Pack93z
16 years ago
To answer the question.. he is about middle of the road towards the upper end...

There are teams that consistently draft better and there are a greater number that draft well below.

Not every pick shines.. pure in simple.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
MassPackersFan
16 years ago
Who are considered the best drafting teams?
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Pack93z
16 years ago
I did this once before some time back.. off the top of my head I know Baltimore and Indy were far superior... I know it is in another thread.. I believe this was a topic of conversation last offseason.
"The oranges are dry; the apples are mealy; and the papayas... I don't know what's going on with the papayas!"
Nonstopdrivel
16 years ago
I remember that thread. When I challenged the board to find someone better at drafting than Ted Thompson, Pack93z made a compelling case that Bill Polian is a virtual genius at drafting. While he doesn't hit a home run with every pick, he rarely hits less than a double. It's pretty amazing.
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MassPackersFan
16 years ago
Indianapolis Colts:

2005:
1. Marlin Jackson (CB). 2007 started all 16 games. Injury in '08? 7 games started. 3 INT in 4 years. Okay pick.
2. Kelvin Hayden (CB). Slow starter, but started 2007 and 2008. 3 INT's in each of those years. More production than Jackson. Good pick?
3. Vincent Burns (DE). No idea what happened to him. Not in the NFL.
4. Dylan Gandy (OG). Ditto. No clue.
4. Matt Giordano (S). Mainly a bench player. Started 5 games in 4 years. Decent performance I guess.
5. Jonathan Welsh (DE). No idea. Not in NFL.
5. Robert Hunt (C). No idea. Not in NFL.
5. Tyjuan Hagler (LB). Another spot player for Indy.
6. Dave Rayner (K). All over the place, but still playing.
7. Anthony Davis (RB). No idea. Not in NFL.

2006:
1. Joseph Addai (RB). Made Pro Bowl. Very solid pick. Replaced James and changed up the tempo of that offense.
2. Tim Jennings (CB). Started 75% of games in 2008. About average.
3. Freddie Keiaho (LB). Starting LB in 2008. Over 100 tackles. Don't know much else about him.
5. Michael Toudouze (OG). No clue. No games played in.
6. Charlie Johnson (OT). 2 year starter. Good value in the 6th.
6. Antoine Bethea (DB). Absolute steal.
7. TJ Rushing (CB). Very little action but still on team.


So yeah... lots of players still on the Indy team from '05 and '06. I'm not sure I would say these drafts are way ahead of ours though.
And wow, 6 DB's in two years.
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millertime
16 years ago

Indianapolis Colts:

2005:
1. Marlin Jackson (CB). 2007 started all 16 games. Injury in '08? 7 games started. 3 INT in 4 years. Okay pick.
2. Kelvin Hayden (CB). Slow starter, but started 2007 and 2008. 3 INT's in each of those years. More production than Jackson. Good pick?
3. Vincent Burns (DE). No idea what happened to him. Not in the NFL.
4. Dylan Gandy (OG). Ditto. No clue.
4. Matt Giordano (S). Mainly a bench player. Started 5 games in 4 years. Decent performance I guess.
5. Jonathan Welsh (DE). No idea. Not in NFL.
5. Robert Hunt (C). No idea. Not in NFL.
5. Tyjuan Hagler (LB). Another spot player for Indy.
6. Dave Rayner (K). All over the place, but still playing.
7. Anthony Davis (RB). No idea. Not in NFL.

2006:
1. Joseph Addai (RB). Made Pro Bowl. Very solid pick. Replaced James and changed up the tempo of that offense.
2. Tim Jennings (CB). Started 75% of games in 2008. About average.
3. Freddie Keiaho (LB). Starting LB in 2008. Over 100 tackles. Don't know much else about him.
5. Michael Toudouze (OG). No clue. No games played in.
6. Charlie Johnson (OT). 2 year starter. Good value in the 6th.
6. Antoine Bethea (DB). Absolute steal.
7. TJ Rushing (CB). Very little action but still on team.


So yeah... lots of players still on the Indy team from '05 and '06. I'm not sure I would say these drafts are way ahead of ours though.
And wow, 6 DB's in two years.

"MassPackersFan" wrote:



You also have to look at these teams rosters. The great teams (Indy, Pitts, NE) have had the same coaching staff/front office for YEARS. The reason a lot of there later round picks couldn't make the team is because they already had great players at those positions.

For example, we would say that Poppinga is a good pick because he started for 3 seasons and was only a 4th round pick. But if we're honest, Poppinga has pretty much been a starter by default. There was no one else. Same could probably be said about Spitz, Jolly, and College. They've all started for a couple seasons, but mainly by default. I don't think their play as warranted them as great players at the respective positions, but they are better than the other guys on our roster.
MassPackersFan
16 years ago
I think that's true for both the Packers and Colts. A lot of those Colts players aren't exactly borderline Pro Bowl material. The colts had zero pass D, so they drafted 6 DB's. They clearly had to rework nearly their entire O-line too.
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zombieslayer
16 years ago

I think that's true for both the Packers and Colts. A lot of those Colts players aren't exactly borderline Pro Bowl material. The colts had zero pass D, so they drafted 6 DB's. They clearly had to rework nearly their entire O-line too.

"MassPackersFan" wrote:



So, are the Colts drafting needs instead of BPA?
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MassPackersFan
16 years ago
I have no idea. I'm not a Colts fan and this is the first time I've looked at their draft picks.

But if you're referring to the whole "TT drafts BPA and not for need" thing, I think that's blown far out of proportion. He isn't going to draft 12 safeties because they were the BPA at that pick. All I think he means is that he doesn't, for instance, go into a draft saying "We need DE, LB, OT, and CB, so I'm drafting the best DE in round 1, the best LB in round 2, the best OT and CB in round 3."
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porky88
16 years ago
Ultimately the big picture isn't finished for Ted Thompson yet. Bill Polian has been around along time and you can look at his past drafts and it's impressive, but Ted really only has two drafts to really go off of. The other two right now are unknowns in my opinion.

Polian was GM of both Buffalo and Carolina too.

Thompson has been GM of the Packers as long as Rodgers has been a Packer.

Polian has been GM or President of the Colts as long as Peyton Manning has been a Colt.

Put that into perspective when making comparisons. I think if Thompson is half as good as Polian, Green Bay will be in good shape. Right now nobody really knows if that's the case.

Honestly, it's apples and oranges right now. A few years from now and then the comparisons can really take shape.
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