I don't know the answer to that, and I don't think anyone does until training camp at the earliest.
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porky88
13 years ago
Talk of trading Jermichael Finley is ridiculous. It’s almost as ridiculous as the mythical figure that is Ted Thompson. 👅

As far as a potential trade. It’s possible. This might be against the grain, but I don’t see the Pack trading down in round one. The Packers already have 12 picks. Adding many more would prove difficult unless they acquire 2013 draft picks.
Wade
  • Wade
  • Veteran Member
13 years ago
I'm still with Kevin on the trade down idea. Porky does make a good point about having too many picks, though, which is why I also expect any trade out of round 1 to be combined with a later trade up in round 3 or 4.

I just think that after the first 20 or so, everyone left that might be picked at 28 is early 2nd round level, and I'm a big believer in value-for-the-spot (or whatever it is called).

(Assuming that there are willing trade partners, of course.)
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Zero2Cool
13 years ago
If the Packers trade out of round one, I'm expecting them to trade back into round two or three. Ted Thompson also believes that the more picks you have, the better chance you have at landing a solid player. So that theory about the Packers don't need as many picks doesn't hold, even though makes complete logical sense.

After all, Ted Thompson would never lie to us.
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porky88
13 years ago
To elaborate further, I believe the Packers could trade up. I don't think they're parting with any players, but I could see a package of picks to move up to Cleveland's other first-round pick. For example, Green Bay’s first, second, and fourth round picks for Cleveland’s No. 22 and one of their threes. From my perspective, that's just as likely as trading back into round two.

Of course, it depends on the player, but if Courtney Upshaw falls by San Diego, then I think the Packers may get aggressive. He's everything they like in their players. He’s smart, well coached, and has a tremendous work ethic. In other words, he’s a gym rat. It’s just something to ponder.
play2win
13 years ago

Talk of trading Jermichael Finley is ridiculous. It’s almost as ridiculous as the mythical figure that is Ted Thompson. 👅

Originally Posted by: porky88 



I disagree. He is a prime, prime, prime candidate to trade. He is a super talent, no question, but, one that would also garner a super return. Under contract, a reasonable contract at that, for two years. Please explain why we couldn't possibly trade him.

As for trading down, I'm not real big on doing that, but I can see where it might help depending on how they have the board slated...

Problem is, we already have 12 picks, and no pass rush from two very important positions, RDE and ROLB. A long as they can cure that ill by trading down, fine. Maybe they trade a R1 this year for an R1 next year. Somehow, with our needs as pressing as they are, and as close as we are to the prize, I think that may be the opposite direction we should trade, unless they have their prime targets to improve our team sitting at 50-100 ish. I kind of doubt that, but who knows?

I guess we can agree we will all be pissed if they whiff, regardless of trading up or down. This is such an important draft for us.
earthquake
13 years ago
No chance that Finley is traded, it isn't a matter of if he has trade value(he does) its a matter of keeping your talented players, Finley is a top 5 TE(even with the drops) and you don't trade away players that good that you've just resigned. Finley is a young guy and his career is still very much on the upswing, he has the potential to be the best TE in the league, you don't give up on guys with the potential to be the best at their position. The Packers were ready to franchise Finley, that says a LOT about what they think of him.

I think its reasonable to say that the Packer's likely see Finely's value as higher than what they would get in a trade for him. You really have to look at the history of trades to understand this, how often do teams trade away young players who are under contract with huge potential? Most trades happen because a player is under performing, a malcontent, has a huge contract, etc etc.

You also have to remember that trading players for picks is extremely risky, on one hand you know exactly what you have with a player, and on the other hand, the draft is a complete crap shoot. Sure I would trade Finley for a draft pick if it meant I would get another Clay Mathews, but any idiot can look smart making draft picks in hindsight, in reality it just doesn't work that way.

I will go out on a limb and say the packers will not trade *any* starter for draft picks. Any trades will be for picks(very likely) or backup/role players(less likely). I think the last player Ted Thompson traded on draft day was Javon Walker(again with the malcontent thing). I also don't see GB making a huge trade up in the first, you have to give up too many high picks to make that happen, moving up past 20 is likely out of the question.

Again nobody is saying Finley doesn't have trade value, or that DE and OLB aren't huge needs, but thinking you can pull off these magical trades and everything will just fall into place isn't realistic at all.
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beast (10-Aug) : Yeah, someone tell the Packers football season has started, seems like they weren't ready for it
Mucky Tundra (10-Aug) : Sooooooo many penalties
Mucky Tundra (10-Aug) : It may only be preseason, but this game is a trip to the dentist
Zero2Cool (10-Aug) : Packers do bad -- FREAK OUT!!!!!!
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dfosterf (10-Aug) : Well that half was fun
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TheKanataThrilla (9-Aug) : NFL Network is broadcasting the game tonight, but not in Canada. Not sure why as no local television is showing the game.
beast (8-Aug) : But the Return from IR designations had to be applied by the 53 man cutdown.
beast (8-Aug) : It's a new rule, so it's not clear, but my understanding was that they could be IR'd at any time
Mucky Tundra (8-Aug) : *had to be IRed at 53
Mucky Tundra (8-Aug) : beast, I thought the designate return from IR players had to be IR at cutdowns to 53, not before
beast (8-Aug) : It's a brand new rule, either last season or this season, prior, all pre-season IRs were done for the season
beast (8-Aug) : But the Packers would have to use one for their return from IR spots on him, when they cut down to 53.
beast (8-Aug) : I think the NFL recently changed the IR rules, so maybe the season might not be over for OL Glover.
Zero2Cool (8-Aug) : Packers star Howton, first NFLPA prez, dies at 95 😔
dfosterf (8-Aug) : Apparently it is too complicated for several to follow your simple instructions, but I digress
dfosterf (8-Aug) : Zero- Did you see what I posted about Voice of Reason and his wife? She posted over at fleaflicker that they are both "In"
Zero2Cool (7-Aug) : Well, not crazy, it makes sense. Crazy I didn't notice/find it earlier
Zero2Cool (7-Aug) : it's crazy how one stored procedure to get data bogged everything down for speed here
dfosterf (7-Aug) : to herd cats or goldfish without a bowl. They reminded me of the annual assembly of our fantasy league
dfosterf (7-Aug) : out on a field trip, outfitting them with little yellow smocks. Most of the little folk were well behaved, but several were like trying
dfosterf (7-Aug) : Yesterday my wife and I spent the afternoon on the waterfront here in Alexandria, Va. A daycare company took about 15 three/four year olds
wpr (7-Aug) : seems faster. yay
dfosterf (7-Aug) : Wife of reason posted on the in/out thread on fleaflicker that both she and vor are in
Zero2Cool (7-Aug) : This page was generated in 0.135 seconds.
Mucky Tundra (7-Aug) : Tbh, I can never tell the difference in speed unless it's completely shitting the bed
Zero2Cool (7-Aug) : Sure does feel like site is more snappy
Zero2Cool (6-Aug) : I thought that was the Lions OL
Mucky Tundra (6-Aug) : Travis Glover placed on IR; seasons over for him
Zero2Cool (6-Aug) : found bad sql in database, maybe site faster now?
dfosterf (5-Aug) : I'm going to call that a good move.
Zero2Cool (4-Aug) : Packers sign CB Corey Ballentine
Zero2Cool (4-Aug) : I'm not sure how to kill the draft order just yet so it's not so confusing.
Mucky Tundra (4-Aug) : *to be able
Mucky Tundra (4-Aug) : and because it's not a dynasty league (which makes a lot more sense to be ability to trade picks)
Mucky Tundra (4-Aug) : Oh I know; I was just exploring and it blew my mind that you could trade picks because of the whole reordering thing
Mucky Tundra (4-Aug) : Zero, I think I preferred my offer: your 1st for my 15th rounder
Zero2Cool (4-Aug) : Keep in mind, we do a draft reorder once all members locked in
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